Well yeah, I agree, FOREST: if your own guru calls you an idiot, and you know you've been called an idiot by your guru, and you stick with him and still call him your guru despite the insult, then you ACTUALLY ARE an idiot. I mean, let's be frank: some people are not that bright, and some people REALLY DO want to be told to do and want their lives run for them. Some people REALLY ARE idiots.

Stupid is as stupid does.

Then does it not follow that anybody who would read all 800-odd pages of this thread, study the information it contains, and STILL get involved with SOIF is also an idiot?

Shoot. I'm an idiot for thinking that occasionally posting here helps ex-members or those looking to get out or in the process of being sucked in...

How many people are part of this cult, all in, do you reckon, FOREST? In other words, how many initiated disciples who are members in good standing do you reckon Chris Butler has? I reckon they would number in the low hundreds, but you would know better than me. What do you think?

XKrishna,

Please refrain from causing arguments here.

You are on the edge of being banned.

XKRISHNA, thousands worldwide. At least 2000 more like 5000 last I heard. Many in Poland, Southeast Asia all through the Americas. Most are uninitiated since Butler is a recluse now. Many are completely unaware of anything more than they are part of a "yoga" group and pay to go to assorted classes and events. But many are free and open to the public. It's largely benign. Vege food, kirtans with guitars to tunes of contemporary rock tunes and gita study groups. Much of it has deteriorated to likes and hearts on social media. Thank god.

RUN_FOREST_RUN Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> XKRISHNA, thousands worldwide. At least 2000 more
> like 5000 last I heard. Many in Poland, Southeast
> Asia all through the Americas. Most are
> uninitiated since Butler is a recluse now. Many
> are completely unaware of anything more than they
> are part of a "yoga" group and pay to go to
> assorted classes and events. But many are free and
> open to the public. It's largely benign. Vege
> food, kirtans with guitars to tunes of
> contemporary rock tunes and gita study groups.
> Much of it has deteriorated to likes and hearts on
> social media. Thank god.

Thank you, FOREST. I used to buy weed from a guy named MCGUIRE, and his parents were among the 1970 followers who went into ISKCON with Chris Butler from Hawaii, and then went back to Hawaii with Butler after Prabhupada died and Butler organized SOIF. I met him through ISKCON circles. His parents were/are Butler disciples, and he knew Tulsi Gabbard when they were kids. He thought the idea that SOIF was an insidious cult was laughable, but he would never talk with me much about the person of Chris Butler. When it came to discussing his parents' guru, his personality and eccentricities and such, he was very closed-off. He would never tell me much about Butler himself, personally, my old weed guy would not. He and the persons I've seen on this thread are the only former members of SOIF I have ever encountered, as far as I know. Also Prajapati knew Butler; you and I have discussed Prajapati, FOREST. But he was never a member of SOIF, PJ was not.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/21/2023 03:42AM by XKRISHNA.

The book "Eleven Naked Emperors" by Henry Doktorski contains some very interesting passages concerning Chris Butler and his followers, FOREST. I want to draw your attention specifically to page 70 of that book, which quotes Chris Butler as stating emphatically that Prabhupada did not appoint anybody in particular to be his successor(s). Pages seventy and seventy-one of "Emperors" discuss Butler and early SOIF, but I am not done reading it yet so there may be more mentions of them in there. But there is no index, so I cannot easily find such mentions.

[www.henrydoktorski.com]

Attached to this message is a photo of Chris Butler (in the middle, right behind Prabhupada) which was taken in Los Angeles in 1970 or 1971. Prajapati passed away a few years ago, so I cannot ask him about the details anymore; I cannot ask him to clarify the date. On the far right is Prajapati, and the devotee on the far left is named ARJUNA. This photo is from Prajapati's personal collection, and you won't find it in any books or anything like that. I have been hanging out with Hare Krishnas for over thirty years.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/21/2023 05:25AM by XKRISHNA.