Ross Robinson says he mostly uses Byron Katie's method when producing songs, so they are designed specifically in line with her philosophy. Even the title of the Korn album "Take a look in the mirror" is a Katie concept. She is trying to trigger past trauma and break people's minds but there are also some disturbing subliminal messges she is exposing her seminar participants to.

The Korn lyrics are about somebody losing their sanity, lying, blaming the world, inability to trust anyone, self-loathing and becoming criminally violent. There are a lot of discussions about antisocial personality disorder in cult leaders but post-hypnotic suggestion has been shown to create antisocial behaviors, especially when a therapist has an abnormal relationship with a patient. Is she using this method to create APD in seminar participants? Everyone who works with Byron Katie would need to feel unresposible for their actions. Some of the symptoms of APD include lying, nonconfomity, anxiety, disregard for others, no remorse, deceiving people for self profit, irritability, angry outbursts which would fit a number of cult members. This is the message of Korn songs:

Self control breaks down
I Like my life insane
God I feel so bound
I want to slash and feed you
I'm gonna cut myself
I Fucking hate you

Everybody's an Enemy
Several try to disguise the devil in them
Fuck Everybody this is to all of ya'll
Trust nobody

I am to blame, for everything
I'm done being there for others
Now I pray for all of them to go away!

The Ross Robinson interview:

Bands that you’ve produced have told us that you make them sit down and explain the purpose of each song and each lyric. Explain this process.

I use my mom Byron Katie’s methods for the most part with that. (Check her out at www.thework.com). Basically, I know how to do some serious mental surgery. I get in deeper and deeper and pull out the reality of it. When you hate someone, you hate yourself, when you love something, you love yourself. I find that in the bands and I find it in their songs. I’ve gotten really good at finding the “self” in the projection that the person is creating as their image, and a big way to do that is to expose my stuff first. It’s pretty fucking brutal.

You’re known for invoking and embracing anger and emotion from bands. There’s lots of stories about you smashing drums and throwing things at your artists as they record. What’s that all about?

It’s all about craving from the depths of my being. When you see your favorite band live, you feed off of that energy for days or even months. But when you listen to their albums, a lot of times, you’re like, “Eh, another boring studio performance.” Sometimes musicians need to feel certain things to emote, and a lot of times, that thing will come out with a little coercing. So sometimes it comes in the form of an object being thrown at their head while they’re tracking.

[www.thegrixer.com]

Quote
Jay Cruise
Ross Robinson says he mostly uses Byron Katie's method when producing songs, so they are designed specifically in line with her philosophy. Even the title of the Korn album "Take a look in the mirror" is a Katie concept.

So Byron Katie's Work has infected the music industry, via her sadistic, egomaniacal son, Ross Robinson. Apple doesn't fall far from the tree I guess.

I read some comments about Robinson on a message board and a few people referred to him as a "psycho". Most applauded his demonic studio tactics. Scary.

Q: What components do you feel it takes to make a “complete” album?

Robinson: Just your chest cavity, cut completely open and your guts spilling everywhere, with total love-intention that exposes everything. That’s all.

[[url=http://www.thegrixer.com/rossrobinson.html]Behind The Boards: Ross Robinson[/url]]

Folks, here is something from Chapter 34 of Janaki's blog. It is worth looking at.

[janakisstory.wordpress.com]

Quote

34 - The Rules & a New Religion
The Rules and a new Religion

Katie has often called The Work ‘check mate’.

Check mate means ‘no way out’, it is the end of the road. I can see why it is said that The Work would lead to this. Nowhere to go, no one to blame, nothing to point your finger at. It shows us how we have identified with the victim role. According to Katie, the victim is always violent.

Quote

There are certain ‘do’s’ and ‘don’ts’ within The Work.

One of the ‘don’ts’ is that you don’t defend, and you don’t clarify, justify or explain. Katie demonstrates this wonderfully on stage, or in the School. She will say, ‘if someone says I am terrible, I go in and find it, and it doesn’t take me very long’. This is wonderful when it is demonstrated for role modeling purposes.

Then there is The 3 kinds of business. The three kinds of business basically tell you to keep your nose out of other people’s business, and to stay present with yourself. It is said that whenever you feel uncomfortable, you are basically minding someone else’s business.

One of the other ‘don’ts’ is called Story. Within The Work circles, it has become a standard phrase to say to someone, You are in a story now. In the certification program there is a lot of emphasis on how to bring people out of their story back to The Work. Facilitators are being warned about not going into their clients story.

