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Blackhat
Apollo, it is refreshing to see your responses to things you are newly finding out about how DaveJC has manipulated a group of people to do things which shock the moral core of most decent people, and in the name of following Jesus!

I will admit that I have become numb to these things over time, repeated confrontation to these acts can have that effect. Ho hum, yes he persuaded them to do whippings, ho hum, yes he used group dynamics to elicit kidney donations, ho hum, yes he recruited young people, ho hum, yes, he used a false identity to try to get media publicity. Ho hum, yes he used his forum to argue his points and grind down genuine people, ho hum, yes he made false accusations against numerous people, ho hum, yes he used "they hate Jesus" to diminish and demonise anyone who disagreed with him.....

Your natural disgust with what you are finding out is a breath of fresh air, and perhaps useful to any newcomers who might be on their first investigation of this now defunct Dave McKay Cult.

When you are exposed to something for a long time, even as an outsider and opponent, I find you can become normalised to the things you are seeing. Thank you for bringing a fresh moral outrage to the forum.

Thank you Blackhat,

I'm glad i can be of assistance. You can thank Dave McKay (former member of the notorious ''Children of God'') for my presence. Had Dave made more of an effort to treat me with courtesy and respect and been less paranoid and defensive i would probably have just dismissed the JCs as some 'wacky religious group' and forgotten about them within a couple of days. As it was however, Dave's defensiveness and paranoia left me feeling inquisitive. The more i looked into the group the more shocked i became and the clincher for me was the Johnson's story. After reading about the Johnnon's there really was no way back. I imagine it would be very difficult for anyone to completely forget about the JCs after reading the Johnson's story, and the sad thing is the Johnson's are just one of many families who have been ripped apart by this dangerous cult.

I know i'm not an ex member or someone who has friends or family in the cult but i genuinely care about people and that's why i'm here. Dave McKay is a danger to society and the more people who know that the better.

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zeuszor

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Apollo
Alf and one of the twins receive whippings in part 2. We can now add this to the whippings in Florida and Kenya, quite a collection they have now.

Um, I think you mean that the whippings were in Kenya and California. And don't forget the recent whipping on behalf of Falun Gong, done in Australia but broadcast in China.

[www.ntdtv.com]

And still I have no December newsletter...

Sorry, my mistake. Thank you for correcting that Zeuszor.

I take it the Johnson's house was in Florida? I think that's why i'm getting mixed up.

OK, here's my THEORY...

In The Last Days, the group was beset by financial crisis. (Yes, a cult based on living without money!). Dave chose to blow all the settlement money from the Johnsons on a luxury cruise, a Bacchanalian celebration of Dave's Almighty Glory. I can't believe that there weren't murmurings among the genuine followers that this was a gross and money-worshipping decision, to blow money on the very luxuries their whole personal philosophies viewed as "dancing with the Devil"......

Soon after that, many members left, and the cult split into small unsustainable cells. There was not enough people power in each cell to maintain the street presence to get the doney money to pay the bills.

Then Dave told them to go on outreaches without money, and many members spent weeks living in appalling conditions on the road, with no money or shelter. (I presume Dave was tucked up warmly in bed while they did this "to test their faith" or whatever justification for bankruptcy he gave them.....)

Then (my THEORY continues) Dave had the bright idea of saving himself from the grumbling troops by gaining another windfall. He would sue other people, and get more MONEY (you know, that thing which the Jesus Christians are against!).
So he re-engaged his Scientology lawyers to examine this site, and his own. They must have charged a bucket for the advice. And my guess is that they told him that not only did he not have a case, but that his own site was wide-open to counter-charges.

That's when the proverbial hit the fan. Members were faced with a huge legal bill from the lawyers, as well as no chance of creating any kind of cash-flow to sustain the now split and diminishing communities, each of which lacked the people power to bring in enough MONEY from off the streets, let alone Dave's personal pressure to urge them on.

So my THEORY goes that the Jesus Christians membership fell below the critical mass it takes to sustain a community without MONEY when they can't bring in enough MONEY.....

Dave and Cherry have the pension in Australia. How they can claim it after all Dave has preached to others is something which never ceases to amaze me. A person who sent young people out into the wilderness to survive without food or shelter, in the name of living without money, is going to be tucked up comfortably in the Australian MONEY that goes to pensioners.......



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 12/02/2010 08:43PM by Blackhat.

Hi Mal,

I'd say there's a huge possibility Denise played a keyrole in the downfall of the cult. I haven't been here from day one so i don't know the full story with regards to Denise but as far as i'm aware she initially attacked McKay (former member of the notorious ''Children of God'') before turning her attention to other targets. Now as we all know McKay directed Denise towards these targets, that is obvious. He is highly skilled in control and manipulation and Denise is just another example of that. When Denise was attacking McKay i believe he saw potential. He saw a vulnerable and lonely old lady who could potentially do his dirty work. All he had to do was offer his friendship, and as they say, the rest is history. He seemed to go against everything he 'claims' to believe in as he sat back and watched Denise make attack after attack, even some poor innocent music teacher felt the wrath of this woman but even so, McKay brushed it under the carpet. His agenda was far more important than the feelings or reputation of some music teacher he doesn't even know. This wouldn't have gone unnoticed by his followers. His obsession with the 'hate sites' also wouldn't have gone unnoticed. Whilst the rest of the cult were out there 'serving Jesus', Dave was spending hour after hour sitting in front of a computer, desperately trying to protect his huge ego. Perhaps his followers finally woke up and realised it's all about Dave. Ultimately i think that may have been his downfall..



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/02/2010 08:52PM by Apollo.

The Gianstefani's leaving was the first sign that all wasn't well in the cult. We're talking about two people who from the outside looked fully commited to the cult. Ultimately the cult had ripped their soul out. As far as i could see they were properties of Dave McKay (former member of the notorious ''Children of God''). We saw how awful they both came across on the tv shows. Roland looked like someone who was unable to show any kind of emotion. Sue just seemed like a very angry lady. We all saw the way she hounded that young girl over a banana. Even on the JK show she sat there rolling her eyes and even attacked a young lady who had been abused in the Children of God.

The fact they had the courage to leave the cult is a great credit to them. It would have been a huge blow to McKay, whom i'm sure had huge plans for young Dan. Something seriously has gone wrong with this cult and that may have been the beginning of the end.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/02/2010 09:22PM by Apollo.

I agree. They were his showpiece doney money champions. They stood as a measure of how much money you could get off the streets.

I notice Alex's thread which read ''Are The Jesus Christians Regrouping?'' has suddenly disappeared.. hmmmmmmmmm

Blackhat do you have any idea roughly how much money they were able to take in on an average day?

Well spotted. Curiouser and curiouser.

Enough to fly people all over the world, willy-nilly, until the microchip in passports came in, and Dave decreed that as you come up to renew your passport, and it has a microchip, you don't get a new passport.....another factor......