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13 years ago
elena
QuoteAlexShalmanI have never met Werner Erhard, nor have I looked at much information about him. I'm here to comment on the paper attached in this thread. So about the paper. I actually do like the theory as it is presented. It's all about separating words, and giving them a clear definition or distinction. I think as human beings, having a clear sense of what something means is impe
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
13 years ago
elena
QuotepwlI am amazed at the fervent hatred you people show to Werner Erhard. What did he ever do to you to deserve such venom? Wow. In the words of another inveterate Landmark debunker: "Have you taken responsibility for how 'us people' show up for you?" Ellen
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
13 years ago
elena
QuoteZorroHere is some info I found on Wiki: LOL. They're still doing the slave-labor thing, only trying to sell it to other pyramid builders or top-heavy corporations that need to keep the workers busy, hard-working, unquestioning, obedient, and stupid. Ellen
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
13 years ago
elena
Hard to believe the chutzpah, the arrogance, the sheer outright gall of these clowns thinking their idiot "theories" deserve to be written and printed in some legitimizing format. I'm amazed they weren't laughed off the stage. "Oversimplifying somewhat, "honoring your word", as we define it, means you either keep your word, or as soon as you know that yo
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
13 years ago
elena
Amen to that, Anticult. I say if it's too personal or too close to home just walk away. Self preservation is more important than attempting to preserve a connection that may never be anything but frustrating if the person has really gotten the Landmark bug up his a**. As an aside, and if they ever do drop the Landmark persona and deprogram themselves, they won't remember you as
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
13 years ago
elena
QuoteeliezeringMy book is an account of 30 years of being a spiritual seeker. It includes critical takes as well as appreciations of many leaders over the years. In the case of Erhard and est, it is a little of both, I was neither a True Believer in any of the gurus or spiritual systems I encountered, but nor was I a pure cynic The chapter on est speaks about both the good things I remember a
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
13 years ago
elena
Landmark "programs" were designed by a narcissist/sociopath. Underneath all, and despite the normal-looking superficial appearance, they are a reflection of his own sick character and personality. Often they provide ammunition or excuse or impetus for people with narcissistic tendencies who might otherwise have been restrained by convention, societal expectations, cultural or religiou
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
13 years ago
elena
QuoteThe AnticultDiana Odasso is engaing in some Landmark advertising propaganda and lies about "Zen". Its the old "start with the Objections" approach, to put the subjects off-balance. The goal? Get the suckers into the tent. Get them to come out to Landmark on Tues night, so the professional can work them over. Man these Landmarkians are sleazy. I agree. This
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
13 years ago
elena
QuotehappyguyI need all the information that I can get on "Mastery In Transformational Training" or M.I.T.T. I am being coerced by my employer to attend the 5 day basic and all of us are very afraid of this process. What tips can you give us for attending this training without being affected by it? Help! Sounds just like every other ~empowerment~ program (programming). Just loo
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
13 years ago
elena
QuoteBlue Pill The point being Landmark Education, like all control obsessed groups, hate these sites because they tell the truth and are a major thorn in their side for their world domination plans. Let's hope the influence of this and other sites continues to grow and kill off this disease. If they don't, to be honest I am more scared of them than any other threat to world peace and
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
13 years ago
elena
Looks like Landmarkers have taken their cues from the scientologists who rushed to bookstores to buy up new copies of L. Ron Hubbard's pulp fiction. They learned early on that they could skew the sales numbers and manipulate the rankings of his trash literature to make him look like a best-selling author. Seems like the Werner lovers are attempting the same thing. Check out these review
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
13 years ago
elena
QuotezastdboxHopefully I am posting this in the correct forum.... My husband has been with his company for 14 years. He has moved up in the ranks, and is now at a VP level. His boss attended Landmark Education aprox. 2 years ago, and invited my husband, myself and our daughter to attend the graduation/introduction ceremony. We did not feel very comfortable with the introduction or the press
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
13 years ago
elena
QuoteLekkieQuotecaligariIt's all about sales. And saying it's just not about sales is part of how it's sold. Ok, so it's about sales and also it's not about sales, but something much larger than that. Does that 'fit'? Werner Erhard was a salesman. He sold used cars and then encyclopedias. Then he trained other salesmen (mostly women) to go out and sell
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
13 years ago
elena
Quoteh_rI think that's why I haven't done well in traditional therapy either -- it sounds too much like est, and I don't trust it. I have had success with body-centered psychotherapy (or Hakomi), which focuses on physical sensation and the emotions and memories those sensations elicit. That way, the information comes from *me* and not from a third party who, no matter how hard they
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
13 years ago
elena
Check out this response from a Landmarker to some wag who posted unflattering comments on Amazon about the DVD "Transformation: The Life and Legacy of Werner Erhard." It's a hoot. Notice how he manoeuvers around what he's found with his attempts to use what he's learned at Landmark to diffuse, dismantle, and dismiss what he's read. This is as good an example of
