lily rose. Thank you. I especially liked the following:

King James and the Cult of the Bishops ----- As one peruses the King James’ rendering of these Scriptures in Hebrews, it appears, at least it seems this way to this author, to be a deliberate attempt by those who were in power (King James [16031625] and his bishops) to strengthen their hold on usurped authority, an authority traced all the way back to Henry the Eighth (1509-1547)—the Divine Right of Kings.

--------------

I have always been intrigued by the story about Benjamin Franklin changing Thomas Jefferson’s wording in the Declaration of Independence from, “We hold these truths to be sacred and undeniable” to “We hold these truths to be self-evident.”

The usurpers mentioned above practically cheat their way into a divine endorsement for their supposed authority by translation through preferred nuances when creating their King James Version. Franklin, in his genius, wanted nothing to do with a divine biblical appeal, but took a stand against tyranny based on rational, enlightened, self-evident truth.

There is much to learn. Thanks again.

Tmason Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Changed,
> Was Bob M the father of one Sandy M?

Yes

Tmason Wrote:

> I recall my father getting "confirmation" for us
> to move to the middle of the desert and attempt to
> mine gold from the Nevada sand. He sought
> confirmation for every move we ever made; like a
> good soldier would.
> When the effort in the MEADOW VALLEY WASH failed
> we were literally left stranded and broke. We
> lived in a motel in Tucson and scrapped by until
> we moved east. We had made a break from TLW only
> to rejoin in DC where Dan Statton was the pastor.

This mine debacle happened just before I joined. From what I've read about the situation from various posters here, John was involved with his son-in-law in the company and also promoted the venture to his congregants--many who invested a good portion of their life savings. Of course, it turned out to be a fraud, and his son-in-law spent time in prison as a result. During the trial, John was allegedly in Shiloh, and never testified. I've never heard whether he took any responsibility for his role in convincing people to invest.
BTW, if this is inaccurate, please correct--anyone with first-hand knowledge. Who knows--perhaps John too was victimized by his son-in-law, which if that was the case, doesn't reflect well on his claim of being a manifestation of Christ--who "knew all men."
John 2:24

FCSLC Wrote:

> Can anyone on this forum give chapter and verse to
> debunk the above “irrational thinking?” I
> think time, history and personal stories on this
> forum prove that it’s BS, I still think more is
> needed. It would be prudent to have a scripture
> or two to use when an inspired newbie (child or
> grandchild) wants to jump off the cliff.


Hi FCSLC,
When it comes to the assumption by TLWF leader that shepherding involved meddling, I mean involvement, in every aspect of a 'sheep's' life, I always refer to this scripture (below). Ironically, John, in the Unfolding and Unwrapping messages, was leaning away from the heavy-handed sheperhding approach to the 'sheep'--at least when it came to the third generation. Of course, in some cases, it seemed to lead to them being a law unto themselves. BTW, given the tone of those messages, I find it hard to believe Hargrave listened to them so intently, claiming to have heard one particular message 30 times (I guess he was counting).

"Be shepherds of God's flock that is under your care, watching over them--not because you must, but because you are willing, as God wants you to be; not pursuing dishonest gain, but eager to serve;

not lording it over those entrusted to you, but being examples to the flock."
1 Peter 5:2-3

Thank you changedagain. That is a good verse to remember. Maybe we should make the words “submission, rule, obey, authority” slaves to this verse.

{{We refuse to acknowledge or in any way acquiesce to the demands of “submission, rule, obey, authority” unless they operate in a very restricted scope under the auspices of 1 Peter 5:2-3.}}

Better still; maybe we should throw it all out and enjoy the boon of being “a law unto ourselves.”

Thanks, changed.

FCSLC Wrote:

> Better still; maybe we should throw it all out and
> enjoy the boon of being “a law unto
> ourselves.”


Ha--I think we've earned it!

272,093 page views to date...