This is all great when it serves me to look at myself rather than at someone else, it is called ‘noticing a blind spot’. This is great when it helps me to see how I behave when I am identified with the victim role. This is great to detect hidden aggressive behavior or irrational belief systems.

I am noticing however, that it can also be used as a system of protection. Just take a look at the do’s and don’ts. Within the work circles you are already wrong by definition if you defend, explain or justify. With a lot of things you say, you can be questioned and trivialized with: Whose business are you in? or But that is just a story.

I would love to see The Work in its proper perspective. If it becomes the new religion, then it is inevitable that it would draw along with it all the symptoms I described earlier about institutionalization and control. This strikes me as unhealthy.

So...look at this set up. It is indeed a checkmate.

'The victim is always violent'--WTF???

Seems to me, many of us become victimized because we were unable to summon enough force (violence) to protect ourselves when attacked--either because we were too young, ambushed, or in a power imbalance that caused us to shut down psychologically and emtionally in relation to the attacker.

'The victim is always violent'--What about the perpetrator?

''Within the work circles you are already wrong by definition if you defend, explain or justify.'

So...if you exercise personal agency by offering an explanation, a defence or justification...stuff we do to keep bullies from victimizing us...we are automatically in the wrong???

Then...if you dont defend yourself (so as to avoid being-in-your-story and being-in-the wrong in BK land) and you end up becoming bully fodder and become a victim-- by failing to put up a defense you become a victim, someone who is 'always violent'.

But if you do seek to defend yourself by 'defend(ing)', explain(ing)' or justifying(ing)'--
you are 'already wrong by definition'.

Sheesh......!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/05/2009 10:21PM by corboy.

BK, as far back as 1995/6 or so, seemed to like using music. This is from Janaki's description of the first European tour

Quote

06 - The First European Tour

The tour was a great experience. Katie had brought along American friends, as well as her daughter and grandson. And we all fitted in the van, together with our luggage and traveling bookstore. She called it ‘Havanna White’. On the way we listened to Katie tapes and the Rolling Stones.

Destination: Germany, back to Holland, back to Germany, Switzerland, Portugal and back to Amsterdam again.

Now, what a strange term to use for the traveling bookstore...'Havanna White'.

This may be a reference to Vanna White of Wheel of Fortune.

But it almost seems to sound like a drug, too. Maybe Anticult can look under the hood
and itemize the components.

[www.emovere.com] (a small excerpt..thanks to helpme2times for posting this on another thread--C)

(("And as I saw endlessly in the new age, dulling the pain only helps people learn to tolerate it.

In so many cases, that pain relief actually stops people from changing things for the better, because they're so inundated with an endless, serial pelting of magical cures that they sort of forget to ask why they are in so much pain to begin with.))

Quote

Sociology also helped me understand my entry into, and exit from, the new age. I was able to see that I left my new age career for the same reasons I entered it:

I was really concerned about the number of trauma survivors there, and how they were being confused and pandered to and marketed to, but not truly helped.

I saw too many untreated anxiety disorders and too many untreated depressive disorders, and too many untreated PTSD sufferers, and it just got to me. I couldn't ethically support what was going on.

And though I was a voice of dissent and I got pretty far in my years of writing and teaching, I realized that in my 30-plus years in the new age, I had seen no one get truly well. People acquired a better vocabulary for their pain, and they had more ways to soothe themselves than regular folks tend to have, but that was about it.

And while self-soothing is very important, I found that the new age made too many promises with no responsible research behind them. No money-back guarantees, and lots of blaming the victim if the promises don't deliver (you must have negative energy, you're not praying hard enough, it's your karma. Feh.) No checks and balances, no consumer protection agency ... unacceptable.

