mistake please edit



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/07/2010 03:36AM by zeuszor.

What is the psychological process at work here called? "Repression," I think. This helps to account for why the word "cult" fails ever to appear there.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/07/2010 05:44AM by zeuszor.

Dear Zeuszor,

I suppose I was "fortunate" to have seen that period of time, when David was just gaining the confidence to be able to defraud people in his own right (and not simply through piggybacking directly off Berg)...hence I have the advantage of some "perspective" over the regrettable development of both him personally and his larger religious empire...if as you say, Zeuszor, the use of the word "cult" appears to have been (subconsciously?) avoided on the xjcs.jcs site...then yes that would certainly strike me as "repression".....

(.......some serious "wishful thinking" might be a kinder interpretation).....

....but then again, I of course, DO have the presumptious gall to believe that Kevin and company DO NOT have any "special insights" into the working of the JC's that I do not....thus "coloring" my views

(Hence I stand by my assessment that to date there has not been a WHIT of evidence of any change "for the better" in McKay...say Cherry McKay being grudgingly permitted to mail a birthday card, or what have you, to her grandchildren, having no significance at all, in the wider scheme of things of a major "change of heart" in David McKay....)

NOR do I believe that has Kevin "suffered" any more than anyone else and thus "earned" the right to "seniority" either in the ranks of any former JC's or in relation to the "authority" of his opinion....

NOR would it seem to me that his desire to see the "family" he once knew, triumphantly reunited in a victory of "love and understanding" should have priority over the exposure of McKay's practises of leveraging material gain for himself through fraud, false pretences and extortion, by the psychologically manipulative prostitution of scripture.....

(However once McKay is no longer in a position to threaten other young people with entrapment into unconscionable serivitude....then by all means, let Kevin enjoy whatever "improved relations" with his Father may one day be possible....I again acknowledge, that Kevin is largely in this position as he has bravely "spoken up" on other occasions...)

(WARNING...helmets on!.... incoming "flak"....)

.... completely unreasonably though, as I chose to leave McKay and in 1985 when I physically departed (emotionally and intellectually...quite some years later), when Kevin was more or less little more than one of my "oppressors" in the JC's at the time, no doubt smirking along with David at the contemptible Malcolm Wrest who's satanic "streak of independence" had lead him to irreversibly turn his back on the Kingdom of Heaven...

As ABSOLUTELY EVERYTHING Kevin steadfastly believed in, and lived and hoped for at that time, every paradigm by which he judged the world has since turned out be just so much effluent gushing out of McKay...Kevin's entire "universe" collapsing in on itself..and considering that my own "observations" at the same period (say that McKay treats those who would follow Christ like so much shit) would seem to me to have been largely proven by time to be accurate....

I would appreciate a little humility from Kevin and company in the judgments they make of my own unique "approach" to McKay.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 03/07/2010 02:47PM by Malcolm Wesley WREST.

Anytime you are ready, Kevin, I've got my evidence on hand.

Kevin and/or his brother have tried to get the RR message board thread on the JCs closed and deleted from public view, have tried to get the entry on the JCs removed from RR's database, and have tried to get my YouTube videos removed.

The McKays seem to want to get all of this material removed from the public record and for us all to pretend like the JCs do not exist.

Sorry Kevin, everything cannot be on your terms. You are not in charge here. We must protect the public interest, from where I sit it appears that you have done very little to protect it.

Your primary goal it seems to me, has actually been to stifle free discussion and shut up your father's critics.

It really makes me angry; I initiated something more than three years ago that apostate was supposedly too scared to initiate himself.

It was I who originally took that information to the Long Beach PD and the FBI because Craig asked me to.

He said that he was too close to the situation and therefore had to be protected from the direct repercussions.

Apostate contacted me via the Rick Ross Cult Education Forum private-message system in September of '06 (the month after I left TFI, and while I was involved with the TFI thread there at RR) and asked me whether I'd agree to take some information pertaining to the JCs' imminent Long Beach stunt to certain agencies within United States law enforcement.

This I did agree to do, and so then reported said information to the Long Beach PD and the Long Beach counter-terrorism unit, through one Detective Ashabi. Also I reported the information to a Los Angeles field office of the Federal BI.

Apostate wanted me to do what I was doing at first, until Kyoo came along and we started working together, teamed up, and then all of a sudden it's NO BRIAN, YOU'VE GOT TO STOP from them.

At their request, because I am a nice guy who wanted to help them, I stood in the breach for Craig and his brother-in-law at first and then, at the end of the day, when we've set the house on fire so to speak, they want to make ME out to be the bad guy.

Guess what? I've been with this from the very beginning, and I'll be with it to the very end. Most people would have quit long ago, but Brian is nothing if not persistent.

Like I've always said, it's like their real goal is not really to stop DM at all.

What exactly is their goal, if not to stop him???

I took that information about Long Beach to the damn FBI for him, because he was too scared to do it himself.

