Those who have completed some facet of Impact training and post here saying that they are fine, got a lot from the trainings, life is great etc. beware. They are like babes in the woods, deluded by the process, which is coercive and deceptive, subtle in its after effects. Wiser and more experienced heads, who have been there and done that should be listened to carefully. At one point I though that I also had excaped the delusions created by "the process." It takes many months and perhaps years to rewire your brain after "the process" messes with it. Given time to rest and heal, your post Impact brain will partially recover from the trauma. It will never be the same, but you will be wiser and able to see only in retrospect what the long term results of the deceptive, coercive Impact process has done to you. This is "understanding", a word hated by Impact. Pammy would say that it is bad, sick and wrong. Never mind that there is no right or wrong. What an illogical mess is Impact.

The one thing that you can't really see until you go through it is how people are talked down about after they are asked to leave because all of a sudden they did find out there was a right and wrong...at least to Hans and Sally's minds. There are many who tried to take a stand for what didn't work and they are no longer there. Interesting that they tell you that your journey is your own and to stand up for what you know. I'll tell you though, in my opinion, if your truth threatens Hans and Sally's money supply...you're out!

Impacted: I honestly couldn't make out the words of the chanting but it just sounded creepy. I'll never forget it. I felt pretty creeped out. lol

Just because I feel that I got something out of Impact doesn't mean I am "deluded by the process." I honestly have made new friends, made amends with those I hurt, forgave those who hurt me, left an unhealthy relationship (it was abusive and I honestly thought I couldn't do any better) and am taking better care of myself. I'm a nicer person all around too. So, yes, I got something out of it. To say that in a few months/years I will "get it" and start talking trash about Impact isn't fair at all. Just because that was your experience and maybe that of a few others, doesn't mean that is how everyone is.

Some processes have changed. I didn't say the major ones but a few have. I know that for a fact now.

It's really none of my business what Hans and Sally do in there personal life. And like I've said, they've never done anything to me or anyone I know so it hasn't affected me.

Lol, Jayson Orvis (aka boontahoe) from the Great Life "Foundation" is back! I love that he thinks his opinion carries weight here when everything he has to say can be reduced down to, "I have a product, and it's a good product, so buy my product!" Either that or he is trying to keep Hans and Sally from suing him by defending their company. Can't stop kissing their asses even though you aren't business partners anymore Jayson? THAT is commitment. Nice to know you are still policing the board. Helps me know that I am making a difference! LOL, that's IRONY Jayson!

So, after the years I staffed and trained for Harmony/Impact, I came to a conclusion near the end. Impact's product, our REAL, TANGIBLE and undeniable product is the placebo effect. Yep, the scientifically proven, psychological phenomena that EVERYONE succumbs to on a regular basis. However, the LGAT placebo effect is the delusion of wellness and improvement through radical and abrupt behavioral change. You think just because you felt compassion for a hundred or so complete strangers that you have achieved long-term emotional stability and discipline? You think just because you played show and tell with your soul that you are a better person now and forever? You think that showing you can participate in a pageant that involves ballet or sensual dancing after being in a humorous and humiliating sketch that makes fun of your foibles cured you of your long-term mental and emotional illness? Hate to break it to you, but making thanksgiving dinner for a random family after glorified show-and-tell does not make you a good person. It's a bandaid.

I take it you believe Impact showed you the meaning of forgiveness and unconditional love. Another placebo. I mean, you want forgiveness, right? You want to love and forgive, right? Hey Heart, stay around that place for five years. Watch the people who go in and out. Watch the staff and the trainers, and you will see the hypocrisy unfold. OF COURSE the Berger's are nice to your face, you are a PAYING CUSTOMER. You might walk out that door if you could hear what they may be saying about you behind your back. Go befriend them to the point that hey let you behind their closed doors and into their homes. Listen to how they throw their own "Bitchline" gossip dogma out the window. Watch as the Bergers, Bushmans, Christiansens, Atkinsons and Guenthers (et. all) practice that UNCONDITIONAL LOVE as they coldly and RUTHLESSLY cut people out of their "family" to make smart business decisions. Over and over. There is no family in that place. There is only a belief that there is. I know you believe that you found change, but come back in two years and then tell me where you are. I don't believe that ANY ultimate, LONG TERM claimed benefit from attending an LGAT, i.e. Impact is ANYTHING other than placebo. And if it doesn't last, it's worthless.

Is it so hard to accept the fact that we all want to change or have purpose? I mean EVERYONE does. Even crack cocaine addicts who are DYING from their addiction claim they want change. Why do you think all of this quick-fix new-age bullshit is a freaking MONEY PIT? If I can convince you that you have something that you want so BADLY, I've won. I don't actually have to deliver. I only have to make you think you believe you have it. Unconditional love is a product they sell in the trainings. It is a contradiction. They have conditions, ground-rules, right? You have to follow them to even be able to stay so that you can find out what Unconditional Love is, right? Love is always conditional. I mean, they sell the idea of forgiveness. So, imagine an astonished look on my face as you read this next part: "So you mean, in order to forgive, all I have to do is be OK with my past and empathize with my abusers?" Yeah, REAL profound, that. Just amazingly profound.

