Yes this video is very interesting to think of all the importance that was put on this guys teaching in KCF. It does show an enormous lack of discernment, being caught up in signs and wonders is a dangerous trap. The personal fruit of a persons life is where “ the rubber hits the road “.

[youtu.be]

Going back to Hillsong, there's a podcast called I was a Teenage Fundamentalist which is two ex 'fundies' who were involved in Hillsong/AOG. Some of their episodes are really good. There's a three part interview with Anthony Venn-Brown (episode 11+) who was quite an important preacher but he spent his life wrestling with homosexuality. The church made him stand up in front of the congregation to explain and apologise before stepping down. We've spoken here about this kind of ritualistic humiliation, Swallowing down or hiding your true nature is devastating. It's as much a choice to be gay as it is a choice to be hetero and when did you decide to be hetero?

Another episode I found to be fascinating was discussing speaking in tongues (episode 16). They talk about being coached into speaking in tongues by repeating a word over and over again for hours at a time until words become so muddled you spit out gobbledygook. Its been such a long time, perhaps others can speak to how they began speaking in tongues. There's a narcissists episode and one on healing, also one on dating in the church that I thought was quite interesting.

Good comments Mork and many of the questions I have wondered about!

Cheryl and Dave prayed for me to speak in tongues, and that’s what worries me. She really forced it with me. I’m not even sure tongues are a thing, I have always worried about that because after that happened my life turned to crap. Everything went wrong, that possibly could. I never had the feeling that God was looking out for me, on the contrary. How did you get tongues Mork?

I remember it being super important to be able to speak in tongues and feeling a pressure to do it. I don't remember how I 'got' them, I do remember standing in a line in the back flat with the other young people and having someone go down the line to listen to each one of us speak in tongues to see if what we had was real. This has left me with a few questions over the years.
1. Is this biblical, having your tongues tested?
2. I no longer call myself a Christian but I still speak the same words, why is this?
3. If, as I've been told after my deconversion, I was never really a Christian - what were my tongues? They were bona fide tried tested and true, as I believed my faith was.
4. Those who call themselves Christians now but will change in future, can you (believers) tell that they aren't really Christian? How?

Genuine questions, not trying to catch anyone out.

Good posts Mork and LYS. I remember being "prayed " with for tongues or was I preyed upon? Totally forced and coerced in my opinion.
You were never really considered a true christian till you could speak in tongues and as for other christians outside the fship they weren't even in the running. Since the fairly recent uncoverings of sexual offences at hillsong why didn't the fship discern this. Or the child rapists in the mainstream churches why weren't they discerned. But as usual these beasts are protected and HIDDEN by the church aren't they!! Members of kcf if you've been complicit in ousting out your fellow brothers and sisters and continue to harbour unedifying hateful thoughts towards them, the blessing of god is NOT with you and you CANNOT move on in god. You can't be in the light and hate your brother. Be an imitator of CHRIST not the leaders and former leaders of kcf. Follow Christ's example of even when he was clearly wronged reached out to imperfect humanity so why do YOU think you're an exception please? Love covers all and you're left bankrupt of excuse after excuse!!!
LOVE!
To be pretty honest thinking back,the leaders were quite awful as I remember. I cringe now at some of those meetings I attended. I found the rank and file members more godlike than the leaders. Think of the legacy that you'll leave when you leave this world.
Dont be so deceived people!
Please!

The thing I have been worried about for many years, is that people other than Christians can speak in tongues. I’m talking about left hand path magicians, Luciferians and Satanists. When my life went to sh*t when I started speaking in tongues, and the pressure Cheryl put me under to receive those tongues and the controlling way she conducted herself towards me and many others. I wonder if the gift I got was not the Holy Spirit. If that is the case there may be many others in the same situation. “ By their fruits you shall know them” how many others lives were destroyed upon receiving the so called “ Holy Spirit” administered by Cheryl.
I renounced Christianity a very long time ago, I have cleansed myself from the effects of KCFs teaching and brain washing. But I still have many unanswered questions. I don’t think the tongues Cheryl prayed for us to have was the Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit as I understand him, does not harm you, but comforts you. I never felt that. How many other people have experienced this?
To say Cheryl was dodgy was an understatement. I remember when she told someone I knew that she had demons eyes on the wall of her bedroom, and she took them upstairs to see, and sure enough they were there. She said it was because she was doing warfare against Principalities and powers. Where was her protection if that was happening? Something was extremely off there, and her constant migraines and miscarriages. Just saying, so many unanswered questions. The churches of Liverpool accused her of being a witch, she said she was being persecuted cos she was a woman. I’m not so sure.

