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15 years ago
joe6
Alex, here is the kind of thing you could do in a trustworthy organization: Go to a forum leader and ask, "Have Landmark members ever submitted a petition to change recruitment policy? If so, can I see a copy of the petition and any formal responses?" If you are working with people of high integrity, this should be a trivial process. If you don't think you can do this, then why
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
15 years ago
joe6
I remember my Landmark friend (who's been around since the Erhard days) talking about earlier attempts at reform. They had a big conference of some kind and presented a request to lay off the hard sell, etc. I remember my friend expressing his astonishment that the Landmark leadership didn't "have integrity" about implementing the reform requests. Can some of the other lo
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
15 years ago
joe6
Quotejoe6" Two-time Emmy winner Robyn Symon" This is suspiciously vague. What were the emmy awards for? Sound editing? I've searched Google and the Emmy site. Can anyone find a record of the awards? This page from their site lists the awards but I can't find an independent record of them.
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
15 years ago
joe6
" Two-time Emmy winner Robyn Symon" This is suspiciously vague. What were the emmy awards for? Sound editing? I've searched Google and the Emmy site. Can anyone find a record of the awards?
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
15 years ago
joe6
There is a new documentary on Werner Erhard called "Transformation": If anyone is in Palm Beach, FL on April 25 or 27 you can see it at the film festival and maybe report on what you see: "Werner Erhard, pioneer of the multi-billion dollar personal growth industry breaks a long silence about his ideas, his life and the controversial program est..."
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
15 years ago
joe6
Another twist on "all you require is a shift in perspective" is the way it makes a healthy relationship nearly impossible. I get a little of the fallout from my Landmark friend who thinks like this, but I get ill watching how he treats his wife. Mind you, he is a "nice guy" (who was screwed up by Werner Erhard a long time ago). When his wife tries to bring up that she is u
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
15 years ago
joe6
From the article: Biondi wants to require that anyone "who posts written messages on a public forum Web site" be identified "by a legal name and address" that is either disclosed publicly or kept on file. I don't know what chances the bill has, but it could affect our postings here. This comes on the heels of Rick Ross winning against Landmark to protect the anonymo
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
15 years ago
joe6
QuoteelenaHow did/does he explain his humiliation/demise, to himself or to his followers Like it says on the original werner-erhard.com site: "In order to provide an opportunity for the ongoing availability of the work of transformation, unimpeded by the attack on his personal reputation..." My Landmark friend tells it like that: The Scientologists were making Werner look bad in
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
15 years ago
joe6
For those who haven't seen it, the litigation archive previously discussed is online with documents discovered in the case against Rick Ross. I especially found interesting the briefing that was written in the Self Magazine case which quotes pretty disturbing sections of the Forum Supervisors Manual:
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
15 years ago
joe6
Quoteelena(supposedly) getting read for his "return" This is the big question for me. I know the license of the "technology" expires in 2009, unless somehow in the mean time Landmark bought the rights fully and no more license. Is there any infomation on that? I know devotess like my friend who just wouldn't be able to contain themselves if Werner showed up in the open
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
15 years ago
joe6
QuoteLaura19 This is RIDICULOUS!!! When will it stop??!! As was pointed out on another thread (thank you mjr40), things don't look so good right now. So long as we have judges on the Supreme Court who want to protect the existence of their own cult, the legal environment will make it easier for other cults to protect themselves too. Is it not as bad as it looks?
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
15 years ago
joe6
QuoteHopeSince my doctor was recommending LF Hope, have you thought about how deeply unethical it was for your doctor, as a licensed professional, to recommend Landmark? Have you considered reporting your doctor to the Medical Board?
