Well let me respond to two (or three) posts at once here and (hopefully) leave it at that.
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rrmoderator
diddly:
Thanks for offering balance to the mantra recitation on this thread provided by diehard devotees.
Your shared information is illuminating and the questions you ask are thought-provoking.
I don't expect Swami G. will provide any paperwork publicly on this thread or anywhere else on the World Wide Web.
I think it is a bit unfair to start with the derogatory "you're brainwashed" innuendo directed at one poster in this and the previous post simply because that person stated they noted nothing improper. How is this necessary and how does it clarify anything? Apparently there is only one "right" answer you're looking for here. I think it might be time for me to recognize the futility if arguing in a forum where the moderator is hostile (shouldn't they be neutral?), and say "adios" after this post.
I don't know what you mean by "balance" but only one person on this thread has been providing a viewpoint contrary to the majority lately.
I see this (Rick Ross) site solicits donations and I'm wondering if the owners and financial beneficiaries of this institute here would be willing to publicly provide all of their (independently audited) financial documentation and tax statements. Surely this is already available, and I just haven't been able to find it. Is there anywhere this can be found?
Again, people can think what they want but Holly's post is, in my opinion, inaccurate and slanted by hard feelings.
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She prohibits that anyone read ANY spiritual book, religious book or philosophical works OUTSIDE of her limited list (which has about 10 books or less). What books DOES she approve? Of course her own, then those that speak to "crazy wisdom" or hold what she views as "like her teaching". This is called CENSORSHIP and TAKING AWAY OF BASIC HUMAN RIGHTS. North Korea limits what it's citizens are allowed to read, watch or be exposed to. All in the name of a "better society". Your teacher says her list, which you are FORBIDDEN to stray from, is to "limit confusion". It is true, what she is saying, because her teaching doesn't stand up to the rest and if you were allowed to reason for yourself, you'd eventually come to the same conclusion. She is acting as nothing more than a dictator, only you've ascribed to it "holyness". Also, if you read them (and have the guts to admit to it), you're excommunicated from the group.
ANY spirtual book? The Bible is not on the "list" and I don't feel compelled to avoid reading it. The
Brother's Karamazov is very spiritual and I'm enjoying it right now. Yes the reading on enlightenment/spirituality was guided. I never saw anyone "excommunicated" for anything they admitted to reading.
Suppose there was a teacher that taught a rare and difficult form of kung-fu. If they are going to teach you their kung fu, they ask you, if you agree to be their student, not to practice other forms of martial art that contradict this style as it may impede the progress you are making in this style. Would you call them censorious if they refused to be your teacher and told you to leave the dojo because you insisted on creating your own style? Or suppose there is a guide, and he or she agrees to take you to a mountaintop by the fastest way they know, but only if you don't take side trails that waste time, could be dangerous, etc. Would such a person be censorious if they refused to be your guide after you insisted on taking side-trails halfway up? A teacher has a right to stop teaching someone just as a student has a right to leave their teacher. I don't know where you've been but the Guru recommends and encourages people to read absolutely everything ever "written" by Ramana and I practically have. There were a wide variety of recommended authors completely unaffiliated with the Guru: Jon Kabat Zinn, Cheng Yen, Sharon Salzberg, Nonomura, Calvin Malone, Robert Adams, Buddha's Dhammapada, and others.
I recognize and respect their authority on ALL spiritual matters as much as anyone's, and I respect the spiritual authority of my own heart (the guru within) as much as anyone else's.
Take a look at other recognized spiritual paths. In those an Abbott of a monastery might go through everything in a Monk's cell, or review a list of a monk's possessions. In the case of some seminaries I have heard of the preceptors actually reading through seminarians correspondences. Have you ever heard of anything that extreme with this teacher? Not even close.
And this idea that reading is "controlled" is inaccurate on another level as the teacher has had groups
where it is understood people read and practice whatever they like but are expected not to bring outside practices/dogmas into the forum. Would a teacher be dictatorial for insisting that the subject taught in a particular classroom is mathematics and not sociology?
I read a tremendous amount of books and scholarship, mythology, poetry, etc. -- whatever I like, and I am an avid reader of fiction and other literature. I watch whatever movies or programs I like. Doesn't sound like North Korea to me.
As for the sharing of private information. NO details whatsoever about anyone's counseling were ever made available to me or, to my knowledge, anyone who the counselee was not fully aware of ahead of time. As for the suicide, this information was posted long ago in a different forum and I ran across it while ago doing my own due diligence (I can't find the link now but maybe someone else can and post it, and I strongly encourage anyone who works with a teacher to to extensive due dilligence first). The Guru gave a lengthy reply and explained just how concerned she was for this person's safety -- and emphasized this to the individual's caretakers. For the rest I can't remember anyone stepping forward to say that the teacher did criminal harm (or any harm outside of hurt feelings) to them or anyone they love.
Yes I have been to an outside, unaffiliated counsellor (no not a cult counsellor) since associating with this teacher. Of course I've been to an MD. I also attended other religious events (for example Catholic mass). I think, too, there is some exaggerating going on here.
As for finances, I can only say there can only be very little coming in. I have asked questions on my own and received answers to my own satisfaction. If others feel they cannot do so then there are other paths and other teachers out there and they are encouraged to follow them, or simply do their own reading and put things together on their own. We were never told there is only one valid spiritual modaltity or only one teacher for everyone. . . time and again there was emphasis on the adage "different strokes for different folks," or words like "maybe its time to go do something else."
Holly, many others who have left don't carry with them such bitterness. I wish you the best. It was sad and hard for me to see you leave. You say "sent to hell" and all that. . . I did not hear anyone say anything about "sent to hell" and as for leaving, well, it is such a common occurrence there is a whole protocol publicly posted. I just don't understand, but its not my place to question your reasons. You have a right to them.
I think you have the wrong idea about me living in fear or something but I can only say I certainly don't feel that way, but, you will believe what you will.
--JL
P.S. I think I have said enough here. I have no interest in engaging in the "he said she said" merry go round. I choose to leave what Holly posted after I wrote this (see above) go unanswered and let what is said here suffice. There are a lot of what I consider to be inaccurate statements after the word FACT but it does not take much brainpower to evaluate their veracity given the information age, so I'll just let others do their own legwork (that's how it should be, no?-- everyone should carefully investigate things for themselves).
And thanks for your concern but I have my own back, Holly. I wish you a life of joy and happiness.
As far as tables turning, time will tell, and the truth will prevail, and may it prevail.
Peace to all.