Anyhow, AGAIN Heart, you said there is no mention of religion. Did you learn about honesty at Impact? If so, that is one you have thrown out the door on this forum already. What about spirit, Heart? What about that spark, that natural knowing? What about reaching out to the universe and claiming that abundance that is your BIRTHRIGHT. Birthright? Who are your parents? What about the Summit process of the Washing of the Feet that is based on the story of Jesus Christ and Mary Magdoline? What about all the leading experiences where they play spiritually themed music allowing you to have your "own" experience, damn well knowing people will claim that God spoke to them or the spirit touched their hearts? I mean, people have religious beliefs, right? So if you can provide a place where they can express them, you can say that your process helped inspire that to come out. And then all the atheists or tenuous believers are surrounded by all of this stuff they would like to believe anyhow. Do you know what group dynamics are? Do you know what classical and operant conditioning entail? Landmark (the bastard father of Lifespring which the Berger's stole EVERYTHING from, which Great Life likewise stole from) used these psychological manipulations to further polish the LGAT. What is the ultimate product? Well, lets say we can give them the tools so that they can have EVERYTHING they want? I mean, they already want it etc. etc. etc. What about talking about spiritually breaking the ancestral chain of horrible behavior? Do you hear them applauding as you break that chain, freeing them? SPIRIT, HEART! What the hell else could they mean by it? What about being in alignment with your purpose? Well, in order for there to be purpose, there has to be some THING facilitating it, right? If religion doesn't mean something to do with transcendent essence, be it spirit, god, creator, eternal life, natural knowing, love and light, THE UNIVERSE, purpose or really ANYTHING having to do with any of that, then you have no IDEA what religion means. Impact KNOWS people are naive, especially after you can convince them that you have sold them their soul back and gave their life meaining. After you convince them of that, you can really convince them of anything. That's where the TIT "mastery" trainings comes in.

So, yeah Heart, come back in a year and a half, maybe two and then I might listen to your testimonial. Maybe. I still probably will give you the credit for any long term change over Impact. Unless of course, you do what many do and realize that they cant keep the warm fuzzy levels up on their own and have to go back to Impact to get their fix/figure out why they can't. Then I really won't care to hear anything you have to say, because I've said it and heard it countless times before.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/27/2008 02:38AM by exImpact.

I find it sad that you're so negative. I was that way and it's too bad your experience was so terrible. I actually live my life based on the move The Secret. I'm sure you've all heard of it and/or seen it. I remember the first time I watched it over a year ago and thought it was bogus. Then, I did what they said just to prove them wrong but it actually worked. lol It back fired on me. So for the last year I've kept my thoughts and feelings mostly positive and it has worked. It's really cool actually. It has taken that year to really get it more but it's getting easier and easier every day. It really does work.

The placebo thing is an interesting belief. Although I see where you're coming from, I can't say that I agree. One of my angels went through Quest 5 years ago and is still involved in the trainings. I look up to her because she is so positive and happy all the time. And she's not faking it. She's one of my best friends.

I get that you had a terrible experience and just because you were "kicked out" or left with your feelings hurt doesn't mean everyone else will have your same experience. I am a fairly positive, open minded and happy person. So I will be just great whether I continue down the path with Impact or not. But thank you for being so concerned that you shared all that information. I really do enjoy reading everyones responses whether they are positive or not. :)

Hearts5683:

You actually believe in the "law of positive attraction"?

Please explain how this would apply to the victims of genocide?

Quote
rrmoderator
Hearts5683:

You actually believe in the "law of positive attraction"?

Please explain how this would apply to the victims of genocide?

Below is a blog I wrote several months ago to a friend of mine. It isn't on Genocide but may answer your question on what I believe. I believe in past lives. I also believe that the "bad" things that happened to me and the unhealthy relationship I was in not too long ago was something I made an agreement with that person to teach me something. I didn't know how that was going to come about or what experience I would face in order to learn that lesson when I made that agreement, but I certainly learned some lessons in the challenges I've faced in my life. I've written a lot about this stuff in my blogs. I absolutely believe that I attract everything I have in my life. The good and bad. It's ok if you don't agree. That's just how I feel because I've seen proof in the last year.

*NOTE: I did take my real name out of the Blog and replace it with something else to remain anonymous.


I suggested that a friend of mine buy and watch the movie The Secret. So he did and he emailed me the next day. Here is what he had to say!

*********

(MY NAME HERE), I don't get it. It's bogus! Here's what the bald guy says in The Secret: "Everything in your life, including the things you're complaining about, you've attracted."

Do you agree with this? I don't. I think it's utter garbage.

If you disagree, please explain how the Jews attracted the Holocaust. If "The Secret" (and, to the same extent, the law of attraction) has been around for thousands of years, it was surely operating in the height of Nazi Germany, no??

If you don't want to discuss the Jews, please feel free to discuss the victims of Hurricane Katrina, or for that matter, anybody who has EVER had anything terrible happen to them that they didn't expect.

What about children who've been molested? Women (and men) who've been raped? Victims of September 11th? Workers who've been laid off?

