I've had to challenge many SoI members on the lies they have told me. Why should I not question the information you are offering here V? Because you've taken a stance against the cult? The cultofbutler site is only interested in facts and if you are spreading false information then it is likely that I am going to challenge you on it. I offered my reasons as an ex-follower as to why your views on Mike Gabbard don't add up and Zelig was challenged on the exact same points after he claimed to not remember the school existed. You didn't respond at all to my post.
Okay I didn't know you were posing as someone else Z. You just happen to have been involved in IGG, the ponomolau school and have the same documents he mentioned having and speak in the same fashion which you don't deny. Are you not male or jewish? You also admire him despite his being proven a liar on this forum and that he was giving false information. What was it that Rick Ross said, something like nothing he said is to be accepted without question or to be viewed as objective.
We would very much like the truth about Gabbard and your not being forthcoming in offering genuine information. You didn't deny that Devahuti dasi mentioned in the Haribol special is the same Carol Gabbard. Mike also states he went to Hawaii in 1977 which would make sense that he did so to help with the IGG party. The devotee school in Samoa would seem likely to have been run by the Gabbards unless Butler had some other disciples living in Samoa. If you had as much knowledge of the period 77-83 as you claim, you must know if there was a school in Samoa at least. The fact that we have no evidence of any disciples of Chris being named with a first letter not corresponding to their legal names except both Gabbard's and those who were initiated by ACB. The fact that this cult is not in the habit of allowing two new disciples to take charge of their children. His children have devotee names although four were born prior to 1983. We have no evidence that any parent changed their children's legal names once joining the cult and in fact it is very common for devotee children born into the cult or otherwise to have legal westernized names as well as sanskrit names. Mike Gabbard himself has never mentioned legally changing his childrens names.
So I'm asking you directly to be honest. Were Mike and Carol Gabbard members of the Science of Identity Foundation prior to 1983?
On the Valley Isle: Both links I posted on the Valley Isle refer to 1977 and in the paper Siddha refers to Holy Name Foundation which was the first name change of Scinece of Identity in december 1977. You made the point that in Haribol Special he was refering to himself as Jagat Guru, so this article appears to have been published between december and early 1978.
I posted link to a site recording the history of newspapers in Maui which you claim does not support my statement. I'll post it here so you can read it properly:
"A brief candle flame, burning but a year (1977-78
), the Valley Isle
entered the scene to take on a powerful giant, Big Isle rancher and politically well-connected Larry Mehau; but little “David” was attacked not only by its target but also by mainstream media in Honolulu. Owner-publisher Rick Reed, with no money for a high-powered lawyer, represented himself in court. In the end, he was not convicted of libel, after all.
This does not support your claim that it started before IGG. That would mean it would have been running prior to 1976. Rick Reed's own words does not support your claim that it folded in the mid 70s:
"I was on Maui. I owned a small newspaper called “The Valley Isle.” I had been sued by Larry Mehau for newspaper interviews I published alleging that he was the “godfather” of the local organized crime syndicate. One day in ’79 I got a phone call from a stranger.
The stranger identified himself as Chuck Marsland. He said he was a fan of my Valley Isle newspaper, and that he had been impressed with the Wayne Nishiki for Lt. Governor campaign that I had orchestrated the year before. "
"The papers folded mid ‘70’s so that CB could concentrate on becoming a political puppet master and Godfather in his own kingdom."
Political Puppet master could only refer to his role in IGG.
"Those papers folded after the IGG campaigns and the crew that published the papers moved to Honolulu to work on other projects."
Unless you are saying that Butler wanted to concentrate on being a political puppetmaster after he started a political party and ran 14 candidates for office. But that would just be stupid. But the rest of your facts are not supported at all.