Dear Apollo,

thank you very much for all the work you have put into your recent postings.....there were some "telling" comments made about the JC's, weren't there!


Discussions about "the mark of the beast" and "people marked for division" and who had upset them were daily topics. They did not hold back on thier slating of others and i did not hear of anything being said in love for anyone outside of the group.

Kirstie capturing here how David has poisoned any "life" out of them.....and while,

short of re-engaging with the despised ex-members, they are finished!



Christ's commands to "hate" your father and mother, brother and sister (and so on and so forth) are made in relation to the importance of your "service to God" (God that is, not your service to McKay!)....demonstrating one must not allow this, to be overshadowed by the demands of even our close family...

However, no one is asked to hate their "father and mother" purely for the SAKE of hating their "father and mother"....that of course is no less than the fruit of DAVID's teaching, which Kirstie encountered on a day to day basis with the JC's in England...(Joe Johnson being a prime example).....and David knows well enough to deny this (while continuing to discreetly instruct as much!), as it is such a blatant prostitution of Christ's teachings......David's intention, being simply to "isolate" those trapped in his service from contrary advice.....as he saw practiced in the COG's!

... and even MORE , Christ DOES NOT require anyone to "forsake their family" in order to better "love" a demented old, self absorbed Rumplestiltskin, enriching him, by devoting years of your life, to selling his woe begone writings....(that otherwise would not see the light of day).....



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/27/2011 08:08PM by Malcolm Wesley WREST.

[forum.culteducation.com]

Quote
Apollo
This quote came from her comments section (where she talks to herself lol) she makes a comment about an elder member possibly dying of cancer..


''Apollo, that scotsman, is openly joining the death-ghouls who are hoping to see trouble and strife surround the elderly Jesus Christians, one of whom may be dying of cancer.''

This was taken from the Texas nutjob's blog back in November. I'm starting to believe there may have been some truth in this. It would certainly explain the uncharacteristic behaviour of McKay and his victims/followers over the last few months. The old sweetie wife has not made a single post for a couple of weeks now which is out of character. Of course this could all just be part of McKay's devious plan to fool his critics into believing the cult are no longer operating, but who knows, the end may be near....

We can but hope.....


....although I'd still prefer him to live long enough, to see all those once in enslavement to him, reject him, as they come to realize how he has completely misrepresented himself in order to take them for an utter "ride".....

...and I think it would be psychologically healthier for the current membership to grow to the point where they are able to "dump" a living McKay......

It would be interesting to find out how many victims/followers have rejected him and how many he has gained since this thread was created.

Moderator,

Are you still of the opinion that we have seen no solid evidence to suggest the JCs have disbanded?

Takatifu Gardens has apparently stopped their volunteer program and it's all gone very quiet (over all three forums, it has to be said) so i'd be interested to hear your thoughts.

I really don't know what to make of it all. I still don't trust McKay, that's for sure. It was only a few months ago he was trying to arrange a meeting with the Johnson family. They also had a huge dvd campaign only last summer in the hope of gaining new members. Something just doesn't quite add up here. If only we had someone who could check out Takatifu Gardens. That would possibly paint a better picture.

Sue and Roland contribute NOTHING but misery and their main victim is their own son, Danny. What kind of childhood has he had? Does he actually attend school every day or have they pulled the home schooling trick that many of these types of parents pull? I am revolted by the neglect and lack of care and concern for this young man and now seeing him pushed forward to become another media toy is sad.

I had hopes when Sue and Roland left the cult of McKay that they would try to lead more normal lives for the sake of their son but I see now they have just cult hopped around looking for some other cause that they could jump onto and get their faces back in the camera lens.

The way Sue behaved on the Wife Swap show truly showed her ugly combative personality and THAT doesn't make for a good mother.

I FULLY support them being investigated to ensure that Danny is getting the care and attention that is required for a young man. Nothing can give back his stolen childhood.

Another crime of McKay.

This is not off-topic, as I am responding to several posts already here on this thread....

