I am starting to see the picture change a little. Perhaps John Robert Stevens got involved with Marilyn because the two complimented one another. Perhaps it is as you say Lily Rose, the Walk may have always been rogue.

When John AND Martha bought Grace Chapel with THEIR own money, perhaps Martha thought they were building a church, and John was building the stage for him to be the star, in the spotlight, with the loving entourage and the little people bowing down and hanging on every word. Maybe he just found a "spiritual wife" he was always looking for. JRS put Marilyn over the production of the tapes way back in 1963, he always thought highly of her.

JRS said one time I understand, that he had a dream about a younger man taking over the Walk and being a tyrant. Actually he put that combination together, he did it himself, the creation of Gary and Marilyn's rule was all on him. They didn't need a video of JRS doing it, it was understood, the Walk the sequel is just the same old Walk, there is no separation.

I think one of the big differences btwn the JRS and G&M rule was that JRS was more "silver linings" and said he had faith for all men and if you looked around the Valley Church it sure was a motely crew of people, young and old. Many hanger-ons and ex-hippies living on the farm. But JRS embraced them all and thought that if you listened to his tapes 24/7 you could change. That may be why some folks think it was a garden.

From the Nichol's book, if accurate, it appears the spiritual wife from 1962-1965 or later was Ruth Klein as Nichols says that the spiritual wife's husband was sent as the apostle to the San Francisco area. That's not to say that later on Marilyn didn't become a spiritual wife. One of the main responsibilities of the Blix house was to carry the "battle for JRS" and be in continual intercession for him and maybe a lot of blurred lines were formed. JRS was highly protective of the Blix workers and didn't tolerate criticism of them. I think, JRS knew that some ministries didn't warm up to M.

AD, did you know that when F. Frangipane confronted JRS about M being a Jezebel that Frangipane was removed from the church by JRS?

changedagain, back in the day if you were on facebook I would have read your posts every day while wondering in my own wilderness.

This thread has been talking alot about things that happened years ago.

But I would like to point out to you all that these bahavior patterns have not stopped. There continues to be affairs, "spiritual wives", abused sheep and womanizing conducted by the leadership even now. Perhaps they've just gotten better at hiding it now.

Lily Rose said:
AD, did you know that when F. Frangipane confronted JRS about M being a Jezebel that Frangipane was removed from the church by JRS?

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I had heard that before. I wrote Frangepane an email and asked him about that, but he never answered it. He doesn't actually know me, I had talked to him in email about something else before but it had been awhile. He might have thought I was somebody that he didn't want to speak with for some reason.

I have always wondered if that were true Lily Rose. Do you know Frangepane, and if so, did he tell you that is what happened? If not, is there anything written down somewhere where I could read about it on the internet?

You can read Francis Frangipane’s version of attempting to talk with John Stevens about John’s relationship with Marilyn in his own words in “The Three Battlegrounds” or “The Jezebel Spirit”. Although one cannot help but notice the similarities between the way Jezebel and Marilyn functioned – especially since he is specifically talking about Marilyn – I’m not convinced the labeling provides us a great service. Men and women seem to take on a larger than life appearance when they are given special names – good or bad. Being called “The Apostle to the Kingdom”, “Door Opener Apostle”, ”Lamp of Israel”, “Jezebel”, or "Pope" for that matter, all tend to stir up visions of grandeur that is used to control others. When you finally come back to your senses, none of it is true. There is no actual power there except what you give them. We were taught to be open to spiritual oppression by following the teaching of men, when in fact there actually is spiritual immunity when we obey Jesus’ teachings. God was constantly trying to get His people not to dabble in occult stuff – the “wisdom of the ancients”. I don't need to look any further than my own life to see the results of both.

It's good to see you back Larry Bobo. I'll take a look at those books.

If you goggle Stark and Van Deventer the Jezebel Spirit, you can find this article which includes a critique of F. Frangipane's books on Jezebel.

Apostle Dog Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I am starting to see the picture change a little.
> Perhaps John Robert Stevens got involved with
> Marilyn because the two complimented one another.
> Perhaps it is as you say Lily Rose, the Walk may
> have always been rogue.

___________________________________________________________

AD,

I never said the Walk was rogue. I have spent a bit of time answering your questions, so please don't misquote me. Thank you very much for understanding this.

One thing has not changed through the years -- the belief that the LWF is always on "the front lines." First they were different because they were not the old order. Then they had the Apostle. When others started to claim they had apostles, they claimed that they were still different because they had the Apostle to the Kingdom." They had the Apostle who saw 7 years into the Kingdom. Then they had Marilyn who was Christ in the flesh. Now they are boasting that they have sent of Gary's tapes and literature to Pope Francis and they are on the front line of promoting oneness among all the churches in the earth. They called month-long sessions of intercession for America prior to Presidential elections. Then the Sunday following the election, Gary asked them how many of them were disappointed in the results. Almost everyone, Marilyn included, raised her hand. Gary's consoling word was that they were never called to just influence America -- they are supposed to be the prophetic community that rules the nations. And now they have their own Shiloh University, which will be different from every other university in the world.

Perhaps instead of pumping each other up for decades they could have started with a simple pledge, like doctors take: "First, do no harm."

Well said, Saw. Also, I understand that G&M have taken a strong stand against same-sex marriage. My impression is that Marilyn has always been extremely homophobic. To the point of kicking her own daughter out of the fellowship.

"They will know we are Christians by our love"