My recent visit to the IHOP conference in KC
Date: July 04, 2007 06:08AM
Zeuszor,
1)I believe Ernie Gruens criticism was valid, I believe he went straight into the word, and pulled all his concerns from there, I have never disputed that. Although, many people are rehashing much of what has been dealt with, and there are a few things from that era that linger, and are still subject to critcism, which I have already outlined.
2)I believe it has to do a lot with the language used, and things surrounding ths KCP debacle. Also anything Toronto, or Brownsville, great revival came throught these places, unfortunately a lot of crap got picked up along the way.
3)Sad sometimes, because I miss seeing them around. Yes I have sat around with some folks, had a little coffee, or just run into them at the Krogers. And no there are no restrictions on talking to whomever you want, nor are there any repercussions for doing so.
4)I am a lot more critical than you would think, I am a Berean. Yes some people are lieing, SOME, many are misinformed, and THERE ARE VALID CRITICISMS, as with MOST ministries. Unfortunately (?), I do not run into disgruntled IHoPpers as apparently some do. Overall I hear only positive things. I tell everyone about what I do at IHOP, and invite people all the time, I have had exactly 1 person tell me, they did not like IHOP, that's 1. She offered no criticism, by the way. Everything bad I have heard has come over the internet.
I am indeed a critical thinker, I have looked into the doings, in depth, of ANY ministry I have ever been involved with. I have left churches because of their lack of concern for the lost.
I have taken issue with Discern for his lack of transparency, but very strong criticisms, many addressed already in this thread, some I know were not true, and some were doctrinal differences, what things were true, were skewed, or really had little to do with IHoP but could be worded to be an indictment on IHoP. The rest mere speculation, and his attitiude has been one of condescending superiority. I do not feel superior to the rest of the church, I do not think I am some part of an elite endtimes gang who knows more than everybody else. I am called to do what I do, and simply put, to my own Master I stand or fall. Zueszor, there is a difference in concern for someone's soul, and a striving to be right at all costs, rather than righteous. It's not about winning an argument. I am not a young man, I am at least twice the age of your average IHoPper. I have not shut down my critical thinking, I am not typical, of anything. But one thing I am is,... done with this thread,
Titus 3:9-11
avoid foolish controversies and genealogies and arguments and quarrels about the law, because these are unprofitable and useless. 10 Warn a divisive person once, and then warn him a second time. After that, have nothing to do with him. 11 You may be sure that such a man is warped and sinful; he is self-condemned.
IHOP does not need to be defended, if so there would probably be a website, not just a page somewhere. Look, if you really are worried about money, go and ask for the stuff you want from IHOP, I mean come on, what is the purpose of these long drawn out arguments? I present my apology, I am condemned as... to sum it all up; an imbecile, non-thinking hive animal. Now, others present their charges, and are commended as being concise, wise, etc etc, no matter in what manner or spirit they present in. We should consider our own houses. One last thing; I have seen 'dictator' bandied about, NONE of the signatures are there. Personally, I'd love to have any of you come visit, come and hang out for one of my pre-dawn devo's.(Whoops, IHoPese-def. devotional worship time)Grace and Peace to you, with MUCH love and kind affection