Famous home-schooled children:

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· Richard Basseti - Governor of DE
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U.S. Supreme Court Judges

· John Jay

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Scientists

· George Washington Carver

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· Oliver Heaviside - physicist and electromagnetism researcher

· T.H. Huxley

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· Erik Demaine - Popular Science Mag: One of the Most Brilliant Scientists in America

Artists

· William Blake

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Religious Leaders

· Joan of Arc

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Inventors

· Alexander Graham Bell - invented the telephone

· John Moses Browning - firearms inventor and designer

· Peter Cooper - invented skyscraper, built first U.S. commercial locomotive

· Thomas Edison - invented the stock ticker, mimeograph, phonograph, and perfected the electric light bulb

· Benjamin Franklin - invented the lightning rod

· Elias Howe - invented sewing machine

· William Lear - airplane creator

· Cyrus McCormick - invented grain reaper

· Guglielmo Marconi - developed radio

· Eli Whitney - invented the cotton gin

· Sir Frank Whittle - invented turbo jet engine

· Orville and Wilbur Wright - built the first successful airplane

Composers

· Irving Berlin

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Writers

· Hans Christian Anderson

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· Charlotte Perkins Gilman

· Alex Haley

· Brett Harte

· L. Ron Hubbard

· C.S. Lewis

· Amy Lowell

· Gabriela Mistral

· Sean O'Casey

· Christopher Paolini - author of #1 NY Times bestseller, Eragon

· Isabel Paterson

· Beatrix Potter - author of the beloved Peter Rabbit Tales

· Carl Sandburg

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· Mattie J. T. Stepanek - 11-year-old author of Heartsongs

· Mercy Warren

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· Laura Ingalls Wilder

Educators

· Amos Bronson Alcott - innovative teacher, father of Louisa May Alcott

· Catharine Beecher - co-founder of the Hartford Female Seminary

· Jill Ker Conway - first woman president of Smith College

· Timothy Dwight - President of Yale University

· William Samuel Johnson - President of Columbia College

· Horace Mann - "Father of the American Common School"

· Charlotte Mason - Founder of Charlotte Mason College of Education

· Fred Terman - President of Stanford University

· Frank Vandiver - President of Texas A&M University

· Booker T. Washington - Founder of Tuskegee Institute

· John Witherspoon - President of Princeton University

Performing Artists

· Louis Armstrong - king of jazz

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· Hanson - sibling singing group

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· Yehudi Menuhin - child prodigy violinist

· Moffatts - Canadian version of Hanson

· Frankie Muniz - child actor

· LeAnne Rimes - teen-prodigy country music singer

· Barlow Girl - Alyssa, Rebecca, and Lauren Contemporary Christian Music

· Jonas Brothers - Kevin, Joe, and Nick Performers

· Jacob Clemente - Broadway Actor


Business Entrepreneurs

· Andrew Carnegie - wealthy steel industrialist

· Amadeo Giannini - Bank of America’s founder

· Horace Greeley - New York Tribune founder

· Soichiro Honda - creator of the Honda automobile company

· Peter Kindersley - book illustrator and publisher

· Ray Kroc - founder of McDonald's fast food restaurant chain

· Jimmy Lai - newspaper publisher; founder of Giordano International

· Dr. Orison Swett Marden - founder, Success magazine

· Adolph Ochs - New York Times founder

· Joseph Pulitzer - newspaper publisher; established Pulitzer Prize

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· Dave Thomas - founder of the Wendy’s restaurant chain

