You know, when you think about it, it's hard to condense it all, the Walk, like any denomination, movement, whatever one wants to define it as, it's hard to take it all in as to what exactly it was about. Probably each local church had it's own personality, it's own flavor, and then it gets to the various states, and the various sections of the country, northeast, southeast, southwest. Just think of how the theology of the movement mixed with the various customs of the areas, it all came out to be several concoctions, if you see what I mean. I guess that is the way it is with every type of Christian movement or ideology. I never met JRS, never been in the room when he brought a message. I would listen to a sermon and I would THINK I knew what the man was talking about, but if you don't see his mannerisms, his facial expression, it's hard to tell if things said really meant something else. That is the way it is listening to anybody.

Lily Rose said: "But of course at the time his priority and agenda was sons and bringing forth male ministries just by laying hands on them. As we learned later, that didn't really work out."

That, laying hands on somebody to impart or loose them into things they did not study for, they did not grow into through experience or just maturity that comes by hard knocks and repentance. That is straight out of the Latter Rain handbook. You are right, it don't work out at all. Oh, it is in the bible, that Apostles laying hands on people and imparting spiritual gifts, but it is also in the bible where Paul told Timothy not to "lay hands on anyone suddenly," meaning not to set in motion the ministry in someone that is not mature enough to walk in it. And, as you know Paul warned that by doing so, Timothy would be a partaker of the sins this young immature minister would do.

Apostle Dog Wrote:
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>
>
> That observation was more about what I witnessed
> in the churches that I was in. That really wasn't
> about JRS. It' was more the local elders and
> people in general.


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Definitely encountered a few dinosaurs, I mean elders, some of whom I wouldn't ever want covering me with their mumbo jumbo. That probably sounded mean but you would have had to of been there.

While were talking about sexism, I'd like to mention the "kill the male spirit" policy that Marilynn started up in the mid 90's. This is where the wife would be set in as the head of the family and the husband had to submit to her as "christ in the flesh". This was done with couples where the wife was more loyal to G&M than the husband.

Lily Rose, what years were you in the Walk? Were you in the Southern California churches? Did you know JRS? If so, what were your impressions? I didn't go out there until 1983 or so, whenever that meeting was that Marilyn called after Stevens died. I would like to know more about JRS. What he was like. My son met him, in fact they shot firecrackers together at Shiloh when he was a little kid.

You asked me what percentage I thought John's ministry was of God. I ask you the same thing. I wonder what the Living Word Fellowship would have been like, had JRS obeyed God had actually stayed away from that doctrine instead of separating himself from the rest of the Latter Rain movement and creating a version of it of his own.

paleface Wrote:
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> While were talking about sexism, I'd like to
> mention the "kill the male spirit" policy that
> Marilyn started up in the mid 90's. This is
> where the wife would be set in as the head of the
> family and the husband had to submit to her as
> "christ in the flesh". This was done with couples
> where the wife was more loyal to G&M than the
> husband.

Yes, one of the signs of a man having a 'male spirit' is that he refused to submit himself completely to Marilyn and Gary.
I was subjected to various power trips, I mean disciplinary dealings of the lord, during this time period to purge me of my male spirit. One way I managed to get back in favor was providing more free labor for the maintenance of various churches and a Hargrave home. That was an effective tactic on my part.

Paleface I agree with you, I think if Marilyn has done what I have read she has done, come against God’s order for families by making the wife not only the head of the families, but a copy of herself, she has done what she did to JRS, the Living Word Fellowship, to Hargrave, she has proven to be Jezebel in the flesh. I think more than any factor, Marilyn did more harm than JRS, Hargrave, any of the “shepherds” in any of the churches, I think she was the Yoko Ono of the Walk.

Apostle Dog,

For most of the time I was in the Walk through out the 70's in the California Churches my impression was that JRS was a Man of God and of course he had charisma. But that impression changed by 1980 as I saw more control and manipulation occurring (not love) in the way people were being treated including the way I was being controlled. I think I was disillusioned. I wasn't that smart but I think I started to snap out of it and recognize that the Walk didn't really have a corner on being Christ's remnant and that much of went on was politics and power. I think I was coming to the conclusion that much of what JRS was preaching ( which later I learned was latter rain) was empty words. And now I recognize that's because much of the teaching was from man, not God. Most ministries were impressed with his gift in ministering and reading people. Maybe it came from God or a psychic skill, but I don't think that skill necessarily makes one a Man of God. I think the Walk as a movement came from man, not God.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/07/2015 12:52AM by lily rose.

Apostle Dog Wrote:
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> I never met JRS, never been in the room when he brought a
> message. I would listen to a sermon and I would
> THINK I knew what the man was talking about, but
> if you don't see his mannerisms, his facial
> expression, it's hard to tell if things said
> really meant something else. That is the way it is
> listening to anybody.


________________________________________________________________

Sometimes I listen to a preacher on the radio (deceased Texan who sounds like LBJ) who thought that So. California was the breeding ground for cults. You should be thankful that you lived east of the Mississippi and never sat under JRS. Those who did and were dazzled may have had a harder time shaking off the dust. Just a theory.

I think Martha divorcing John in 1979, John's marriage to Marilyn in 1980, Marilyn's presence and comments when John was bringing the word, the control factor starting in the fellowship around 1980, like you described, the only thing I can think of is, a what if, that is what comes to mind,,,,,What if the biblical, historical Jezebel, had of divorced her husband, I think his name was Ahab, and instead of trying to kill Elijah, she had seduced him and married him, (if Elijah had been so stupid) would Elijah's ministry have changed?"