@SelahSelah - You have been echoing my own thoughts and feelings to a ‘T’! Before being involved I felt kind of secluded too in my faith and definitely longed for Jesus to come back. It’s like a ray of hope when you find someone who you believe to be a prophet of God and he tells you Jesus is coming back (which I had already come to the conclusion was the case anyway), you feel so ecstatic and to then to be allowed into a group who all seem to feel the same excitement at the prospect of Jesus’ return… I was so humbled that I would even be invited to attend the studies. Then as you are in the group, your own relationship with God seems to fade to the background until you aren’t even sure how to hear God without Timothy. I would have done anything if I felt God wanted me too also (and really I still will, but now it won’t come from a person telling me so), in fact I was kind of preparing to do just what you mentioned, make a spectacle of myself in the streets trying to win as many souls as I could before Jesus return. That’s the reason I gave my jewelry away was because I was kind of doing what Jesus told the rich man, giving my possessions to the poor and “following him”, it was at the time when we were being told we need to give more and that God would “purge the dross” in us. I thought it was God’s will that I give all my possessions to the poor and quit my job and leave my home and family and live on the streets telling people about Jesus. I gave my jewelry away on a Friday, and on Sunday my intervention began. You can see it as a coincidence, but I wonder if it wasn’t a way of testing my faith kind of like Abraham and Isaac (not that I am comparing myself to Abraham at all!) and once I had determined in my heart to do God’s will no matter what, he stopped me. Or I could just be rationalizing… idk.

I can understand that it would be harder for you to recuperate because you were kicked out, I’m having a hard enough time and I had counseling to get me out. I think all the research you are doing is healthy though, and even more so because of the fact that you didn’t get any counseling to show you these things while you were still in the group. As far as trusting people, believe me I know what you mean, and I think that comes as a result of any type of abuse, the more abused a person is the harder it is to trust. I’m an extremely trusting person by my nature, and that has both helped me and hurt me over the years. It’s helped me to reduce the impact of being hurt by others, but it’s also made me vulnerable to being hurt again, so maybe it’s a balance thing. I also rely a lot more on the Lord now too, because of the same reason of not being able to trust what humans tell me, and I agree in a way that’s kind of for the best anyway I guess, so I’m just learning to trust Him more with whatever ends up happening.

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@SelahSelah - I thought it was God’s will that I give all my possessions to the poor and quit my job and leave my home and family and live on the streets telling people about Jesus. I gave my jewelry away on a Friday, and on Sunday my intervention began. You can see it as a coincidence, but I wonder if it wasn’t a way of testing my faith kind of like Abraham and Isaac (not that I am comparing myself to Abraham at all!) and once I had determined in my heart to do God’s will no matter what, he stopped me. Or I could just be rationalizing… idk.

It is so good to hear from you! Yes, I wanted to quit my job so many times because it interfered with Holy Days. (I anticipated Jesus coming back every Holy Day) I have thought about this too, I do not think it is weird for you to think those things. Sometimes I think like maybe God was trying to teach me a lesson, to not listen to men anymore and seek only Him for myself and diligently search the scriptures and maybe I just had to learn the hard way and start from square one since I am so thick skulled. It sort of reminds me of the verse about sheep knowing His voice and how they won't listen to a stranger (of course when I was in the group I thought it was the opposite and God spoke through the letters) Apparently, I don't have the gift of discernment either.

I agree that you sort of look to Timothy for guidance instead of seeking the Lord yourself, since you have a mainline, Timothy sort of becomes a mediator. You sort of feel like only he can hear from God fluently and everyone else is untrustworthy, including yourself. I am a pretty quiet person by nature and I felt very uncomfortable having to type out our praise, worship, and intimate feelings to God in a chatbox during the studies in front of everyone else. I would question couldn't God hear me Himself, without having to go through Timothy in the skype chatbox? When I see people type personal intimate prayers out on social networks, to me it seems more like they want the praise of men than of God. And this is how I felt having to type my feelings out in front of everyone, I didn't want to be out on the stage like that and I felt like my intimate feelings/prayers should remain between me and God because I wasn't seeking anyone else's approval or glorification.

I think God does test us. I recently was reminded of how Jesus went into the desert to be tempted by the devil, but it says He was led into the desert by the Spirit and not led by the devil. So I dunno, I guess I have thought like maybe God put me in this desert for a reason, like maybe He is using it to make me depend on Him more and realize that I can't do anything by my own merit because it only leads to disappointment and never look to men, but to Him.

