Re: Chris Butler, Jagad Guru, Science of Identity
Posted by: Culthusiast ()
Date: April 29, 2023 12:15AM


"..And thats the end of story for you and me.but if you still give a listem you just may.."


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Re: Chris Butler, Jagad Guru, Science of Identity
Posted by: corboy ()
Date: April 29, 2023 01:29AM

Cultenthusiast - your mailbox is full.

Please do not deny yourself social connection.

We are all hurting and make mistakes.

The ones to despite are not ourselves but the ones who lied to us
and wasted our time, our lives, our youth.

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Re: Chris Butler, Jagad Guru, Science of Identity
Posted by: Culthusiast ()
Date: April 29, 2023 02:45AM

Thanks for information. Limit of the inbox of private messages is to be 50. I have less than 10 messenger in inbox. I try to writeback to Truth wins and the same - her inbox is full. There must be a problem with database or soft.

Among those destroyed in SIF were differemt personalitiea. Some of them commited suicide.

I asked some friendly satellites of SIF about Kasia Socha - she hanged herself during retreat in 2000.

And even they say - oh , she was problematic. Sure..Poor girl or a woman lived in poverty, was problematic but put effort. To sell Haribol newspaper. Kicker out of job in the prinsthop where she did as spme say as she could and kicked out in one hour from the Cracows center.

Satellites of Sif. So i have to see objectively. And polish civil law says 1 or 3 months to Kicker out.

But they don not like law or the law. Forgiveness..Forgiveness
No. Forgiveness has ite requirements. No fullfilment - the law is left. Like in Vedas
Dharmaraja, Manu - gives the law and Yamaraja - exexutes...

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Re: Chris Butler, Jagad Guru, Science of Identity
Posted by: Culthusiast ()
Date: April 29, 2023 05:05PM

corboy Wrote:
> Cultenthusiast - your mailbox is full.

I emptied the mailbox.

As for Kasia Socha, people know some of the deeper details about her suicide. The realities of working in the SIF-printing house, her efforts, the beginning of the conflict in the printing house where she was a cook, then being thrown out of the center in Cracow. Former members also gathered information about what was happening at the retreat. Like, for example, the fanaticism of the members of SIF-Polska alienated her hours before her death. About the fact that there was a legend about her death.This information was checked. Some appear to be false, e.g. which way she went from retreat and this will be further investigated. About the fact that Balakhilya das invited to the car one of the wooman devotes who accompanied Kasia in the last hours of her life. In the photos, Tapasya das does not seem concerned. Quite calm and satisfied. On the other hand, the photos of the leaders of the centres, mainly female leaders, show concern and sadness. Not everyone. You can see who's who after they found out about the suicide.

Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 04/29/2023 05:12PM by Culthusiast.

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Re: Chris Butler, Jagad Guru, Science of Identity
Posted by: Culthusiast ()
Date: April 29, 2023 05:34PM

once again, translation from (sects)



Kasia must have been quite a student if she came here to study from a small village several hundred kilometers from Krakow and started her studies at the Agricultural University, at the department of horticulture. It was 1995. She was staying with her aunt.

Unfortunately, she failed - after the first year she failed the botany exam. As she had quite serious health problems while still in high school, she went on sick leave. She stayed in Kraków and worked at Mac'Donalds. After a year, she returned to her studies again, failed botany again and passed it only in the autumn session. On October 1, 1997, she moved out of her aunt's and moved into a double room with her family. Much further from the university, she also had worse access. She told her parents that she wanted to become independent. When she came home for Christmas in December of that year, she talked a lot about faith, quoted the Holy Scriptures, mentioned that she wanted to start studying at the Pontifical Academy of Theology. The fact that she had resigned from studies in horticulture not long ago, her parents found out only in January of the following year, when they received a letter from the AR Dean's Office. Immediately afterwards, in a telephone conversation, it turned out that Kasia, despite having abandoned her studies, decided to stay in Krakow. She also changed the address. When, after a few months, her mother visited her there, she saw that Kasia lived in a house where there was no bathroom, no hot water, and the toilet was outside. She also learned that Kasia had signed up for a year-long public relations course and was going to sell incense on the street from November. The girl stopped having contact with her aunt and did not come home either. Occasionally she would call or write a short letter. She often asked for money. She was sick a lot, she said it was colds. When a year later, at the end of October 1999, her mother visited her again with the intention of persuading her to return home, Kasia showed her the beads for chanting, saying that she was praying on them. She also admitted to being associated with the Chaitanya Mission. In November, she took a job as a cook in a printing house and soon moved into the Mission center. On Christmas Eve 1999, she called her aunt and said she was happy because she thought she had found her place in life.