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
15 years ago
joe6
Lucas, a general comment which others may want to add to: With something like Landmark, there are True Believers (like my friend unfortunately) who buy in and even though they may criticize some aspects, their mind does not permit the thought that it is a scam. (sad but obvious enough) But also note that if someone does see that Landmark is manipulating them, there are two possibilities: you ca
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
15 years ago
joe6
Quotepatrick-darcyyes, i see your point. where do u draw the line. I don't know how it could be put on a legal basis, but the difference I see between a "good church" and a disaster like Landmark is: truth in advertising. For example, I can go down to the corner church and without any deception they will tell me "We will have communion and hand you some bread a
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
15 years ago
joe6
Quotepatrick-darcyits amazing to actually read how people have to give up those they care about because of the cults. while the government and most everybody else just turns their heads , looking the other way. this is not a united country. only in a united country do people look out for each other. In all seriousness, patrick-darcy, if you were a congressman and you wanted to write a
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
15 years ago
joe6
QuoteelenaQuotemidonov123 As if something blew up inside their brain. Conway and Siegelman called it "snapping" and included Werner Erhard's est in their 1976 book on the subject. Ellen This is one of the many bad effects EST/LE has had on people, which goes to my question on how to talk to my friend who has been involved since the Werner days. He thinks of himself
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
15 years ago
joe6
QuoteGulab JamonWell, I still liked the movie. Does it matter that the movie succeeds because people think it is real? That people see it 6 times and get their friends to see it because they believe what the movie is telling them, that this is what modern scientists have discovered about reality? When that's not the case at all? Does it matter that the movie succeeds by confusing people
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
15 years ago
joe6
There is the case against Jason Weed and Landmark. Note that in this article: it says the lawyer in the Oklahoma case, Gaylon C. Hayes, says they plan to re-open the case. Also, the France 3 documentary about Landmark investigates some cases of psychosis. Hopefully, an English translation of this documentary is on the way.
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
15 years ago
joe6
QuotezerolandHhmm, she probably would. I see her every week at a class we both attend. Do you have a copy of the video? I thought you were the one saying that it would be expensive to get a copy of the video? I won't see her again until Saturday. Or if it's a big rush I could get her phone number (I'm a friend of the teacher) before that. I have access to the internet from work, @
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
15 years ago
joe6
Wow, I feel for you. The thing that has helped me the most, that you might try, is people who post here realize after a while that they only thought Landmark was helping them, but it actually doesn't. My friend says Landmark helped him get "IT". Landmark gave him a "breakthrough" he couldn't have gotten anywhere else and he's so grateful Landmark is there to
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
15 years ago
joe6
For some info, see an archived page from werner-erhard.com from 2001 when it was still obviously a page from the Landmark web site before they changed the copyright to "Friends of Werner Erhard". (How can Landmark claim they are not devoted to Werner when it pays the registration for werner-erhard.com?) On this page it says "In 1991, the employees formed their own company, Lan
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
15 years ago
joe6
(zeroland, I can't answer you off-thread using private message because we haven't met the minimum post requirement yet.) What a compelling offer. It is a 2 hour documentary. I might be able to get a transcription in French made, but do you think she would translate directly from the video (which she may find interesting too)?
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
15 years ago
joe6
In discussing why Landmark is allowed to continue, the best example we have of a success in stopping it is what happened in France. I watched the documentary that was mentioned on another thread: My French is not that great, but they focussed on a new French law for controlling cults. Almost every sentence was asking if Landmark is a "secte" because if it is, the law would apply.
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
15 years ago
joe6
Kate, I am very sorry for your loss. I can't imagine how you feel. QuoteConcerned Oz Being from Sydney too, I am interested in following this one. My search on the name came up with several local organisations from Clothing, Drug rehab, business training and counselling. Can you provide the correct link to this org your sister was involved in? Oz In case Kate can't reply right
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
15 years ago
joe6
Hi Nettie. Your posts are very helpful to me. I had lots of people do the hard sell on me. My boss even got me to an into evening but I felt attacked and left. A dear friend of mine is DEEP into it from back when Werner was there. He describes the hard sell as an unfortunate annoyance that everyone at Landmark wishes would go away too. He even thinks that without the hard sell people would
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
15 years ago
joe6
QuoteClausDIa also in Switzerland and Munich (Germany) a few years ago ... but I don't know why exactly. There are a lot of "negative" web sites in German giving warnings about cult-like activities of LE, actually much more than positive sites. I still see courses offered in Frankfurt. Do you know if there are diferences there?
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
15 years ago
joe6
Actually may this other thing from Wikipedia would be more useful for exposing LE: archive.org strikes again! It shows early versions of werner-erhard.com and how it came straight off the landmark web site in 2001 before they changed it all around. LE even has the registration on werner-erhard.com. On second thougt tho, even if you can find out that LE is paying to run a Werner fan site, d
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
15 years ago
joe6
Thanks for the translation, Gulab Jamon! I saw this article linked to from Wikipedia: But there is no English for it. I wonder it there is a way to link to your translation from Wikipedia?
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
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