Still, I wish I could trust fellowship with other believers, at least without feeling like someone is trying to manipulate me or feeling like the person(s) I fellowship with don't really know what they are talking about, I can't give ear to anything they say even if they are sincere because I fear it is a flawed "doctrine of a demon" and I become judgmental of what they are saying and I become very nauseous. Everyone seems phony or misled to me now, especially preachers.

I've really been trying to figure out what put me in that vulnerable disposition. At the time I was introduced to the letters I was already deeply diving into end-time biblical prophecy, news, and revelations. I think many can relate to that. The letters seemed to have the answers I was looking for regarding the endtimes. Consciously my mind sees some of the red flags that don't quite add up within the group, but subconsciously they are ignored because it's like it honestly seems a lot more merciful for people to be left during a tribulation period to have the fire lit under them so to speak and have their temporary bodies destroyed like the letters teach, than for them to think they were saved and be burned alive with fire and suffer for all eternity like most modern churches teach. To me it had to be one or the other, there was no in-between. I guess it was sort of like I would rather that (the letters doctrine) be true when I look at friends and family members who don't really take God seriously, (plus the promise of Christ's soon return) so it made it a lot easier to cling to.

I felt very guilty at times, like I was demeaning Christ's sacrifice when I tried to merit God's love by my own works (not works of the faith) like "Ok God I accept what your Son did for me on the cross, BUT...now let me do this or this to make myself presentable just in case your sacrifice wasn't enough" I felt pretty crumby like I was telling Him what He did wasn't good enough and I couldn't fully rest in my salvation through His sacrifice alone (something I had done prior to the letters), so I had to keep patching up a sinking boat that would immediately have ten more gaping holes in it as soon as I turned around. I was frantic.

And because it made me doubt my salvation/ relationship with God, it took away my joy and made it hard for me to witness to people on what exactly they had to do to be saved, because I wasn't even sure what I was suppose to do myself by that point. I think that's something I continue to struggle with-assurance. And this was my biggest problem that I faced, it hindered me from confidently sharing Jesus with others, because now I had no idea what to tell them.

I think what was most captivating was the letters gave a certainty and a definite promise of Christ's soon return, no matter what the consequence (I reasoned, if the apostles died for Christ and Christ died for me, then I surely shouldn't complain if I am not taken, even though I did become very depressed that I wasn't going to make the cut and be with Jesus-and I am not a freak for having those feelings because I know others in the group were told they were not ready and were VERY depressed about it too and just not as vocal) , that I put most of my hope into the letters and group (since they inevitably led to Christ's definite return) and then when the rug was pulled out from under me, it was like my world that was already crumbling, had exploded into a million pieces.

I had a pitty party for a while because I couldn't understand why I was singled out and others were flying under the radar with doing the same stuff or worse. It felt like my devotion was questioned if I didn't help spread enough letters when others in the group weren't adding 3000 people to their friendslists either. I wasn't going to put on a mask and pretend like I wasn't terrified and confused with unanswered questions or from being pretty much bullied by certain members. I was told God wouldn't tolerate me sitting on the fence and I was made to feel like any forming doubts of the letters were because I was evil and didn't have ears to hear. Then when I got kicked out, it made me believe God had abandoned me when all I had wanted to do was love Jesus and spread the gospel just like them, it was very spiritually and emotionally damaging.

I am in a constant battle between God's Holiness, and myself. But I am learning to trust that God has not forsaken me or given up on me and I still have hope and love Him, and that He has put me in this desert for a testing and will see me through if I seek His face and draw near to His voice. It's just hard. It's like part of me still really wishes the letters were true so that Jesus would come back and that's probably my weakness. I understand the letters don't have to be true for that to happen, but since I was indoctrinated it is hard to figure out what to believe or why I believe it. I feel like I am constantly oscillating. I feel like someone has taken away a part of me and I want it back. But, I refuse to stay discouraged and lose heart, I will never give up on my relationship with God.

Is this a follower of Lil' Timmy's?

[www.youtube.com]

Apparently the Rapture is in 5 days from this posting...May 21, 2011 (Saturday...at about 6PM ET).

I know Timmy is predicting the End very, very soon so this could be a follower of his. This man claims there will be a mega-earthquake that happens and destroys us all (except for the few TRUE Christians...)