By the end of the year, she lost her job at the printing house and after an absence of almost two years, in early January 2000, she came home.
She gave her parents the impression of being mentally retarded. They got scared. A month later she came again. She was kind of scared, asking if everything was okay at home. She confessed to being kicked out of the Mission Center. Within an hour she had to pack up and leave. She returned to her old place. She came home to rest and sleep. Under the pretext that she wanted to finish her driving license course, she returned to Krakow. Later, she called home from a new place in Poland. As the notes indicate, her travels were related to the arrival of one of the masters from the United States. On April 1, she came back to her family home, she was tired and had a cold. After a few days she contacted one of the Mission Centers. Despite this, the parents managed to convince Kasia to stay at home. In June, she took a job in a nearby town, in a bookstore. Soon she began to fear something, she felt watched. In early August, she left for one of the Mission Centers. She came back reassured. She slept a lot. On August 21, she left for a reunion. In the evening she called home saying she was already there. On August 25, she called her father to wish him. On the morning of August 30, she called again, saying that she had left her backpack with her belongings and money at the center and was coming home herself. It would be in the evening. In the evening, a policeman called - Kasia was found hanged in a village 40 kilometers from her home. Due to the lack of evidence of third party involvement, the police discontinued the proceedings.

In Kasia's backpack, there was, among other things, a very carefully written statement: "I declare that my activities and personal involvement in the Institute of Identity Knowledge of the Chaitanya Mission is voluntary. I am willing to engage in various types of activities as much as it is possible for me to perform, because I see the need for help in spreading this type of activity. The main goal of the Institute of Identity Knowledge of the Chaitanya Mission is to offer people a relationship with God that leads to a happy and full life, without unnecessary suffering of various kinds. Each person considers his desires individually and has every right to follow them. I also follow my desire to help other people because I feel the need to do so.”

Under the name and surname, Kasia entered her ID card number. There was no date on the statement.

Former SIF members regard this statement as obviously written by SIF activists and some as put into her backpack after her death.

Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 04/29/2023 05:39PM by Culthusiast.

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Re: Chris Butler, Jagad Guru, Science of Identity
Posted by: Culthusiast ()
Date: April 29, 2023 08:14PM

"The message could not be sent. The mail storage space for user 'Truth wins' is full."

Truth wins, I do not consider Your writings as rambling. Individual important memory/testimony/evidence. Thank you.

Another thing:

In my opinion, it is also related to the rigor of SIF, which gives you some energy on the surface, then steals it, and underneath is dark energy. Hence, after the initial ecstasy, the darkness of hell is counted.

In my opinion, in an energetic sense, SIF energy is an amalgam - all rigor. It gives an initial energy bonus, perhaps at the level of neurotransmitter control, in the middle it steals that energy and at the bottom is dark energy. So when there is no auto-credit at night, the dark dimensions comes. Hence the lows and the desire to almost narcotic participation in kirtans. To what extent the actual reflections of C. Butler's after LSD desctructions neurokinetics evoked similar phenomena in his students - there are such testimonies of a sudden "bliss" that could not be repeated.

One way of fighting dark energy afert experiencing SIF was was to shape neurokinetics at the level of task-oriented positive disinterested action. Military in life. Tactical, operational, strategic plan, where the most important goal was the selfless goal - avoiding "passion" - "rajas". Intermediate goals in plan could mark with practical self-interest. At some point it was pressed into my psyche and it gives purity and freedom. A big role was played by 2-hour walks in the forest and consistent cumulative work.

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Re: Chris Butler, Jagad Guru, Science of Identity
Posted by: Culthusiast ()
Date: May 02, 2023 02:27AM

Some verse in context of not initiated people working in years in SoI/SIF:

(Hari-bhakti-viläsa 2.3-4, Bhakti-sandarbha 283)
Just as one born in a brahmin family who has not received the sacred thread is ineligible for the performance of Vedic rituals or the study of the Vedic literature, a person who has not received Vaishnava initiation has no authority to chant the mantra or to worship the deity form of the Lord. Therefore one should take initiation, by which he will become praised by even Lord Shiva.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/02/2023 02:28AM by Culthusiast.

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Re: Chris Butler, Jagad Guru, Science of Identity
Posted by: Culthusiast ()
Date: May 02, 2023 02:53AM

Hari-Bhakti-vilasa, Sanatana Goswami


If a famous brähmaëa spiritual-master is present in one's own district, a person who desires auspiciousness will not travel somewhere else to accept initiation from someone other than him.


A person who accepts a spiritual master from a lower caste meets destruction in this life and the next. Therefore one should follow this instruction of the scriptures. A kñatriya, vaiçya, or çüdra should not give initiation to a person of a higher caste.


