This post may or may not fall on deaf ears but I'd like to give my 2 cents worth here.

I graduated from Impact Trainings two years ago. Everyone who attends the trainings had a different result, as I am sure my results are different than anyone else's. I cannot take away form anyone's expereince there and I know some people didn't like it. I did.

I had been seeing a therapist for several years and I gained more insight in myself in those few days at Impact than I did in many hours with her. She saw it too and complimented me on what I had learned and applied in my life.

This training isn't for everyone. It is for anyone who really doesn't like how their life is going and is willing to take a look at themselves and make a difference in how they are living life. The results of my training have allowed me to have a healthy relationship with my gfriend / fiance that wouldn't have been possible before. I treat others better. I learn from my mistakes instead of being hard on myself for making them. I could go on and on about how the training 'Impacted' me.

For those who had a bad experience and have turned to bashing it, also know that there are many many people who have taken the training and made a difference in their own lives.

I believe someone will take a swipe at me here, now, and that's ok. It says a lot about you and nothing about me. For those who haven't taken the training but are posting about it anyway, I'd say to you: until you do, you aren't talking from your own experience, only prepetuating gossip started from someone who didn't like it. I know there are a few here who have taken it and didn' tlike it...that's gonna happen.

Having staffed a few trainings myself, I have seen both kinda of people - the ones who liked it and the ones who didn't like it. Nobody pressured me to staff, nobody pressured me to get friends and family there.

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Otter
...nobody pressured me to get friends and family there.

Hi Otter... thanks for your post and sharing.

After reading your post I was wondering... did you get friends and family there to do the trainings?

Also, if you don't mind sharing more, how did you find out about the trainings... a friend, etc?

A girl I had dated in the past called me up to talk to me about something completely different than the training, and we ended up seeing each other again. I noticed a huge difference in her immediately - the hard exterior and cold heart were now missing (one of the reasons we broke up) and she was totally the person I had wanted her to be and knew she was, albeit burried deep. I was the one who asked her what happened and she shared. From her example I decided to give the training a whirl - and found out I had bitten off a big chunk indeed. I thought I was going to sit there and listen to someone who would magically make me perfect. Boy was I mistaken. I actually had to do something to get the insight into myself to effect a change. Although we don't do much with Impact now, we both still live what we learned and this had made a once-cold-and-colmplicated relationshipi into something that works and is enjoyable.

I have not asked any of my family members to attend. None have attended. One friend noticed how I had changed and decided to go without me even asking her. She too is doing great, although I don't live with her or see her daily stuff like someone else does.

Otter - do you think you could be in a relationship with someone who has not done the trainings?

Also, do you think you can step out of the subjective/me perspective, and look at Impact Trainings objectively... in other words, is it possible for you to look at the trainings, and LGATs in general, with a critical mind? If your answer to this question is yes, then please share your opinions about the workings of the trainings, and especially some of the details and methods at the various levels, including TIT, as discussed by exImpact and others.

[b:a125cb5e4b]jeffaroonyo24:[/b:a125cb5e4b] I would like to echo what exImpact wrote, the spiritual barbarism that occurs at Impact will make it very difficult to reach your friend on any kind of spiritual level. Even logic will tend to fall on deaf ears, especially with someone involved in the Trainer in Training levels. I think the key is being patient and waiting for a time when your friend is truly open to listening to different ideas. The Impact armor will fail at times in between visits to "the Center". Just make sure that the timing is right and do what ever you can to keep them away from the Impact buliding.

[b:a125cb5e4b]Otter:[/b:a125cb5e4b]I understand that not everyone has a terrible experience with the Impact Trainings but that doesn't justify the [b:a125cb5e4b]many[/b:a125cb5e4b] people who have had their lives permanently damaged by the pseudo-psychiatry that occurs in that building. I'm not sure exactly what you meant by being "swiped" at but I think it is extremely arrogant to think that your comments are beyond criticism, especially by someone who has also attended the trainings. In fact, I would appreciate it if someone (anyone) who is an Impact apologist could address the many specific concerns that have been brought up in this forum. As always the standard Impact answer is, "It didn't hurt me so everyone else must have done something wrong". Typical self-absorbed point of view.

You mentioned at the end of your post that nobody pressured you to staff or get your friends and family there. I find that highly unlikely since the 3rd weekend of Lift-off is actually named "enrollment weekend" and trainees are sent out to "the people in their lives" who would be most receptive to attending the trainings. If you really didn't get pressured to enroll or staff, then you probably attended a different Impact Trainings...

