Rick Ross,

Would you care to offer your position on Zelig/Vera, whether that is; you don't believe that they are the same person; or you are not concerned or would not be concerned that they are the same person?

You have not made this point clear and that might be a useful piece of information at this point.

What is clear is that someone is trying very hard to prevent these most secret documents from being posted on Rick Ross's website.

These documents are the most damaging evidence against Chris Butler, aka, Jagad Guru Siddhaswarupananda Prabhupad, aka the leader of the Science of Identity, a world-wide cult. They prove he is a cult leader. They show some of the historical structure and workings of the cult. They reveal some of the most crazy beliefs and practices. The most damaging documents, specifically on the personal care of the self-appointed messiah, and more photos are coming up. A great effort is being made to stop me from doing this here.

Anyone who took the time (an enormous amount BTW) to compare posts with other members on this forum, you would find an equal amount of paraphrases and repetitions. I just happen to agree with and liked a lot of Zelig's posts. Other's on this forum have also echoed those posts and confirmed and compared with their own experiences. You will also find line by line equivalents between the posts of SoI Kills and emntk, Mean Red, cultreporter, and others.

The people really interested in exposing Chris Butler, aka, Jagad Guru Siddhaswarupananda Prabhupad, aka the leader of the Science of Identity would be supporting my efforts to expose this fraud. A lot of effort and time has instead gone into flaming and attempting to discredit forum members.

SoI Kills already has these documents which were lifted off of my site when it was open to the public and stated here that they will put them up on their competing "cult buster" site, so the protest here makes no sense to me, except for their dislike of Rick Ross which is all over their forum and blog. Statements were made by the owner of that site that "Ross is past his use date", that he was paid off by Science of Identity, etc. So there are real questions.

Much effort and lobbying is being made to stop me from posting these documents. The focus of this thread is not on past member Zelig nor I, but on cult leader and damager of many lives, Chris Butler, aka, Jagad Guru Siddhaswarupananda Prabhupad, aka the leader of the Science of Identity.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/15/2008 08:11PM by Vera City.

SoI Kills:

I have no opinion, other than this is becoming an annoying petty squabble.

I don't know if Zelig and Vera City are the same individual posting under different names.

I do know that the documents now being collected on the board are helpful and historical.

And if someone could transcribe into text and submit critical press reports from local newspapers, a subsection could be created about SoI and Butler within the permanent archives.

Ah no V. I posted on the COB forum that I dislike the fact that previously banned members can come back here under new identities which i've said directly to Rick aswell.

I thought you might suggest that the post was somehow influenced by Zelig though, which is what you are implying isn't it? Your uncertainty is showing like it always does zelig.

I think there needs to be some method of control here yes, to give this thread some salvation. I've even thought of having two threads, one for general banter and another for specific information with some form of quality assurance. That would work to some degree. There would need to be some level of verification of the facts rather than none. (but I'm not sure anyone is considering my suggestions seriously)

You went on about professional reporting so much but where were your researched articles presented? No you made hundreds of posts, based purely on your own unverifyable experiences and then had your friends confirm how great and wonderful your posts were. How is that professional? Right wing media more like it. You were the problem here not the solution. And that was Zelig's line "we all have different experience. You might not have experienced what I experienced." That does not make the information you provide any more reliable than a paranoid, self-righteous guru.

But otherwise, the more websites exposing SoI the better, if you hadn't noticed SoI has the monopoly over anyone else. I'd like their position not Rick's. They have infinite more resources than we do. If more people were willing to expose the cult and make their own sites that would be wonderful. But it's not likely to happen now is it? Not by present company anyway.

I have been collaborating on a new site to file various documents about the cult as the site is getting rather large. The documents you provided have been transcribed so they will also be searchable on google and i'll post them here as well if you'd like.