The prospective spiritual master and disciple should live together for one year and, carefully examining each other's activities and character, test each other to see if they are qualified.

In the Mantra-Muktävalé it is said:

"The prospective spiritual master and disciple should live together for one year. In this way they will come to understand each other's nature. Then it will be known whether the spiritual master is a genuine spiritual master and the disciple a genuine disciple. There is no other way to know this."


"If the spiritual master's wife is of the same varëa as he, then she should be honored as he is. If she is of a different varëa she should be honored by rising from one's seat and speaking salutations

(Wai Lana is doing yoga and business)


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Re: Chris Butler, Jagad Guru, Science of Identity
Posted by: just-googling ()
Date: May 02, 2023 06:07AM

I share this from Anonymous...

"Back then I had the feeling that in some cases Butler could have been manipulated, but today I know that it was all intentional to manipulate others. He liked to humiliate others. Humiliating others was Butler's demonstration in this way he showed that he has power in MC and that he is the boss there.

Tapasya das used to copy him often and did the same in Polish MC. He felt fulfilled when an equal humiliated someone, which happened quite often. Back to the subject, Butler issued reckless recommendations so-called instructions based on complaints of one of the parties, which he kept valid even when the other side presented him with different facts, because changing those instructions would prove that he is a simple conman and impostor and not a guru.

People in MC were told that Butler is infallible and knows everything before anything happens that God himself gives him vision to reality. That's why once he ordered something and even if it proved to be foolish, he did not change it (example will be Druwa Maharaj das who was demoted as MC and deprived of harinam by Butler due to false accusations and report Lalita Syam dasi on him).

There was only one exception to this. I remember when Butler sent orders to shut down computers for all days, weekends or weeks to all MC departments and followers because there was some virus on the Internet. Followers who own businesses also had to follow this and were not allowed to turn on computers at home or in companies back then. This caused large financial losses to their companies, and therefore reduced the amount of donations / subsidies to MC and Butler. Butler, seeing that his stupid instruction also began to cost him losses, wrote a letter that he is cancelling this instruction and further issues with turning on computers will not be imposed by the MC. But he didn't admit his mistake, stupidity, hypocrisy and hypocrisy, he just said that it causes problems and therefore he withdraws it. It's known that for him highness was important. "

************ And a picture is worth a thousand words: *********

Attachments: fear no greater 2.jpg (50 KB)  
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Re: Chris Butler, Jagad Guru, Science of Identity
Posted by: RUN_FOREST_RUN ()
Date: May 04, 2023 02:56AM

Various SIF claims about the "Haribol Nitai Gaur" "Mantra":

Haribol Nitai Gaur Mantra | Acharya Das, Insight Timer
The transcendental vibrations of the "Haribol" and "Nitai-Gaur" mantras are not only all-purifying for the heart and mind, they are all-auspicious and can bless one who meditates upon them with full self and God-realization. To practice this meditation, simply listen to the repetition of the mantras or if you feel comfortable, chant along.

[] › lekcii › yoga › yoga-audio › meditaciya-haribol-nitaygoor
The mantras are: This time we are going to sing the mantras. But first let's pronounce them as we did at the beginning just to make sure we can do it correctly. Ok, everybody ready? HARIBOL NITAI-GAUR NITAI-GAUR HARIBOL GOPALA GOVINDA RAMA MADANA-MOHANA Ok, good.

[] › what-does-haribol-nitai-gaur-mean
What does haribol Nitai Gaur mean? -
T he transcendental vibrations of the "Haribol" and "Nitai-Gaur" mantras are not only all-purifying for the heart and mind, they are all-auspicious and can bless one who meditates upon them with full self and God-realization. Who was Nitai Gaur? Nitai was Chaitanya Mahaprabhu's friend and disciple.

First of all: Haribol is not a mantra. It's a phrase. It means to chant the name of the god Hari. Nitai Gaur is not a mantra either. It cannot be found in any vedic or puranic scripture as such and at best it qualifies as a "bhajan", a sentimental sing-song for devotees of the so-called incarnation of "god"(s) Krishna and Balarama some 500 years ago in Bengal.

So what does this mean for anyone who foolishly cheats these "mantras"? Well for starters, there is nothing "all-purifying" or "all-auspicious" taking place in any way shape and form. Nothing. You are simply singing a bunch of Indian words. That is all...

Second, these "mantras" were speculated and adopted by Siddhaswaripananda/Butler as a way to avoid singing "Hare Krishna" in public so as not to associate his group with ISKCON. That is all. This is the only reason. A partisan, sectarian concern.