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
13 years ago
elena
...And just so you know, "Lekkie," we've been down that dismal path before. It's more than thirty years old and fairly well trod by now. Here's "Guy," a few years back, being nice to an intellectually challenged newish Landmark enthusiast on alt.fan.landmark: Aug 20 2002, 4:12 am Newsgroups: alt.fan.landmark From: Guy <guyfaw...@parlia.com>
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
13 years ago
elena
QuoteLekkie All you are doing here is pissing on an organization that hasn't done anything to you personally. As I understand it, they even offered that you go through the Forum yourself so that you can see "what it is". You refused. Therefore, at best, you have an approximation of what it might be - and it's anything BUT what you think it is - I can only tell you that mu
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
13 years ago
elena
Quoteh_rHello-- As you are probably well-aware, est is the precursor to the Forum and Landmark. Back in the late 70s and early 80s, my entire family was est. I grew up steeped in it, though I never (thanks to my rational mom -- my parents were divorced and dad's was the est side) actually "did" the training. I participated in and assisted at several workshops. I'm looki
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
13 years ago
elena
QuoteVegiegardenerHello Is 'finished' an LE expression for 'dieing'? As in, "she's finished" meaning "she has died". I heard this, said to a child, who was asking about their grandparent- it just gob-smacked me..... Vegie gardener Don't know about "finished," as a code word or jargon usage, but I'm wondering if they maybe
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
13 years ago
elena
Her words echo Landmark and scientology. They like to go around ~creating~ things. -- "It has allowed me to create things I wasn't able to create before, like Strong Families, Strong Future," she said, referring to the centerpiece initiative of her administration. "I go looking for something that will get me thinking outside the box." In addition to the $1,500
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
13 years ago
elena
QuotenotinitMy new boss is sending our entire boss to Contegrity's "Essence of Leadership" training next week. Does anyone know anything about this and what I might expect? Sounds like another clone of Landmark/est. There isn't a dime's worth of difference between most of these copy-cats. Ellen Borderland Friday, July 11, 2003 Briones trip rekindle
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
13 years ago
elena
QuoteDone With Them "Because we can create something from nothing!" "We invented it from nothing!" "We take a stand for creating something out of nothing!" Silliest thing is, they (he) copied this pretty much verbatim from L. Ron Hubbard, even so far as to call him(self) ~Source,~ as in "A Source Creates Something From Nothing." QuoteFo
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
13 years ago
elena
QuoteMartinBraun Anyway, to 'jsmiami': I do think that there is SOME kind of perceived benefit to these courses, if not people wouldn't initially continue attending, or become co-dependent on it later. My analogy towards this is "There's nothing inherently wrong with the CANDY that a child molester uses to lure children with, it's the way he utilizes it and his ult
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
13 years ago
elena
It is so odd to contemplate the effects that est and Werner Erhard had on the town of Aspen over time. One wonders how the drama played out in the lives of the people who lived there and, by extrapolation, how the influence was expressed in a larger sense. I'd love to see some sociological study. One thing I guess you could look at is the life of John Denver. As Werner's biggest fan
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
13 years ago
elena
QuotewayfarerThanks to all the articles on culteducation.com and elsewhere I changed my mind and won't be signing up for the Landmark Forum. I have better things to spend $500 on than getting sucked into a group whose main purpose appears to be to lure people into a perpetual cycle of dependence on Landmark. This is the main impression I get about them from the positive and negative arti
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
13 years ago
elena
Hey Nettie, Sounds like you could use a laugh. Did you happen to see my Landilove column on alt.fan.landmark? (Exorcised a lot of demons with that one.) Here's a link, if not. Ellen
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
13 years ago
elena
Hi Nettie, I have recently been diagnosed with an incurable disease that will bring about a miserable end with little relief from excruciating pain. In addition, and because I foolishly gave my children their inheritances early, they've distanced themselves and want nothing to do with me. My two ex-spouses are writing about me to the tabloids as I am quite well known and they can make s
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
13 years ago
elena
QuoteHope I recall my FL, Lonnie Mac Laughlin, explaining that the children's forum was much shorter because, unlike adults, they don't argue, they pay attention, and have much more integrity than we do. They do the CF in half the time and then the kids go and share it with their parents. What a great way to advertise another seminar while at the same time humiliating your audienc
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
13 years ago
elena
Quotenettie “I got that” is a standard Forum leader response that proves that this “pragmatist” tries to imitate a forum leader without knowing it – I’ve been there myself – I remember that I did the same thing – imitating forum leader Grace Pampus. She was using the phrase “I will kill you” when a person during the forum didn’t comply with the rules. The meaning of it was that she would coac
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
13 years ago
elena
QuoteThe Shadow Good point Ellen, and as i read this just now, an image came to mind, that of the slaves in the cotton fields of the "old South" - indeed, that is how lazy people make lots of money, from the blood, sweat and tears of SLAVE LABOUR. regards, Shad Covert influence, persuasion tactics, and such things as indoctrination programs and propaganda have replaced whips
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
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