No Sparky, that is Harold Camping, but I have read up on it before. If I understand correctly, they do share a few similarities such as the Holy Spirit being removed from the churches, and to come out of the churches.
[www.jesus-is-savior.com]
[www.equip.org]

But no, the Letters are not affiliated.

Yeah, I'm having difficulty dismissing the letter 'Obama Shall Lead You' as being false. I know Zechariah 14 says God will gather the nations against Jerusalem to divide it, so I know that God is the one who will divide it and Israel may not really have much to do with it at all. Especially if a two state solution (which btw the current Pope is a proponent of) is somehow mandated by the UN in September.


I just can not simply ignore that letter, any thoughts?

SelahSelah:

The letters are the sole creation of Speed Timothy Rathbun and nothing more.

Rathbun writes them, which apparently is his business scheme. He owns a publishing business, which has reported an annual income of $90,000.00.

He uses the letters as a device to deceive and control people.

In this sense they are little more than the "trumpet call" of Tim.

The letters should simply be ignored, other than as evidence of Rathbun's "cult-like" control and manipulation of followers and potential followers.

This thread is not about Israel or politics.

This thread is specifically about the Rathbun group, which is called "The Trumpet Call of God."

Please stay on topic.

SelahSelah,

I'm not really sure what your question is, I am having a hard time remembering what exactly was in that letter but I think you should not read into things too much that you see on the news and how they relate to the letters. In the bible is where we should be getting the Word of the Lord, and there is alot of prophecy of the end times in there already. Don't let them get ahold you're mind again, remember who you listen to and who you trust, not a man but God.

We can rely on the bible, and we can rely on Jesus as our unchanging rock of salvation.

SelahSelah

According to scripture we know a prophet is of YahuWah not because one of there prophesies is realized (as in the case with the Obama letter) but rather we know when a prophet is false if even only 1 prophecy fails. Fortune tellers may get it right sometimes, even many times, but they also fail at times in their predictions. Remember: many will say we PROPHESIED, healed... in Your name, but He still did not know them. Anyone can take guesses and get it right sometimes but to get it right every time without any error, that is a prophet of YahuWah.

To test the spirit of a prophet one must not look for fulfilled prophecy but rather failed prophecy, and until a failed prophecy is found, and if everything else they say lines up with scripture, we should not despise prophets. If a prophet is truly of YahuWah, to do so is bad, and if they are not of YahuWah they will fail on their own without anyone going against them. There is nothing new under the sun, and trying to rid the world of false prophets is an impossible feat and in my opinion, awareness that one must read, study, and seek understanding of the Word thru the Holy Spirit is what needs to be understood.

Yes, I read Sylvia Brown predicted Obama and McCain as the two nominees, so I understand spirits like that can and do also have correct predictions. I guess it's just hard for me to understand how or why someone would write those letters for so many years all the while involving their children and families if it was just for monetary gain. Maybe I am just really naive and don't believe people can or would be capable do something like that, especially without their families seeing it.

To be honest with you, it is hard for me to test the letters to see if they line up with scripture in the Word of God. It might sound ridiculous to the average Christian- how can someone not test the scriptures? Most would think it would be quite simple, but it actually becomes a very difficult task once your mind has been "rewired".

Since we were told the Bible is contaminated with misinterpretations and hidden agendas and is flawed like the whole book of Galatians and parts of Romans. So just when I think I find comfort or a clearer understanding in the Bible or maybe even something that is in complete opposition to the letters, I step back and have to question it and am not sure whether to believe it or not. Since I am not sure if it is a 'diluted deception' or if it is the truth, because we were told the Bible is tainted with misinterpretations and "doctrines of demons". It starts to feel like you're staring into a bowl of alphabet soup, what does it all mean? What can we trust? Who can we trust? If not the Bible, only God and who can hear from God clearly?

i know, from a close source whose husband is in this cult, that the husband actually saw timothy scribble (automatic writing) on paper and then send it to his wife amy for her to translate it. so alot of the times if not all times amy is the one "writing/transcribing" the letters.

i sense that, because of campings recent failed prediction, the group will not be giving out any specific "rapture" dates?

@SalehSaleh if i were you then i would stay away from reading/analyzing/figuring out the letters. they are meant to hook you in keep you in and to break you down. i've found myself curious of the same things as you and have found that it gets into your head and starts to control the thoughts.

i'm wondering why you want to test the letters anyways? they are NOT scripture as this group claims and there may be a bit of truth mixed in with the twisting of scriptures but it is only meant to scramble us into getting hooked and to become a follower of these letters.