Finally, Hare Krishna is also not found in any scripture besides ONE very unlikely Upanishad that is really only recognized by Gaudy Vaishnavas. Any other mention of it is also only in books only accepted by Gaudiyas. Event he various contradicting biographical fantasies about the epileptic saint chaitanya do not explicitly mention that chanting this mantra is important. The Gita and Bhagavatam do not mention the so-called mantra nor do they make much of any mention or even a big deal about (compared to thousands of other topics) that chanting is in any way relevant to this "Yuga".

So, I ask anyone who wants to answer. What does a 500 year old religion that barely made it out of Bengal and a "god" that ws only known about in Bengal who left NO S HOLARLY works but was touted as a "great scholar" by his followers, have anything to do with the tea in china?

I'll tell you what. It's called cult dynamics. If you look at how Gaudy Math and ISKCON as well as early SIF/CM was operated it was a HIGH DEMAND CLOSED GROUP of religious fanatics and sementimentalists. Whatever these organizations have morphed into overtime is irrelevant. At their core they function like cults and leave in their wake a group of people who then live like cult members believing in all manner of the bullshit above.

Is there a problem with that at its core in a religiously free country like America or the UK and Europe? Of course not. Practice whatever belief you like.

But please do not come here trying to explain that there is an iota of verifiable merit to any of this mumbo jumbo ideology. There is not. No guns theory, no manta, no karma, no reincarnation or other BS they teach is valid or true by any stretch of the imagination. No more than mormonism and scientology is true. Both are religious cults that started in and around the last 100-30 years. Hare Krishna started 500 years ago. By the time the so-called Goswamis died, the religion fell apart. It was resurrected by Bhaktivinode and his son. Mostly based on claims they made based on their dreams.

Bhaktivedanta then came to the west, translated a few fictional books and gave propaganda purports all while scrambling the already scrambled hippie drug brains of young gullible people.

Today, Hare Krishna is nothing more than a garden variety religious faction movement hiding under the label of "hindu". Hinduism is a sectarian religion. Its' gods, stories and ideology is firmly based int he historical sects and beliefs of India. The very god Krishna is a cow-loving god wearing Indian clothes, living in an Indian village and speaking an Indian language. Current day adherents of Puranic Hinduism make up the majority of what we call Hindus and Hindu Nationalists. Hinduism and its various sub-sects are relevant to India. Not to the world at large. Their cultural relevents and significance are squalor within India. and it's arguable how much good it is really doing for India as a whole at this point and time in history. Most intelligent young people in India are moving passed it and hate that their country is plagued by it. That is a fact. That it has cultural roots that go deep in India is largely a plague on the life of the average Indian today. Politically and socially it has few if any redeeming qualities.

Atma vidya, or the dogma of a soul within your heart or whatever nonsense version you believe in is not "self realization". Thinking that when you die and go to lowland goloka as a 12 year old cowherd milkmaid is not "self realization". Thinking that you are an "eternal servant" of a blue Indian playboy god is not "self realization". It's self delusion and it's at the heart of what people who are scared of reality and fear death have waited to believe since the dawn of religious thinking.

All vedic religion was a pagan faith that believed in rain gods, ocean gods, cloud gods and fire gods (no need to try to make it scientific and relevant—the brahmins that wrote it did not make any attempts in that direction, nor should you). It evolved over time. No mention is made in any vedas of Krishna and vishnu is hardly even mentioned. That Indra is mentioned as a lesser god in the Puranic lore would be considered a great offense to vedic brahmins who compiled the rig veda. That Indra is mentioned in Puranas does not make Puranas "vedic". Vedanta is amalgamation. It's like writing Iron man into a Batman comic. All it means is that people were creative writers. That is it. That philosophy appears in fiction books and sounds "intelligent" and "wise" is like Superman sounding intelligent and wise cause he quotes Plato and Socrates. Grow up, let go and move on.

Live your life. Don't be an asshole. Try to eat well and exercise and enjoy the life you have. It may be the only life that exists and likely is. There is NOTHING indicating otherwise. If there is something after the whole show is over, well, you'll find out then I guess. In the meantime don't kid yourself that chanting Nitai Naira Haribol is doing much for you...

Do not mistake doing good in the word like feeding the hungry or teaching people how to breathe and meditate as anything to do with "Gaudiya Vaishnavism". Do not mistake a devotee being kind (there are plenty of asshole devotees as well, trust me) as a result of their chanting. There are many atheists, and those who practice other faits who are simply nice, by nature or likely by nurture. But not because of a magic mantra or belief in a blue, purple, green, turquoise or lavender colored god. And as we see, there are also plenty swamis and senior devotees who chant till the cows come home and are still fucking kids in the ass and worried about Tusli Gabbard being Trumps running mate in 2024. So you know, NO, IT IS NO ALL-AUSPICIOUS. At least, apparently, not universally for everyone...


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