· Mariah Witcher - founder of Mariahs Famous Cookies

· Daniel Mills - founder of Salem Ridge Press



Others

· Abigail Adams - Wife of John Adams; mother of John Quincy Adams

· Ansel Adams - Photographer

· Susan B. Anthony - reformer and women’s rights leader

· John James Audubon - ornithologist and artist

· Clara Barton - Started the Red Cross

· Elizabeth Blackwell - first woman in the U.S. to receive a medical degree

· John Burroughs - Naturalist

· George Rogers Clark - Explorer

· Davy Crockett - frontiersman

· Eric Hoffer - social philosopher

· Sam Houston - lawyer; first president of the Republic of Texas

· Charles Evans Hughes - jurist; Chief Justice

· Mary D. Leakey - fossil hunter; wife of Richard Leakey

· Tamara McKinney - World Cup Skier

· Harriet Martineau - first woman sociologist

· Margaret Mead - cultural anthropologist

· John Stuart Mill - Free-market Economist

· Charles Louis Montesquieu - Philosopher

· John Muir - naturalist

· Florence Nightingale - Nurse

· Thomas Paine - political writer during the American Revolution

· Bill Ridell - Newspaperman

· Will Rogers - Humorist

· Bertrand Russell - Logician

· Jim Ryan - World Runner

· Albert Schweitzer - Physician

· Sir Ernest Shackleton - Explorer

· Herbert Spencer - philosopher, sociologist

· Gloria Steinem - founder and long-time editor of Ms. magazine

· Jason Taylor - plays in the National Football League

· Mary Walker - Civil War physician; recipient of the Congressional Medal of Honor

· Lester Frank Ward - "Father of American Sociology"

· Martha Washington - wife of George Washington

· Frances E. C. Willard - educator, temperance leader, and suffragist

· Frank Lloyd Wright - Architect

· Elijah ben Solomon Zalman - Jewish scholar

· Balaram Stack - Award winning Surfer

· Lia Del Priore - Award Winning Gymnast

· Taylor Gladstone - Ballerina

Quote
AbundantLifeNow
I had hopes when Sue and Roland left the cult of McKay that they would try to lead more normal lives for the sake of their son

So what is your idea of a more normal life?

This is a forum about cults. Living a radical life is not the same as a cult. I fear that the shift here is muddying the waters between people who chose to live a radical life, and people who are cult leaders.

From what I understand, people who choose to lead a radical life are rich pickings for a cult leader.

That is what makes cults evil, they prey upon people with a vision for a different world.

But the world needs people who are radical, and if those people are free from a cult, then they can continue the radical, anti-mainstream ideals which were preyed upon by the cult leader.

Grace is a good example.

Let's leave those who wish to lead a radical life out of the cult equation, and concentrate upon the cult leaders who prey upon them.

Dear Apollo,

You are asking for "solid evidence".......but the JC's HAVEN'T disbanded(yet)....even if they are in the process of "disintegrating"....this will take approx. 12 -18 months in my opinion.....(the process started last November...you are welcome to set your "clock")...I would think it unreasonable to expect them to "recover" from McKay by immediately re contacting family they formerly eschewed, and seeking to establish themselves in "careers" and "lives" of their own, of the sort that we might lead.....What you are asking for (solid evidence proving that something doesn't exist).....is not available yet.

Although I note:

The websites (UK listeners and the JC site) have "collapsed"...."Takatifu Gardens" requires cross subsidization...it would face "closure" once they stopped distributing in "bulk" as was the case previously....McKay no longer goes to the trouble of travelling the world to "cheer on the troops" (he of course intends to keep every cent of the secure govt. income he is on for himself...."forsaking all" and "having all things in common" was the "model" he cahmpioned only when the efforts of the slave labour paid for it all.....he would never go to the expense of self funding his travels as an "Apostle"!)

The November date as the Wiki entry stated...may have been little more than an attempt to avoid liability, as the JC's would potentially face prosecution for misuse of the funds that were meant to be directed into an account benefitting Rheinehardt (but were instead purged on a cruise among other things),...hence the JC's may have only"officially" disappeared, in order to remain an "underground" organization.....

I would still see this all, as the beginning of the end for McKays' day to day influence over his "flock".....

The German Third Reich didn't "collapse" after the D-Day landings, or the loss of Tobruk, or the surrender in Stalingrad....




....in the sense that they become "free" of the perspectives that McKay inculculated in them....( I doubt that they will as quickly move out of the "counter-culture" scene....but they will be independent of McKay think....