In response to my concerns about the ethical lapses and the many ways that the new age trains people (especially women) to be unquestioning, undiscerning, and totally pliant consumers, I've allowed all of the books and tapes I control through Laughing Tree Press to go out of print, and I'm in talks with my other publishers to do the same. I am just now reopening this website after years of silence. But I'm really pondering my next steps. I'm now writing a book about my unusual transition, but the intensity people have about their beliefs makes me queasy, and I don't want to be out there as an apostate flag waver, since the place I've come to in my thinking and in my studies doesn't really square up with anyone else's ideas.

and

Quote

I saw that pain when I was up on stage being the spiritual healer gal, or the empath. I don't even know how to describe it to you – the sorrow, and the fear, and the naked longing that I saw in people's faces. There was this aching hope that if they listened to me (or someone), or if I (or someone) looked at them in the right way, or if I (or someone) said the right things, or if I (or someone) wrote the right words, their pain would be suddenly healed and they would be able to breathe and live more easily. It was oppressive up on stage for me – to see all that, and to try to do something, anything ... to make it better for people. But while I could do a great deal just by being a highly empathic mensch, I can't fix a broken world and make everything all right, or make racism and sexism and classism and greed and stupidity and warmongering and abuse go away.

I think we can all create little sanctuaries for each other, and be as kind as we can while holding each other accountable, but the magic promises aren't changing anything for the better – they're only providing temporary relief from the pain. That's nice and all, but it's no solution.

And as I saw endlessly in the new age, dulling the pain only helps people learn to tolerate it. In so many cases, that pain relief actually stops people from changing things for the better, because they're so inundated with an endless, serial pelting of magical cures that they sort of forget to ask why they are in so much pain to begin with.

From Corboy--remember how important consciousness raising was, back when activist and feminist movements were going strong? How people learned to look at and then question social structures and gender roles that had been taken for granted? As a tiny example of how we still need to do this today, a woman who wrote for a recent issue of Atlantic Monthly reflected on the outrageous social pressure being put on mothers to breast feed and that BFing has been endowed with all sorts of claims to enhance the babys intelligence, immune system, but that peer reviewed medical journals dont support this nearly to the extent that the popular media does.

The author noted that all too often many women who try to breast feed find themselves doing most of the work compared with their husbands, who get sidelined, and the moms run short on sleep. And the author also noted that this crazy pressure to breast feed or be considered a horrid mother means many women may be dropping out of the work force because breast feeding or pumping at work is just to much, on top of what has to be done and that workplace gains for women may be eroding and because breastfeeding has become an unquestionable holy grail, no one dares ask...who, socially is losing out here,and who is winning?

Instead, you have exhausted guilt ridden mothers, stressed out marriages and this disruption may continue to haunt the relationships long after the kid has ceased nursing.

The medical research doesnt indicate that there are gains commensurate with the psychosocial stressors of breast feeding in a shitty economy where diminished earning power for the dollar has forced both mothers and fathers into the workplace.

In New Age circles, one gets a distraction from the stress caused by all this economic and gender imbalanced stuff, with no structural analysis or healthy revolutionary anger.

In case you think this is nuts, the person who cuts what is left of my hair, told me that she was unable to breast feed her baby, because she'd lost lots of blood during delivery, needed transfusions and her body was too weakened to support an adequate milke supply.

'What kills me is no one wanted to hear me when I told them why I couldnt breast feed my baby. These other mothers just sneered at me. It felt just like being back in high school where the 'soc' girls, the queen bees pass judgement if you refuse to join them
in whatever they consider cool. Breast feeding is now the new 'cool' and no one wants to hear you if you cant do it for medical reasons or because it would stress your marriage.'

So, rather than question and rebell against social and economic factors that make some of us rich and the rest of us poor and frustrated and lacking support for childrearing, its easy to let oneself get disracted by new age magicall thinking

WHICH SERVES AN ECONOMICALLY EXPLOITATIVE AGENDA AND MAKES A FEW PEOPLE VERY RICH--and without having to carry malpractice insurance or take responsiblity in any adult or legal way for any harm their untested products may cause.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/05/2009 10:42PM by corboy.

Quote
corboy
'The victim is always violent'--WTF???

Byron Katie made the comment:

"Victims are violent, violent people. Victims are freightened people and freightened people are dangerous."

Her tone is even more freightening. It's on the Israelli seminar video "I'm Afraid of War" which is worth a watch:

[www.youtube.com] Part 1

[www.youtube.com] Part 2

[www.youtube.com] Part 3

Hmmm....

Jay Cruise posted:

Quote

Byron Katie made the comment:

"Victims are violent, violent people. Victims are freightened people and freightened people are dangerous."

Methinks the Lady needs to do a Turnaround...on herself.

Most of us are victimized because we lack the capability to kick ass (be assertiveenough/forceful enough/violent enough) to defend our boundaries and goodies from folks who wanna take from us.

Quote


arienariadne (wrote on Guruphiliac)

30th March 17:39 p.m.