They make ME out to be the bad guy??? They call ME a vigilante, a nutcase, they make fun of me? They gave me the information to take to the Long Beach PD in the summer of 2006 IN THE FIRST PLACE.

IMO it's all about Kevin's trying to maintain control of what gets said and who gets to say here. The "Free Discussion" thing is a sham, a smokescreen.

Some people have called me a hero because of all of this, and really respect what I have done and am trying to do, and so this is why I really do not give a tin whistle about what Kevin, his brother-in-law, or his uncle think of me.

At least I (we) did something other than talk. All Kevin did was try and influence and regulate the conversation as much as possible. IMO he's as controlling in his own way as his father, and the apple does not fall far from the tree.

In fancy psychological talk, one might say that DM is Kevin's introject.



Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 03/07/2010 10:44PM by zeuszor.

"What exactly is their goal, if not to stop him???"

One has to wonder, eh? Do we even have a "goal"? Do we even need a "goal"?

What exactly are we doing with our life, if we are not hell bent on "stopping" someone?

Could it being living?

My goal all along has been to undermine the recruiting efforts of DM and the the JCs. As long as DM or his lackeys are not traveling the world trying to mentally kidnap somebody else's child, then that's more or less all that I am interested in with respect to this thing. It is not part of my agenda to help reconcile Kevin with his parents. I do not feel like I owe him any deference just because of his name. My agenda is more along along the lines of education and prevention, to the end of undermining the JCs' success at recruiting/stealing other people's kids/family members, and not so much trying to get those who are in, out.

Buddy, I'll tell you what I am doing with my life right now: I am presently a full-time student of social psychology and am attending a fine university. Last semester I earned all As. As a matter of fact, I'm "living large." I have a full and satisfying social life and a nice lady friend; therefore, I really have better things to do than worry about what some crazy old fart like David McKay has been doing for attention lately. He's pretty well sunk, anyway, "taken out," so to speak.

So what if I spend a couple of hours a week keeping up with the JCs and contributing to this message board? It hardly overwhelms my life, and does not interfere with it at all.

In my opinion, anybody that thinks that it's possible to get through to DM with "logic and reason" or some form of "negotiation" is like unto a person who thinks that it's possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.

And before somebody tells me to "go get some help" again, know this: in the last year and a half or so, I have been in over two hundred hours of psychotherapy, and take medication for anxiety. For the better part of a year (fifty-one weeks to be exact) I was in three sessions a week, along with biweekly support groups. Then gradually down to one session a week, and now I am down to two a month (plus the biweekly groups). I have been in a lot of therapy, and study psychology.

Hell, at the risk of sounding cocky, if it weren't for me, then this whole thing would have stalled out long ago. For a start, I have been a constant. You know there will be something there because Zeuszor will have written something. I have kept this alive. I've found out lots of facts and documents, and have put a convincing case forward. I have put tons of information on DM and the JCs into the public domain, and then Kevin and his brother try and get it removed from the public domain. But that's the great thing about the Internet: it's damn near impossible to get a persistent person to shut up when they are broadcasting online.

As the saying goes, there's something rotten in Denmark.

Another thing: by stating that he is trying to communicate with DM by using "logic and reason," Kevin is implying that anybody that does not do things his way is neither logical nor reasonable. It's kind of like DM saying "...but for the intelligent person..." which implies that anybody who disagrees with his opinions is not intelligent. It's just a way of trying to get others to see and do things his way, basically manipulating people by subtly degrading those with whom he disagrees and making himself seem morally and intellectually superior. These are the same kinds of cognitive tricks that his dad uses. Hammer/nail.

NOR do I believe that has Kevin "suffered" any more than anyone else and thus "earned" the right to "seniority" either in the ranks of any former JC's or in relation to the "authority" of his opinion....

I could not agree more, Malcolm. Sure, Kevin is traumatized, and I feel bad for him, but so is everybody else who was ever under the control of DM. Still the fact of his trauma does not make it right for him to try and erase history, and lie about and obscure details of his father's past.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/08/2010 09:40AM by zeuszor.

Watch you don't chip your teeth on the bone you are chewing Zeus.

What does that mean? BTW, it's zeuszor.

I think Jeremy Kyle....(God bless the man's soul!)....did get it right when he noted that David has been "spectacularly unsuccessful" in his predation.....(lying to himself that his numbers are small due to his stress on the "purity" of his flock, is as pathetic an excuse as one could imagine!)

Would any other cult have failed to attract membership were they to get the publicity that David has manafactured for his little sect of the COG's......I rather doubt it!!

The numbers have "stabilized" and will then "decline" as the group splinters as David ages and loses grip (both adminstratively and mentally)...and he'll watch everything he spent his life on,...disappear before his very eyes.

What a pleasure it is to have the freedom to be able to pursue the goals in life (obediance to God and living in Christian comunity) that McKay lies his empire in any way represents.....