Well since you made the assumption that my wanting to expose you was to prevent these documents being on this site. That is crap.. sorry I mean ridiculous. But I love how you turned it around like "I don't actually think you are Zelig I'm just trying to affect this site." How Siddha or Gabbard? Playing on naivety. It's absolutely marvelous. Anyway.. the site is still in development stage.

Science of Identity Cult Library @ [scienceofidentityfoundationcult.info]

SoI Kills:

When you have transcribed local newspaper articles or wire service reports up at your site that are transcribed into text with full attribution please post the links here.

Then the news articles and reports can be gathered together for a subsection about SoI within the Ross Institute archives.

Again, please stop posting attacks regarding Zelig, Vera City and Just Googling here.

And if anyone on this thread posts gossip and chatter they will first lose auto-approve status, the posts will be deleted and finally if that person does not stop they will be banned.

Software was changed to provide tighter security for this board, once someone is banned through this software they will stay banned.

Vera City:

For the record, I don't care about a "cultbuster" attacking me somewhere on the WWW, i.e. expressing a negative opinion.

There is specifically a "Flaming Web Sites Awards" page within the Ross Institute Web site where such attacks are noted.

See [www.culteducation.com]

Maybe the "cultbuster" pages you mention might be included there for an award.

Send me an email with the appropriate links and the pages will be considered for a Flaming Websites Award.

Otherwise stay on topic, which is Chris Butler and SoI.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/15/2008 10:54PM by rrmoderator.

I am in no way in control of what is and what is not posted on that site. Nor do I want to be. I have played third fiddle on that site on much of the decision making and have been extremely honored to be a part of it.

But you were not exactly innocent in this Rick regarding certain opinions that were formed about you.

You employ yourself in moderating a large number of threads on this forum on a wide variety of subjects. It would be impossible for you to know exactly the entire history of all the threads especially one as long as this. Nor were you in the cult as to gain an insight into who is genuine and who is attempting to mislead the readers. You upset certain individuals by defending cult apologists over people who had been actively, openly and whole-heartedly taking action against this cult. You did not accept the reasoning provided to you and only when undeniable proof that even a dog couldn't deny did you take action.

You've been had again, Rick by these individuals. I've provided you with clear evidence that Zelig and Vera are strickingly similar, that they alone have posted the same information in the exact same manner and that they even posted a story with the same sentences in it composed with the same words. There is no more obvious evidence than what I have delivered to you on a platter.

I don't think anyone is the slightest bit concerned as to what you post on the flame page. What is irksome is the fact this thread was ruined by the many trolls that have taken it over.

Zelig posted from many, many ISPs you said. Remember? You don't remember do you? Your security measures wouldn't mean anything. Don't forget where your loyalties should lie.

It remains to be seen if Chris Butler, aka Jagad Guru Siddhaswarupananda, founder of the Science of Identity cult will become the "Rev. Jeremiah Wright" for Mike Gabbard's political career -- to the point where he will be forced to distance himself from said guru, as Obama did with his long term mentor. The difference is that Rev. Wright did not condemn Obama to eternal spiritual hell and damnation for the deed, he just threw him under the political bus and called Obama a typical politician.

For Mike Gabbard (aka Krishna Katha das) to distance himself from his messiah, he is told that he will die spiritually forever and reincarnate as something awful. He could lie, like most politicians and say "not my guru" and still remain a follower too. I would like him to be forced up against the cult in public to the point he can't squirm out of it by playing the "multicultural card" or "private religious practices card". Public "blasphemy" of the fraud Chris Butler would be a nice campaign touch. It would be great if the people of Hawaii could learn to distinguish Chris Butler's cult from authentic religions*. Next election should be interesting.

*if there is such a thing as an authentic religion...
But there is such a thing as an authentic cult!

SoI Kills:

Your pre-approved status has been suspended.

Stay on topic and stop the flaming, which is in violation of the rules you agreed before posting here.

Again, the topic of this thread is Jagad Guru, Chris Butler, Science of Identity.