its interesting having a glance at the Guruphiliac thread about Byron Katie. Its the most active thread there, approaching 20% of all the posts in that forum.
The original poster in that thread, posted some obviously honest, and thus very damaging information about the Byron Katie LGAT seminar. Even though they don't appear to have much experience with LGAT seminars, and were just reporting on what they saw happening to people falling apart in droves. (which is precisely engineered into these LGAT seminars).
One of the main things that all LGAT's do, from Landmark to PSI, to everyone else, is to CREATE CONFUSION around the seminar. That is one of the best things they can do, create confusion, and then tell people, 'try it for yourself". As they know, once they are in the tent, then the "experts" will take care of the job.
They always say, "its a powerful dangerous workshop, not for everyone" as that is a great salespitch.
Also, the label of "destructive cult", was actually created by the Guruphiliac. That is what HE named his forum on Byron Katie.
"Byron Katie — Is The Work a destructive cult?"
That phrase is actually meaningless, as "The Work" is not the cult, its bait.
That is like saying "is the vibhuti Ash from Sai Baba a cult?" No, its a cheap-trick to make people think he can do miracles.
The Work serves a similar function to the TM Meditation Technique, in terms of advertising. Why can Guruphiliac see that TM uses meditation as a trick, but not that The Work, is literally fulfilling the same organizational use? Its almost exact, even down to being "freely given", eliminate stress, etc.
Up to when Guruphiliac posted about Byron Katie, it was more about the damaging aspects of the Byron Katie LGAT seminars, and the cultish behavior of the inner circle. It was specifially AGAINST the idea this is some bald-headed bongo playing "cult" from 30 years ago. Obviously, its not, its a far more sophisticated LGAT structure.
also a certain "jgf75" at the Guruphiliac forum, makes some rather strange comments about Stephen Mitchell, about how he makes his income from books? LOL! That is rather amusing actually. The guy is married to BK, and thus 50/50 in her bidniz of making millions, doing his own LGAT seminars with her, co-writing, etc. So that might be a telling defensive sounding comment?
also, "jgf75" makes a comparison of BK with Starbucks coffee. very very strange. It could be an example of a person with literally zero awareness of LGAT techniques, or something else.
QUOTE from jgf75:
"The word "cult" has all kinds of connotations having to do with brainwashing people into giving up their lives and families, conforming to one rigid set of thinking, and generally isolating themselves from outside influences and giving over their will and sometimes possessions to the cult leader."
Well, guess what, even on that list meant to say BK is not a cult, BK hits on all points! People are getting divorced, doing The Work like robots, cutting themselves off from the outside world, repeating BK words over and over, and handing over huge amounts of money! So its kinda ironic.
the next paragraph, is either naive, or something else.
What "jgf75" is not seeing, is that all of those other cults were "voluntary" exactly like BK. Except BK is much more subtle and advanced.
"jgf75" then tried to dismiss the hundreds of FACTS as factoids. Very interesting.
When it fact, the foundations of EVERYTHING Byron Katie says range from at best an imaginal Story that is uncheckable, or outright bullshit. Name any checkable facts of the BK Story? There's almost nothing. That is deliberate, of course.
Then" jgf75" goes into saying there were some ex-criminals reformed by The Work who were at the Workshop? How did "jgf75" know that? Who told them?
getting dubious...to say the least.
But for example, white-collar crooks would LOVE the work. The victim is the one to blame, not them.
Any salesman would love it to use with clients, you can convince them of anything you want.
It also teaches there is no such thing as right or wrong, and no truth or reality! That is one thing not mentioned yet, is it a good idea to teach criminals to have even less of a conscience, and to detach?
The Work, is the last thing one should teach to criminals! They need to learn some Empathy for their victims. Its been shown that many "therapies" given to criminals, just make them more manipulative, and don't affect recidivism. A scary thought indeed.
As far as Landmark, and the others? How do they handle mental breakdowns? They don't care, that's how. And those who fight back get crushed by their legal team, unless they are really strong, and then they get a pay-off. That's reality, that's a fact.
So its hard to know if people are totally indocrinated into The Work, or just refer others to The Work as a Facilitator for-profit, and deny the damaging realities to themselves.
Also, of course, there are many who are just in it for the money, all LGAT's are full of salespeople, and they can make serious money on that phone all day. They can make thousands in a good day. Quite a lure.
but its interesting about Stephen Mitchell, kind of amusing really, that he "makes his money as an author". Those books he translated, would have perhaps paid for their own printing, if they are lucky.
Maybe someone will mention how he is married so gets 50% of everything, is doing seminars with BK, gets the profits direct from the books he co-wrote with BK, does fulltime promotion of BK on the internet, runs the BK Foundation, etc.
Byron Katie is his main gig. She is the star, he is basically Mr Byron Katie, in reality. (which he would not like very much!) But notice in the BK seminars, people are "taught" what an amazing writer Stephen Mitchell is...who added that to the curriculum?
:-) some of this stuff is amusing...
Mitchell also wrote books still sold about Seung Sahn, and was even groomed to take over the Seung Sahn empire, before the sex abuse scandals.
There is also an interesting question posed..."Is RandomStu paid to facilitate the work?"
Very interesting question to ask. Obviously not! He's not a facilitator.
He clearly doesn't know ANYTHING about it, as all he does is try to create a smokescreen using poker bluff tactics, like he tried to do here. The fact that RandomStu is NOT a facilitator of The Work, who denied he had any connection to them, makes it far more dubious.
All it takes is a phone call, and they can create confusion, where there is no confusion.
Inducing confusion is pretty much the #1 technique of byron katie as well.
It would not be a surprise at all, to find out one day some of these millionaire "Zen" people have some type of behind the scenes business partnership, where they own various Zen centers as a group. [forum.culteducation.com
BK and Stephen Mitchell are connected with the other Zen centers as well, though Michael Katz, John Tarrant [forum.culteducation.com
] Josh Baran, San Francisco Zen Center, Pacific Zen Institute, Kwan Um School of Zen, Stuart Resnick,
Stephen Mitchell has deep contacts in this faux-Zen world.