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8 years ago
suenam
Thank you much for your insightful posts Thomas, for me this raises at least one important issue, QuoteThomasKent 2) I thought he was very right-wing, in fact an extremist. Dzongsar Khyentse Rinpoche once said to us 'If you want an example of a Buddhist fundamentalist, that is Lama Ole'. I did ask a high lama, unfortunately I forget whom, whether it was OK to attend Lama Ole'
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"
8 years ago
suenam
QuoteAlexander Nevsky...For the purpose of clarification; Dublin sangha has only one Irish member. The rest are non-Irish. What was the real involvement of British teachers, including Peter Malinowski, in the situation there? Malinowski was born in Germany and has Polish ancestry. I'm curious when you say, "The rest are non-Irish", are they all by any chance from the same countr
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"
9 years ago
suenam
QuoteSteveLpool That said, his comments on the treatment of women in some Muslim countries are often accurate. Women may feel that the wearing of the burka is their own free choice but the actual suggestion that women cover themselves is a male idea. I don't think women should be made to feel that they should cover themselves to such a degree so as not to be a distraction or stir feelings of
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"
9 years ago
suenam
One example of Karma in action would be the progressive development of a phobia, where someone starts to completely avoid the event itself and instead responds only to the word, for example to the word "spider", which can trigger an extremely anxious response merely to the concept rather than to the encounter with the thing itself. This makes me wonder if Ole has ever met and spoken
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"
9 years ago
suenam
On a relative level there are myriad causes. Many of the causes of the situation in Africa and the Middle East would seem to involve poorly judged interference from the more developed countries. On a Dharmic level, the only real poverty is being unable to learn and practice the Dharma (obviously food, shelter, and the basics for life come into this). The idea is to work for the enlightenment o
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"
9 years ago
suenam
Quotecorboy 'And if interpretation (such as Oles teaching that the poor lived bad lives and are therefore born poor in this life)does not suffice to make a doctrine discursively acceptable, or at least plausible......then let us regard this doctrine as appertaining only to the inner most world of yoga, of meditation, and as having no bearing on our natural world. I was actually suggesting
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"
9 years ago
suenam
Thank you much Sunshine. The phrase you use reveals exactly the confusion that I have been contemplating these past few weeks... Quotesunshine came softly ...utterly devoted (read: utterly blind and able to pass off many bizarre and troubling behaviours with a kind of "highest-view" white out). On the one hand there is the Vajrayana (diamond vehicle) idea of a "pure view"
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"
9 years ago
suenam
Yes Kate, while this seems to be true, ole's example also sends out ripples throughout the entire organisation - to quote steve james' response to this thread, "I don't need to promote my own importance, they are doing it for me." It seems that egotism and an obssession with status permeates the entire DWB project.
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"
9 years ago
suenam
Thanks Fresh, I agree completely. This approach to conflict resolution (or lack of it) seems to be mirrored on a micro level too, as with some of the stories earlier in this thread... Thanks also to SebaT, you make some very good points. Firstly, to clarify, I think we wrote about DWB being more of a "personality cult" than some of the more sinister types of cult that exist. Stev
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"
9 years ago
suenam
...thinking on that reminds me of the sheer weight of generalisations that Ole Nydahl makes in his talks; men are like this, women are like that, Christians, Jews, Moslems all get the Nydahl treatment, and this is done on the grossest level of pigeonholing other groups. I've even noticed some of the travelling teachers copying this behaviour. It seems like a way of influencing the group b
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"
9 years ago
suenam
QuotejahWhat is Ole and DWB really talking about, I wonder. Is it that many European countries have botched the immigration process by not insuring there is adequate education, services, language training and cultural acclimation in general? Or is it that European Moslems are politically organized and "threatening" to import fundamentalist cultural practices? Or is it the relig
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"
9 years ago
suenam
Quoteoamoamwhat about talking about oslo and ole instead if taking this so literally ? I think we've established the level of denial that exists in Ole's thinking and his organistion as a whole, similar to the right-wing politcians who sent their sympathy to Norway as if they failed to realise that they had more in common with the perpetrator than with those targeted. It's qui
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"
9 years ago
suenam
It is unsual for us in the west these days to lose the separation between religion and politics. The Dalai Lama straddles this divide, but is very mindful in his comments - he seems centred. Ole Nydahl on the other hand tells us that he has a politcal aspect and a spiritual one (and a personal, sexual one) which are entirely separate. He seems divided, and the radically different and contra
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"
9 years ago
suenam
It would seem as if some DWB centres are more prone than others, particularly the larger ones in big cities. My observation is that these "oddities and problems with Ole" seem to get reproduced in some individuals, especially those higher up in the organisation, and that this has an effect on the group as a whole. I also think that some individuals are more susceptible than others, a
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"
9 years ago
suenam
Hi Sulmaya, You say you wouldn't accept Ole as a guru but on the other hand that the teachings are sound - how is it possible to separate these in the real world? (Conceptually, one may see the teachings as being pure and I have no doubt that the Karma Kagyu lineage is sound, however I can't see how one can separate the teachings themselves from the transmission of them in the mir