Several mentioned their relationship with Dan Statton, and I just wanted to say how much I appreciated him and his family during their time in Des Moines in the 70’s. All of them added a touch of class to our local church and were so kind to others in their relating. Dan was especially good to the young people and a great example and encouragement to me personally. Although I know he got crossways with TLWF leadership later on (so did I for that matter), He will always be special to me, even though he is no longer around. I was blessed to wear many of his hand-me-down lawyer shirts as a teenager/twenty-something – which was still a step up for a construction worker.

Something I don’t think anyone has really mentioned is the impact that an adulterous and idolatrous relationship with Marilyn had on our personal marriages and relationships with God. For a wife to play second fiddle to another woman in a marriage was never God’s intention. Many marriages were destroyed by following Marilyn – starting with John’s. Neither was it God’s intention to have another human in between us and Himself pretending to be God and taking His place. It sabotaged both key relationships in life from becoming what they were meant to be and in the end only provided dust in the wind.

I remember being asked by a shepherd about a personal directive from Marilyn, and if I had discussed it with my wife yet. I was shocked that he would even have to ask – I was “given” to Marilyn – not my wife. I didn’t even really care what my wife thought – I was doing what Marilyn said – with or without her. In hindsight, that was so wrong on so many levels – and so unfair to my wife. She should have been first – not Marilyn. I wouldn’t even dream of that now – I can see my wife’s talons coming out over a woman that wanted to violate our marriage - and she's a very kind and caring person. That was such a perversion! Too bad I could not see it at the time. So much for the ministries marrying Marilyn. Run that by other Christian leaders and see what kind of response you get. When I mention to my wife about changing God’s name to Marilyn’s name in worship songs, she can’t even imagine in her wildest dreams how we could get so far off track. In hindsight, I was so given to her control and yet I honestly had no clue to what she was like as a person – it was all just a fantasy. I didn’t even know her, just that I was driven to obey whatever she said, as though it was God speaking.

Larry although the LW came up with some far fetched ideas that led to divorce among the congregation, the good news is that even though God said he hates divorce, God does not hate those who are divorced. There's no condemnation. Furthermore, God doesn't always heal marriages just as he doesn't always heal physical illness. So, again, despite what the LW might say, there is no condemnation if a marriage fails and isn't healed.

PS: I think it was Holder not JRS's son in law who went to prison for the mine fraud.

kBOY Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> HEADBANGER NEWS: Frontal Lobotomy,
> Please
>
> Exchange Your Paradigm For His Truth
> January 8, 2017
>
> [www.garyandmarilynhargrave.com]
> ange-your-paradigm-for-his-truth/
>
> "This fellowship has a Word (from what
> credible source?) to become the family of
> God and a prophetic community."
>
> "What does it mean to be a prophet? How do we
> become the prophetic community God is looking
> for?" (TLW is obviously clueless.)
>
> "We need a renewing of our minds (Ephesians
> 4:22-24)." (It has worked so well thus
> far.)
>
> "There are concepts and paradigms in our minds
> (like ruling and reigning to an abusive
> level?) that can block us from becoming
> and creating what the Lord wants."
>
> "There is nothing more dangerous than wrong
> paradigms (really?); they control
> our reactions to the world around us." (Like
> being under the control of TLW
> leadership?)
>
> "If we are going to be prophets (is this
> still in question?), we need to let the
> Lord wash us of our paradigms and be transformed
> by the renewing of our minds (Romans 12:2)."
>
> "As we pray in the Spirit and behold Him, He
> exchanges the lies with His truth and His truth
> sets us free." (How well has that worked
> thus far?)

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"If we are going to be prophets we need to let the Lord wash us of our paradigms and be transformed by the renewing of our mind."

This is what they call (I think) a paradigm shift. You wash the old wrong Manifested Sons of God paradigm out of your hair, become transformed by the renewing of your mind through another 50 years of tithing and mind control and voila... the leaders repackage the old wrong Manifested Sons of God paradigm into a new prophetic community paradigm.