A report from the field about what happened to me last night. I can't believe it. I went to the IHOP conference in town to hear this Mike Bickle guy speak, you know, hear what he had to say from his own mouth. I am visiting a friend and coming from out of town and had no idea about the conference this week. Things started out with some spirited praise and worship. Singing, dancing, people praying over each other, and all that. Sometimes I enjoy that ecstatic overflow-type worship, sometimes a more quiet, intimate, contemplative mode. Well, I had a small vial of fragrant spikenard anointing oil with me (sometimes I wear it just because it smells nice) and felt led by the Spirit at a certain point to begin praying with the people nearby and pulled out my vial of oil and began anointing them. I was wearing a shirt that says Soy borracho y me importa madre which is Spanish slang for something like, I'm drunk and I don't give a damn. Because, you know, I AM drunk (in the Spirit) and I DON'T give a damn (about what others may think of that statement, nor how they will judge me on the basis of that). Sometimes I dress certain ways in churches just to see what the people there are made of, to challenge their idolatries. To shake up their churchy sensibilities. Also I was wearing a loop of thick Hare Krsna tulasi prayer beads. Jeans and sandals too. Nothing too outrageous.
What happened next was a real milestone in my walk. I have never come out of a church environment feeling more judged and abused than I did tonight. Before I knew it, I was surrounded by security guards and being escorted outside. I honestly had no idea what I'd done wrong and asked the guards what the problem was. Well, they interrogated me right there in the parking lot: who are you, what is your name, where did you get the oil, show me some ID, what are you doing here, what does your shirt say. I was polite and mature about the situation and just plain had no idea what I'd done wrong. They said they saw me praying with and anointing some people and that as I was not on an authorized IHOP prayer team I had no business praying over people in their church. They gave me the third degree over this deal and when I asked them why they were so accusatory, dealing with me like I was a criminal, and let them know in a polite fashion (mind you, I never raised my voice, never cursed, or anything like that, I simply asked them what I had done wrong and exactly what they were accusing me of) they got quite agitated and told me to leave or they were going to call the police and have me put under arrest. I was like Arrest me for what? Praying with people? See, he said that in IHOP the only people authorized to pray for others are the official IHOP prayer warriors and they are identified by a very visible ID badge that they wear. Huh?? That's like saying that you're only a part of the body of Christ if you're wearing your ID badge, and everybody else is suspect. They treated me like a tresspasser and a criminal because I was anointing people with oil and praying with them as I was led by the Spirit. What kind of a church is that?? So no, never will I set foot on IHOP property again and will shake the dust of that end-time Uber-cult off my feet. They really seem to believe that they are God's specially anointed end-time Joel's Army . THEY ACTUALLY ASKED ME TO LEAVE AND THREATENED TO HAVE ME ARRESTED. I LEFT WONDERING WHAT THE HELL I DID WRONG. PARDON MY LANGUAGE. THAT WAS THE MOST OVERTLY ABUSIVE SPIRITUAL EXPERIENCE OF MY LIFE. WHAT KIND OF CHURCH IS IT WHERE YOU CAN'T PRAY WITH PEOPLE UNLESS YOU ARE WEARING AN AUTHORIZATION BADGE?? WHAT EXACTLY DID THEY THINK I WAS TRYING TO DO? HOW PARANOID ARE THESE PEOPLE?? That's enough to make a weaker believer swear off church forever. How insulting. How presumptuous those people were. Talk about a spirit of elitism.
Bickle is teaching his people that God is raising up Joel's Army through His training program called IHOP and that one day they will literally take over the world for Jesus, because they (IHOP and it's graduates) are the End-Time Forerunners that will usher in Our Lord's Second Coming. I went to an IHOP conference last night and heard it from his own mouth. It’s also in a lot of recordings of his teaching. This is the most spiritually sick thing I have ever seen and heard to sit through. He teaches IHOP that THEY are God's Army (Joel's Army), and that he (Bickle) is the General. I am spooked beyond words. This is not something I would recommend to anybody under ANY circumstances. Talk about a spirit of elitism. Sheesh. And then when I was praying over people during Praise and Worship I was told to leave the property or they's have me arrested. Is this a club, or a church?
The way the ministry was represented in that circumstance absolutely and 100% validated for me that which I have heard from others concerning IHOP in the past: namely, that IHOP is an intensely controlling and cultish church that is drunk on a spirit of spiritual superiority, like they think they're God's elite . The way they handled me tonight, the way they represented the ministry to a visitor, completely lived up to the rumors I'd heard. I will never come back on IHOP ground again, and will never under any circumstances recommend IHOP to anyone I know. In fact, I'll tell them IHOP REALLY IS a cult. At least using the abusive way I was treated as an example. I'd actually like to hear from Mike Bickle himself on this.
Praise Him In a spirit of love I exhort you, IHOPpers, repent of your spiritual country-club elitist mentality. It's sad that this is my one and only experience with IHOP, and I came away feeling like a dog who's been hit over the head for misbehaving. Just because I was praying over and anointing people with my spikenard oil? I may not be on staff at IHOP nor a graduate of FSM, but I am a servant of the Most High God too and will NEVER EVER go back again.
To all of you “judge not” type folks who have a problem with my warning people about groups like this I say: if I knew there were some land mines in a path that you were walking down, and one wrong step could result in your being hurt or killed, it would be my responsibility to warn you, “Hey, there’s a mine there!” or else the blood (so to speak) would be on my hands if you got hurt because I didn’t warn you. You can listen, or not. Similarly, out there in the churchy world there are a loy of spiritually disastrous land-mines of churches that you may get seriously wounded in if somebody doesn’t warn you. I am just saying, don’t step there! Danger! In Love,