It may sound like I'm being extremely negative, and maybe I am. The reason I'm upset is because I DO believe that the DVD has some good advice. I DO think it's good to focus clearly on what you want in life. I DO think it's good to be grateful for the things you've got. All of this is good stuff...

But to say that we're attracting EVERYTHING bad in our lives...well...that's just WRONG. Sometimes it's somebody else's fault, and the fact that the makers of this DVD can't address that makes me extremely angry, because it's a "blame the victim" type of philosophy.

Here's a final thought for you. Let's say I go for a walk around the block. At some point, I stroll by a house and decide, just for fun, to throw a brick through somebody's window. The brick goes through the window, and hits somebody in the head who happened to be walking to their kitchen at the same time.

Did that person "attract" my actions? If so, it seems that my behavior was actually the result of some cosmic force beyond my control. If that's the case, and I'm really NOT in control of my thoughts and actions, then I don't have free will.

Am I wrong? I don't think I am, but if you disagree, I'd love to "attract" a reasonable explanation so I can understand this better.

Or, maybe you'll come around to my point of view and admit that the fat guy who made the quote I opened with is, in fact, full of crap.


***********************

This is easy to respond to. If one looks at the Holocaust from a spiritual perspective, one realizes that it had a huge purpose. An event like the Holocaust has the power to shift the consciousness of an entire planet. And it did. As for the Jews who "attracted" it to them, yet again from a spiritual perspective, one realizes that at some level - subconscious, soul or otherwise - they had to have agreed to participate in that event, to, in a sense, sacrifice for the shifting of the consciousness of the world. In a like manner, events like rapes and molestation, from a spiritual perspective, are not the negative events that we as a society say they are. I know that sounds impossible to grasp, but it is human beings who place the positive or negative judgment on things. Those events can be seen as opportunities to grow. They do not make anyone a victim. In fact, there truly are no victims except as society has chosen to label individuals. Speaking as one who has been sexually assaulted, I can see this clearly. What resulted from my having to work through the pain of that event was incredible insight and understanding about who I am and my purpose. Would I have come to the same conclusions without being sexually assaulted? Probably. But maybe it would have taken longer, much longer, to happen. Maybe I "needed" that event to speed up my own growth as a person to prepare me for helping others who had been in that same situation and would approach me with their stories (which actually did happen).

So to say that this only puts people in a victim mentality is false. What it does is empower individuals to realize they can take responsibility for everything and find a way to learn and grow from anything and everything they experience.

As for throwing a brick in someone's window, let's just say if you were of sound mind and body when you did it, then you clearly had choice. If there is a lesson to be learned from you hurting someone, you had a choice in how you were going to learn that lesson, whatever it may have been. Another reality of our society is that for every action, lawmakers have an equal and opposite reaction, so you would go to jail. You're choice, really.

Thank you for watching! :)

~(MY NAME HERE)

I pity your ignorance Heart. Your inaccurate assumptions about me or the circumstances in which I left Impact are offensive. The only thing you know is that I hate Impact. You know nothing else. As for your angel (which isn't a religious reference by your definition), being happy doesn't mean she isn't an idiot. I am not surprised you live your life based of The Secret. It's the biggest con going on right now. Welcome to the flock.

The truly sad thing is that I used to sound just like you. Man, that's a bitch of a bitter pill...

Oh yeah, why won't you directly address the stuff I said in my last post? Are you even going to address Rick's question? It's relevant. You attracted it, so respond to it.

yet another p.s.: Tell your angel you posted on this site and then have her tell Hans her enrollee is participating on this board. Just to see what happens...



Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 02/27/2008 03:43AM by exImpact.

Quote
exImpact
I pity your ignorance Heart. Your inaccurate assumptions about me or the circumstances in which I left Impact are offensive. The only thing you know is that I hate Impact. You know nothing else. As for your angel (which isn't a religious reference by your definition), being happy doesn't mean she isn't an idiot. I am not surprised you live your life based of The Secret. It's the biggest con going on right now. Welcome to the flock.

The truly sad thing is that I used to sound just like you. Man, that's a bitch of a bitter pill...

Oh yeah, why won't you directly address the stuff I said in my last post? Are you even going to address Rick's question? It's relevant. You attracted it, so respond to it.

Wow, it's too bad you feel that way. No one is an idiot. It's just where they are in there life. I have no judgment, pity or anything for you. But I still enjoy reading through your responses. :)

You're amusing Hearts. Just about everyone graduates from Lift-Off thinking they had a life changing experience. Wait a couple of years and see if you or your "buddies" are any better off. I spent a lot of time around the Impact Trainings and I saw a lot of people come and go. Most left after the first series and experienced little to no long term change (I think they were the lucky ones), other stuck around for the TIT trainings and either left hating Impact, got kicked out or stuck around living a double life where everything was great in the training room but nothing made sense anywhere else. We'll see if you can be THE ONE who experiences a long term positive improvement.

Also, you mentioned that Hans and Sally's interactions with other people are none of your business. Can I take that to assume that you would be willing to take a self improvement seminar from a Nazi or member of some other fascist group? You haven't been in a concentration camp have you?



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 02/27/2008 03:53AM by formerimpactgrad.