Also, a quote from Josho:

"I wouldn't put the rules on 1 on 1 prayer that far in my congregation, but it is not my church, and I have not been given the authority from God on that one."

So how do you know that Mike Bickle's authority comes from anyone but Mike Bickle? Because Mike Bickle said so? Judging by the fruit of IHOP that I tasted the other night, I'd say it's pretty rotten.

Oh well. But then, showing individuality and thinking for yourself is a grave sin in these super-Charismaniac circles. (Yawn) All they did was prove my point for me.

They call it "sowing discord" or "being divisive" or some such. It boils down to being punished for resisting giving up your individuality to be come part of the collective mind. It's not hard to understand. Like the Borg, you know, on Star Trek TNG? "Resistance is futile!"

"Please don't go sewing seeds of rebellion and distorting the words of people's teachings to justify that rebellion. It would be better to have a millstone hung around your neck and be cast into the sea, quite frankly..."

There you go trying to use scare tactice in an effort to get me to see things your way. Typical. Yes, if I see something funky going on in a church, it is mandated to me in that same bBile we both love to stand up and say something, boldly, but in love. Bother Josho, I recieve with gladness your exhortation and thank God for it. I have been meditating and praying on this and it occured to me: first off , OK, I'm not Jesus, I'm not John the Baptist, nor am I Paul or some prophet. I am Jesus' disciple, as are you. Jesus is our example in matters of faith, dependance on God, as well as in the area of behavior and conduct (1 Peter 2:21). Now, all of the above, Jesus, John the Baptist, Paul, the Prophets, all at some point or another looked around at what was going on and got pretty irate and started engaging in name-calling! John the Baptist called the Pharisees a "brood of vipers". (Mat. 3:7, Luke 3:7) as did Jesus Himself (Mt 12:34, Mt. 23:33). Jesus saw what was going on in theTemple and started shasing people around with a whip (John 2:15). And let's not forget he "woe unto you" passages in Mt. 23. Paul wasn't afraid to call a false teacher a false teacher, nor a false prophet a false prophet, either. (2 Peter 2:1-3). Not to mention some of the OT Prophet's tirades warning Isreal. And these are just examples I remember just off the top of my head. Paul constantly exhorted the churches to study things out and to speak the truth boldly, but in love (2 Timothy 2:15). So what is wrong with my calling a spade a spade, or a false teacher a false teacher, or an abusive church a synagogue of Satan, or a cult leader a sick, narcissistic snake? I speak the truth boldly, yes, and if I cross the boundary out of speaking it in love, then I repent of that (1 John 4:20). It seems like we both have some baggage we're both carrying around here. Let's reason from the Scriptures together and learn somthing here. We are not enemies. Let's be friends, brothers, and learn and grow together. Please, don't write me off. I refuse to bury my head in the sand and repeat over and over, "Judge not!" In that same Chapter (Matthew 7) Jesus strongly warns us to be on gaurd against falsehood. That's how all these creeps in the Church get away with what they do. It's because bold Christians don't speak up and call it what it is. I speak in love brother. If I step away from the mercy seat and get carried away by my flesh, then of this I repent.
Also, here are some good examples of Paul getting righteously angry, even engaging in making sarcastic remarks, and even calling false teachers out BY NAME in an effort to warn the churches about the snakes in their midst. And that was almost 2000 years ago! How much worse it is now.

1 Cor 4:6-13; 2 Timothy 2:15-18; 1 Timothy 1 18-20

Pretty pointed remarks, huh? More than a bit sarcastic, wouldn't you say? Paul's letters are replete with that pointed sarcasm.

One more thing ;-) What about the command in John to "test the spirits"? Am I out in left field here? If I go to church dressed hippie-style to see how I am recieved, and they threated to have me arrested, then that says more about THEM than about ME.

This is from Easy Rider. I am trying to make a point about exercising your freedom and less free people resenting it, and trying to do away with you for it.


George Hanson: You know, this used to be a helluva good country. I can't understand what's gone wrong with it.
Billy: Man, everybody got chicken, that's what happened. Hey, we can't even get into like, a second-rate hotel, I mean, a second-rate motel, you dig? They think we're gonna cut their throat or somethin'. They're scared, man.
George Hanson: They're not scared of you. They're scared of what you represent to 'em.
Billy: Hey, man. All we represent to them, man, is somebody who needs a haircut.
George Hanson: Oh, no. What you represent to them is freedom.
Billy: What the hell is wrong with freedom? That's what it's all about.
George Hanson: Oh, yeah, that's right. That's what's it's all about, all right. But talkin' about it and bein' it, that's two different things. I mean, it's real hard to be free when you are bought and sold in the marketplace. Of course, don't ever tell anybody that they're not free, 'cause then they're gonna get real busy killin' and maimin' to prove to you that they are. Oh, yeah, they're gonna talk to you, and talk to you, and talk to you about individual freedom. But they see a free individual, it's gonna scare 'em.
Billy: Well, it don't make 'em runnin' scared.
George Hanson: No, it makes 'em dangerous.

Billy later got killed my the rednecks.

I was exercising my freedom in the Spirit, and they were gonna have me arrested.

Hello friend,

I'm from Dallas as well. Interesting about what happened at IHOP.

anton948:

Please read the rules.

This is not a site to debate or discuss religious beliefs.

This thread is about discussing IHOP and its behavior.

Please confine your comments to that.

I apologize if I stepped out of the rules, but it seemed in prior responses that there were much more debates than what I said.