Zeuszor, the intrepid traveler

Anybody else know anything about his bunch?

Quote
zeuszor
Anybody else know anything about his bunch?

nope, we have a Waffle House, but no International House of Pancakes. now i'm glad we don't.

Ha. Ha. :-)

IHOP is the International House of Prayer, not the pancake house.
Rootie-tootie, these guys are fruity....

I've heard plenty Mike Bickle, and I have some friends who've been involved with shooling at IHOP, and you are definately distorting the mans message to justify your anger.

There are a growing number of charismatic churches today who believe in spiritual authority. This kind of swept through the charismatic scene with John Bevere's teachings in series' like Under Cover and Fear of the Lord. Not much differant here. A lot of people are realizing the biblical call to order in the church. Quite basically charismatics had gone off the deep end into mysticism and had lost foundation in what is biblical.

In a church like Bickles, with the hooting and hollering, and the over spiritual people, and the tendancy of churches like that to allow very un-biblical things into it's congregation... I'm sure IHOP feels the need tokeep certain restrictions. The vinyard in Atlanta (blood n fire) was full of lots of liberty and freedom and anyone could pray for anyone, but some very sick things started going on and it got way out of line.

I wouldn't put the rules on 1 on 1 prayer that far in my congregation, but it is not my church, and I have not been given the authority from God on that one.

Keep in mind you brought it on yourself. Hare Krishnas are a well known dangerous cult as far as christians are concerned, and the people of a biblically sound church would not, and should not (under their own system of beliefs) let one of them pray for or influence their sheep.

The bible calls outsiders amongst the flock wolves in sheeps clothing, implying that it is the pastors duty to spot the wolves, and remove them.

The IHOP teaching is based on Mike Bickle... it is based on Jesus, and it IS very radical, but there is sound biblical reason for every doctrine i've ever heard out of that place. That they do not excommunicate the rest of the body. That they believe mostly in a 'beyond the denomination' sense of
church unity. That the "Joels army" you're talking about is any and every christian believer in any denomination who will put aside the things of the world and live for christ and prepare themselves and others for His coming. The one coming back in the end times (which they believe is very soon) to be the general and judge the unbelievers is Christ. Biblically... if you want to get into some escatology... they are right about a lot of end times theology. The King coming into the earth and us meeting him in the sky to welcome him, get glorified bodies, and follow him down for judgement on the world.

This is in your bible.

Another thing is your attitude. If you were walking in the fruit of the spirit , you would not have the attitude you clearly have towards IHOP. Even if they were off on this, it is their church, and their authority to run it is based on what they heard from God. You are not their pastor, you can not make better descisions for that church. If they are wrong, and out of God's will, it will not be you who does anything to fix or stop them.