I had read somewhere, before the school, that Katie would ask people to leave the school if she thought they were problematic. And she specifically stated that anyone caught marketing anything at all or were caught with weapons would be ejected immediately (and I saw no weapons, but a couple of people tried to sell me something). So I knew it was possible to rub The School folks wrong. Somehow, I intuited that you wouldn't have to go so far as marketing or having a weapon to get kicked out. It was Katie's "Family," after all, and she called the shots.

[guruphiliac.lefora.com]

For someone who supposedly loves what is--all this seems a strange set of concerns.



Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 04/06/2009 06:00AM by corboy.

Hmmmm. BK's newsletter has announced a new event.

"Guess what? The Five-Day No-Body Intensive is about to happen in Ojai, California, Stephen's home town ("I" live with Stephen)."

May 24 - 29, 2009
No-Body Intensive

Location:
The Center for The Work
213 N. Montgomery Street
Ojai, CA

Description:
If you are interested in the end of suffering, if you are interested in discovering just how and why your physical body is the way that it is, and how you continue to age it and to create every physical flaw and illness that you perceive, come learn once and for all how to change once and for all. If you have the courage to change and the willingness to drop into the unknown, you have the ability to live beyond life. Katie invites you to register for this one-time (as far as she knows) No-Body Intensive. Register early, seating is limited.

Cost:
Early Tuition $1595 (expires April 26th)
Full Tuition $1995

Note: Participants are responsible for their own accommodations and food during this five-day event.

[Is BK trying to cash in on "The Secret" crowd? "...just how and why your physical body is the way that it is, and how you continue to age it and to create every physical flaw and illness that you perceive..."]



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 04/06/2009 08:15AM by helpme2times.

Actually the Korn song that is played at the schools is called "Daddy" [www.youtube.com]

Katie introduces it as written by "her friend John" who "doesn't do The Work".

Daddy lyrics [www.elyrics.net]

that is a good repost of the BK checkmate system [forum.culteducation.com]
Its is a checkmate if you buy into The Work thought-reform system. A checkmate is from chess, when you are TRAPPED and you can't get out, and you LOSE.
The Queen wins.


The pathological belief she tries to install in people's minds..

- 'The victim is always violent'

This is some of the most heinous and destructive aspects of everything she does. To install these types of extremely damaging core beliefs in people, affects your entire life. Its like her other destructive belief..."love is a murderer", and many like that.
Its clearly a double-bind, as anyone knows a victim is by definition a person who is having violence done to them against their will. The perpetrator is ALWAYS violent, by definition.

She is installing that belief in people. Why? What does it do?
If you hold the false-belief, 'The victim is always violent', when you are having your boundaries violated, and are feeling healthy anger to REPELL the invader, instead you will turn this back on yourself. So your healthy anger at the violation of your boundaries, will be transfered from the perpetrator where it belongs, and put back onto yourself. Then the perpetrator can do what they wish, and the victim blames themselves, and get victimized by the predator, and themselves.
Double checkmate.

One is tempted to believe that BK believes this, due to her own claims of sexual abuse as a child, where she now claims that she caused it?
Obviously, that is a sick and twisted belief, as a child is NEVER to blame for sexual abuse with an adult, obviously. Everyone knows that, or they better know it, or they belong in prison.

But is BK a victim in adult life? Not a chance. Look at the massive system she has set-up, where she is untouchable. If anything, she has set up this elaborate system to protect herself from anyone getting near her. She has set up a predatory system.
So its clear she has set up these beliefs, simply to passify those in her unpaid employ, her followers. As if you are being taken advantage of by BK, and you start to feel healthy anger toward her for tricking and exploiting you, if you buy into her system, you will turn that around back on yourself.
Also, those who were abused in childhood will be blocked from getting their power back.
You are in another checkmate.

No, the 'The victim is NOT always violent'.
The perpetrator is always violent.
The predator is always violent, even if they present as a loving lamb.
The victim can sometimes be violent in self-defense. And if the victim was able to be violent enough, then they would no longer be a victim.
For example, if you were a "Bruce Lee" with top skills of physical self-defense, its not possible to be a victim in a fair-fight.

But of course, none of this is a fair-fight. Its based on deception, and bait-and-switch.
Its about POWER. She has all the power. She is hiding behind her massive system, where she is untouchable. She is afraid that the power between her and others will be equalized.