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Upsidedownnewspaper: Drinking is a real activity, if there is something other than the drinker that can influence whether or not the drinker drinks, that something must also be real and demonstrable. Undemonstrable hypothetical entities "beyond ourselves" do not intercede in our drinking.

To say "I stopped drinking with the help of my belief in God" can be true, in the case of certain people with certain religious beliefs,[b:eeea5020a2] but to say "I stopped drinking with the help of God" is not true. [/b:eeea5020a2]I am not going to repeat this, it should already be clear.

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AA is by definition and on it's own terms, a cult.

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What is NAMI?

NAMI (the National Alliance on Mental Illness) is the nation’s largest grassroots mental health organization dedicated to improving the lives of persons living with serious mental illness and their families. Founded in 1979, NAMI has become the nation’s voice on mental illness, a national organization including NAMI organizations in every state and in over 1100 local communities across the country who join together to meet the NAMI mission through advocacy, research, support, and education.

888.999.6264 ~ NAMI’s toll-free HelpLine serves over 4,000 callers a month and is staffed by a dedicated team of volunteer associates, as well as state and affiliate HelpLines in communities across the country;

NAMI’s Campaign for the Mind of America, a grassroots political communications initiative, focuses on building relationships at national, state, and local levels with community leaders and elected officials to ensure that policy decisions are reflective of the best economic, science, [b:029abb93d4]recovery[/b:029abb93d4], and systems choices while ensuring the best outcomes.

How can I get in contact with NAMI

NAMI?2107 Wilson Blvd., Suite 300?Arlington, VA 22201-3042
www.nami.org
Main:           703-524-7600?Fax:             703-524-9094?TDD:            703-516-7227?HelpLine:      800-950-NAMI (6264)
Email:          info@nami.org
?How can I volunteer with NAMI?

As a grassroots organization, NAMI relies on volunteers at all levels of the organization. Contact the NAMI National HelpLine at info@nami.org or 800-950-6264 for opportunities at the national office as well as referral to state organizations, affiliates, and NAMIWalks events in your community.

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Providers should recognize that denial is an inherent part of the problem. Patients often do not have insight as to the seriousness and scope of the problem. Abstinence may be a goal of the program but should not be a precondition for entering treatment. If dually diagnosed clients do not fit into local Alcoholics Anonymous (AA) and Narcotics Anonymous (NA) groups, special peer groups based on AA principles might be developed.

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How often do people with severe mental illnesses also experience a co-occurring substance abuse problem?

There is a lack of information on the numbers of people with co-occurring disorders, but research has shown the disorders are very common. According to reports published in the Journal of the American Medical Association (JAMA):
• Roughly 50 percent of individuals with severe mental disorders are affected by substance abuse.
• Thirty-seven percent of alcohol abusers and 53 percent of drug abusers also have at least one serious mental illness.
• Of all people diagnosed as mentally ill, 29 percent abuse either alcohol or drugs.

The best data available on the prevalence of co-occurring disorders are derived from two major surveys: the Epidemiologic Catchment Area (ECA) Survey (administered 1980-1984), and the National Comorbidity Survey (NCS), administered between 1990 and 1992.

The ECA Survey found that individuals with severe mental disorders were at significant risk for developing a substance use disorder during their lifetime. Specifically:
• 47 percent of individuals with schizophrenia also had a substance abuse disorder (more than four times as likely as the general population).
• 61 percent of individuals with bipolar disorder also had a substance abuse disorder (more than five times as likely as the general population).

Consumers with co-occurring disorders are also much more likely to be homeless or jailed. An estimated 50 percent of homeless adults with serious mental illnesses have a co-occurring substance abuse disorder.

[b:39e4c66a2f]Consequences for society directly stem from the above.[/b:39e4c66a2f]

There is much evidence that integrated treatment can be effective. For example:
• Individuals with a substance abuse disorder are more likely to receive treatment if they have a co-occurring mental disorder.
• Research shows that when consumers with dual diagnosis successfully overcome alcohol abuse, their response to treatment improves remarkably.

Integrated treatment also requires the recognition that substance abuse counseling and traditional mental health counseling are different approaches that must be reconciled to treat co-occurring disorders.

Providers should recognize that denial is an inherent part of the problem. Patients often do not have insight as to the seriousness and scope of the problem. Abstinence may be a goal of the program but should not be a precondition for entering treatment. If dually diagnosed clients do not fit into local Alcoholics Anonymous (AA) and Narcotics Anonymous (NA) groups, special peer groups based on AA principles might be developed.

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An illness model of the problem should be used rather than a moralistic one.

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Consequences for society directly stem from the above.

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barabara
upside down:

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You have mentioned supreme court rulings against forced participation in AA. Why haven't these rulings been upheld, do you know?

This question contains an stated assumption that the rulings have [b:566b5f46a5]not[/b:566b5f46a5] been upheld.

Do you have any evedence to suport this assumption, a link to individual court cases, for instance, or media coverage of statistics related to cour-ordering people to meetings?

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barabara
Court ordered referrals to 12 step programs have been found to be in violation of the establishment clause of the 1st amendment.

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barabara
[This thread] is a discussion about [b:566b5f46a5]coercion by the court system of citizens[/b:566b5f46a5] in violation of their first amendment rights.