Defensive, hurt, full of angst, clearly rejected and hurt by it... these things fueled that post. You shift the blame for you bieng kicked out of a church where you defied the rules in place by the authority there, onto them. You wore the beads to test their idolatries.... but it looks like they tested yours instead. If its still about everyone else and what they did wrong, you've got a lot of spiritual growth to do.
I'm very sorry but that is not a mature, humble attitude coming from a person who trusts in God.

Please don't go sewing seeds of rebellion and distorting the words of people's teachings to justify that rebellion. It would be better to have a millstone hung around your neck and be cast into the sea, quite frankly...

Unfortunately, your experience is representative of a general social trend in the United States.... toward a paranoid, arrogant, narrow minded, authoritarian style.... I see this in greater and lesser degrees everywhere... some of this is a response to 9/11 and an obsession with an external enemy... never mind the old adage from the cartoon... "we have met the enemy and he is us !" .... like many cults, and like many LGATs,[b:4da53d01c6] a power craving megalomanic surrounds himself with passive sheep [/b:4da53d01c6] (you can read Arthur Deikman's writings for a lengthy analysis) and bases his authority on a mysterious divinity that for some reason cannot be explained but must be "felt" .... for some other reason this mysterious divinty requires unquestioning submission and lots of money... anything, ANYTHING that might cause the barest flicker of dissent, in this case you yourself, must be dispatched forthwith lest that old devil, doubt, begins to seep into their church....[b:4da53d01c6] you, to their tiny minds represent doubt, and to them, doubt is the most fundamental of all sins.... [/b:4da53d01c6]

First of all, I am not distorting anything. Have you heard the "Encountering Jesus" series? It is available in audio only, and as there is no print copy of those particular teachings I cannot quote it in print here. Secondly, so what if I was wearing some wooden beads? Shoot, the only person that knew they were KRSNA beads was me. Even if I were a witch or something, trying to summon demons, I would be powerless against those who are in Christ and under the blood. Third, OK, I did break the rules of their church but didn't realize it at the time. I was in Rome and didn't do as the Romans were, so they threatened to call the cops. I repent of exersing my freedom in the Spirit to pray with and over people. I repent of my individuality and freedom of thought. I repent of the anger and self righteous indignation I feel after having been slapped around, so to speak, at church the other night. I all ask of you brother, is kindly please read the Book of James. It plainly says not to judge people for how they are dressed in church. At least, that's what my Bible says.

Look... you walked into the wrong neighborhood wearing the wrong colors... if this were Compton, it would be like walking into Crip territory wearing Blood colors... same basic human dynamic... I once had some times with the Scientologists at one of their centers and when I mentioned Werner Erhard and [i:d4d3484b41] est [/i:d4d3484b41] they just freaked out... another time I was at a live Tony Robbins event, and Tony has a pretty formidable security team in case of whatever... I did everything they said, when they said do it... jump up and down and holler [b:d4d3484b41] YES YES YES...[/b:d4d3484b41] never made any gestures, followed the program, but I didn't look right... I remained too conscious or something, I wasn't going into trance like everybody else... to obviously [i:d4d3484b41] awake [/i:d4d3484b41] I s'poze... so they had a big heavy dude security guard standing right next to me non-stop, and they rotated about every hour so the tired guard could sit down and rest his feet... I kept bumping this guy every time I was told to dance and wave my arms and I kept apologizing to him... but clearly they had their feelers out for anything that wasn't a tight fit with the Gospel According to St. Tony, so I think this situation is a human universal, whether ghettos, politics, human potential things, tribes, congregations, tupperware parties....[b:d4d3484b41] the external manifestation may vary while the essential form remains consistent... [/b:d4d3484b41]

People from my area are going to KC for more training with this group. I have heard about the 24 hour prayer vigils and great programs for youth, but I have also heard of some strange, 'hidden' beliefs' labeled extreme charismania. I know that there is a connnection with the Toronto Blessing and that Mike Bickle is one of the prophets from that sect. Any information would be appreciate.

It boils down to approval of and reward for conforminty, and disapproval of and punishment for non-conformity.