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"
9 years ago
suenam
Steve, I agree 100%. I would add that it seems the same thing applies not only to the issue of Ole's sexual relations, but also in regard to other issues where noble ideals seems to give way to subjective judgements, such as in regard to racial issues in the face of the concept of unconditional compassion. Subjective judgements such as guilty/innocent, good boy/bad boy, deserving/undeser
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"
9 years ago
suenam
QuoteSteveLpoolHis affairs with his students aren’t mere hearsay. I never actually witnessed Nydahl having sex with one of his students so of course I can never be 100% sure that the stories are true. Enough people commented on his affairs and their apparent lack of an effect on his wife to suggest that there is some truth in the rumours. I did see him with his tongue down a young lady’s throat i
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"
9 years ago
suenam
QuoteSulmaya ...he reminds me of my grandfather... I agree completely, in fact I said something very similar in one of my first posts. I remember my own grandfather was also quite intolerant of people with non-white skin and we loved him nonetheless. This was relatively harmless in the context of his own home, but had he got on a stage and voiced those opinions to hundreds of people in the c
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"
9 years ago
suenam
QuoteSulmaya A completely different thing is spreading general hatred towards an entire group of people. At all talks I have gone to with Nydahl, he has promoted complete non-tolerance and non-compassion for all people of middle-eastern origin. He has even made statements such as: 'If there is a mosque in your neighborhood, put mirrors facing outwards on your windows, in order to reflect the
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"
9 years ago
suenam
Quotecorboy'You need to meditate' or 'You're not meditating' Those are both classic though stopping statements. And carry an element of shaming in them as well. One can reply 'You dont know me well enough to presume saying such a thing.' But this is a self serving group. Well strangely enough what happened was that I went to meditate for 30 minute
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"
9 years ago
suenam
Thanks Steve, while I agree that all organisations face this dilemma to some extent, I do think that some fair better than others. It would depend upon the degree to which the interests of the organisation overlap with it's aims. I also think that some organistions are more "outward-facing" than others, in the case of DWB the organisation appears to be fully self-contained, and as
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"
9 years ago
suenam
Some groups are more supportive than others, and some have a greater degree of tolerance. Some groups even welcome diversity and promote individual growth. Earlier posts have told of how many DWB members were uncomfortable revealing their true feelings, doubts, or questions, and it seems as if the conditional nature of DWB membership would make them quite narrow in this respect. This idea o
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"
9 years ago
suenam
QuoteSteveLpoolSome members of DWB display behaviour which I consider “cultish”. Some members but not all. I wish to make that clear to anyone who chances across this forum. Again, these are just my own personal observations and experiences but I think that the people I met who were/are “jockeying” for positions of influence within DWB certainly give DWB the cultish flavour I experienced. One
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"
9 years ago
suenam
I find it quite interesting that the head of the London sangha would refer to others' experiences written about on this thread as "BS", that certainly would explain the cult-like aspect of DWB, the "for us or against us" sort of absolutist thinking... and if you aren't with them it would seem they have to find some way to dismiss you without really considering that t
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"
9 years ago
suenam
...as a background to this, perhaps I should explain... the term "good impressions" comes at the end of the DWB meditation where one dedicates the practice to ALL sentient beings. Every other Lama I have heard emphasises this point, talking about how terrorists may well be even more in need of such good wishes than their victims. They talk about the idea that to judge others a
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"
9 years ago
suenam
hi Sceptic Watcher, that's a valid point. Tbh my comment was meant as a light hearted poke at DWB pomposity... There is a world of difference between the tsog puja you mention (which I have done and which is not practiced by DWB) and the excessive partying behaviour I have witnessed first hand. The Bond theme is also kind of ironic given that Ole Nydahl is himself a self-fictionalised
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"
9 years ago
suenam
very nice - celebrating Buddhism with a meat laden full English breakfast washed down with strong alcohol, dressed as England's best known womanising assassin. Keep those good impressions coming.
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"
9 years ago
suenam
...as far as real Buddhism goes, saying that DWB is a social club would seem about right, but when you add the other aspects into the mix... firstly, they are a social club with rather sectarian right-wing reactionary tendencies, and secondly, because or the "religious" aspect of the club, they are tending towards fanatacism. Adding these three things together shows how much mo
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"
9 years ago
suenam
I love the Milwall metaphor John, very amusing. Steve's story about "powerfields" really shows the new-age and non-Buddhist aspect of DWB. As I understand it, a powerfield is generated by a mantra... It is much like picking up a guitar and playing a well known Beatles song... no one would claim that they had somehow tapped into the powerfield of the beatles, although the idea
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"
9 years ago
suenam
to dariusb... I see the purpose of this forum to provide insight into our experiences which may help anyone struggling with DWB who is currently a member, and to provide information to anyone considering joining. Hopefully any DWB members reading this will at least ask certain questions and perhaps develop a more critical awareness. Given the lack of debate within DWB, it seems important to ha
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"
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