For many years before I left KCF the question “where is the love?” Went round and round in my head. In the end I couldn’t stand it anymore and today after 30years it continues “ Where is the love? “

I had a best friend in the fellowship for many years, we got on so well. However they chose to believe false gossip about me. I guess they were not really a true friend in the end. I never got the chance to talk about it with them. You know how it goes folks, believe the false gossip, then shun. It bothered me for many decades because we really were such firm friends. Or maybe I was deceived all along, maybe they were just reporting back to Cheryl to keep tabs on me. Either way I was young and trusting then and I genuinely believed we had a special friendship. Of course the old divide to conquer games kicked in, gossip, slander and I was dropped.
My life dropped down another level after that, I had lost my best friend and became even more vulnerable to the two faced back stabbbers. I believe they were poisoned towards me. Such a shame because I really cared for them. That is what it was like. I left then, too much heartache to deal with… I have found it very hard to trust people, since that time. But they believed the gossip about me! a what can you do but move on. Has anyone else experienced this with friendships in KCF?

I've experienced all of the things we used to say were 'supernatural' or 'the presence of God' in other settings. I'd go as far as to say that the sense of peace I used to get about things there pales in comparison to the sense of peace I get now. That fundie podcast talks about being a worship leader and how they would play a couple of battle songs to get people worked up, then some praise songs to get everyone in a state of euphoria, then go really quiet before giving the call for prayer - totally manipulated. I challenge anyone not to feel a genuine and deep sense of peace when you close your eyes for five minutes, still your mind, slow your breathing, especially after singing songs in a particular order. The sense of euphoria can come at a concert, football match, hell I've had it at a nightclub.

The demons eyes sounds terrifying. I remember the discussion about women in leadership roles and how it was interpreted differently. The scripture seems quite clear (1 Timothy, 1 Corinthians 14) but they believe that those scriptures are specific to the time, or something? I can't remember. Its a shame that the scriptures about homosexuality weren't given the same analysis. Perhaps the bible isn't a window into others, its a mirror of our own attitudes and beliefs.

Sorry about your friend. That feels like a very painful thing. When we lived in villages on the savannah, to shun someone could be a death sentence unless you could find acceptance in another village. If we still have those fight or flight mechanisms (which we do), then we also still carry the fear of being shunned because of how serious it was. We are social creatures and it is a cruel system of control.

My own experience of friendships there was a mixed bag. When I was younger the friendships seemed more fluid. I remember being closer with one family for a time, then another, and some families wouldn't have anything to do with us. Theres a social heirarchy to any group (or village), I realise in hindsight. The "generation undivided" is laughable, as is the arrogant "higher call" they espoused.

I will say that I did have some utterly lovely friends there too. I felt dreadfully lonely at times and my home life was no solace. There was an abuser in our home who we were forced to tolerate because the scripture says "divorce is a sin" (more of a sin than child abuse, I wonder?) I was very confused growing up and felt unsafe in my own home, as you can imagine. A couple of people were shelter without really understanding why I was so upset (I didn't talk about the abuse back then). Sometimes just an hour and a cup of tea at someones house or flat was enough to get me through another couple of weeks. One person there shaped my life probably without even realising it.

I don't reemember a lot about the gossip at that time, but it has come up in recent years. I'd like to think it was just a mistake but its hard not to believe it came from a more manipulative place, especially as it was very hurtful to those who received it. Proverbs 11:9 “Evil words destroy one’s friends; wise discernment rescues the godly.”

I can identify with the speaking in tongues to me it was just a lot of gibberish that was meaningless. It never made you more spiritual or was it just a ploy to get you to conform to there way of thinking.
I was very sceptical about some of the teachings at the time i attended the fellowship.
Some of the people that where attending the fellowship were really friendly but there were others who you knew where going back and gossiping to Cheryl and others so you had to be careful what you spoke about.
Judging by what i have read on this forum it as affected so many people in different ways they are still suffering over 30 years later. The leaders and wannabe leaders were so wrapped up in there own little world they did not care who they trod on to try and better themselves.
I felt sorry for the children growing up at Kennelwood Avenue who had that drummed into them from a early age. By the time they were old enough to think for themselves the damage was done.