If you believe that the trainings truly benefit people then I invite you to include some of the terrible things that have been listed in this forum in your next post about Impact. If the trainings are a good thing, then surely there must be a reason why the Impact trainers and staff have consistently behaved in ways that seem to lack integrity. Why did Hans and Co attempt to defraud the IRS? The documents are posted on the main page so the evidence is irrefutable. Why have they turned on so many of their graduates as soon as those people became liabilities? If the Impact Trainings are everything that they claim to be, then please explain these other "experiences" in a way that we can all understand.

After TIT 3, what does a person do to stay involved in impact? Are there more courses after TIT 3? Do they work there after completing TIT 3?

OK. Otter, thanks for posting. I have one question. Why does the only pro-impact argument that has been presented on this thread ultimately boil down to: "well, it works for some, but not for all.", as you have done? There has not been one cogent argument presented in this forum that addresses our claims of logical paradoxes, implementation of mental conditioning techniques, shady business practices, immoral conduct of office staff and all of the destroyed lives we accuse the Impact Trainings of. No refutation or even sympathy for the god-awful sorrow these trainings have caused to be. How can you be okay with contributing to an organization that perpetuates mental-rape, even though you think that did not happen to you? Anyone who continues to staff, train, coach or enroll into these trainings after learning what damage has been done to people as a direct result of participating in them, is as morally culpable for that damage as Hans Berger himself. As Werner Erhard is. And Klemmer and Asses, and Hubbard. Do you think we are just bitter liars who are merely hating on a training because our lives suck about 1000 times more since we went through the training than before we went in? If you really think we are just blaming our woes on the training arbitrarily, you’ve got another thing coming! I helped run the place dude! I trained over 1000 people just like you! I’ve seen shit that would turn you white! Stuff they will never tell people because it would expose them as the frauds they truly are.

People who are grossly naïve before they go into Quest, come out even more so. That’s all I have to say.


Ok, it’s not all, I can’t resist:

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Otter
I believe someone will take a swipe at me here, now, and that's ok. It says a lot about you and nothing about me.

First off, you have got to be &@%#ing kidding me! You just proved a logical fallacy for me and you bowled right over it without missing a beat. The first axiom of Impactian accountability is that IT'S ALL ABOUT YOOOOOU!!!! So, how can you say that it says allot about me but nothing about you if your results are all about you? But then my results are all about me, but if that were true, you wouldn't have any results of your own now, would you! It’s like a crazy version of that Old Spice commercial with Bruce Campbell, but it’s not funny! Can’t you see that ALL of Impacts conclusions are based on this false premise, which makes all of their claims of how accountability, right/wrong and morality works implode like the third movie installment of a Marvel trilogy? I mean, good GO[content deleted. 300MB of cursing, ranting and frustrated, maniacal laughter that doesn’t translate well to text]

oops, well I didn't read your post before I responded to Otter formerimpG. It seems I effectively re-worded some of your response. It was unintentional, I promise

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jeffaroonyo24
After TIT 3, what does a person do to stay involved in impact? Are there more courses after TIT 3? Do they work there after completing TIT 3?

There us no "after" TIT 3. It is a perpetual training. They are free staffing labor and the primary enrollment force behind the training, and they actually pay Impact for this “privilege”. No one really becomes a trainer, its all about the journey etc. I do know that most people’s brains convert to the consistency of mashed potatoes after exposure to the repetitive and booooring Berger lectures, excessive intoning of the OHM and seemingly endless messages from the angels and masters of light. I’d rather go back and sit through my old LDS elders quorum meetings than go through that crap again. Now, I know some eq meetings are better than others, and I did say [i:1d0beadc24]my[/i:1d0beadc24] old meetings. I swear if you were to pat my old leaders on the shoulder, dust would pour off of them in waves.

Otter - formerimpactgrad and exImpact have given you plenty to respond to, but I really do believe it boils down to whether or not you can objectively address the issues of Impact Trainings and LGATs in general. The bigger picture is the issue here, and not your subjective experience, which is derived from the controlled and systematic method you experienced, and is not really 'yours' if you think about it.

So please address the issues raised in their most recent posts... while I thought I wouldn't say it, I just can't resist - if you fail to address the issues, that says a lot about you, not me. *wink*