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Re: James Swartz—What is the Truth?
Posted by: MynameisHeather ()
Date: December 13, 2019 08:23AM

Going back to my holiday baking...hope you all are enjoying this most holy time of Advent...of spiritual light amid the deep darkness that precedes Winter solstice...

Time to reflect.

Time to connect with all that is good and true in our world...amongst ourselves.

Time to reflect what is good and true.

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Re: James Swartz—What is the Truth?
Posted by: MynameisHeather ()
Date: December 13, 2019 08:33AM

Oh yea...and Happy Kwanzaa...and Happy Hanukkah to everyone...especially those who are celebrating!

...and for trolls...Happy Troll day.

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Re: James Swartz—What is the Truth?
Posted by: earthquake ()
Date: December 13, 2019 08:35AM

Hey Heather! Happy baking! Great to see you and Trav again!

Thankyou for your kind words Trav. The support is definitely reciprocated!

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Re: James Swartz—What is the Truth?
Posted by: Aenas ()
Date: December 13, 2019 04:21PM

Hi Earthquake,

I took a look at your posts but I have the feeling that the James you have met, is a different James I have met.

Swami Dayananda, Swami Paramarthananda, Swami TV, Neema, Radha,... James always pointed out that there are more teachers and publicly admitted of reading transcripts of Swami Dayananda and Swami Paramarthananda. He encouraged me to study with Chinmaya Mission, and the above mentioned teachers.

James teaches the bhakti and jnana path, with bhakti/karma yoga as the preparation for jnana, liberation. In that way he is not teaching modern vedanta of four paths. He makes it clear that jnanam is the way to liberation which requires a qualified mind, acquired through karma, values and bhakti.

James says that nididhyasanam does not end for the Jiva, that is because once nididhyasanam has done its job, the small, inadequate,emotional jiva is no more because tripti, perfect satisfaction, has replaced the small inadequate jiva vritti. This is how Swami Paramarthananda explains it too.

James also makes it clear that the teaching is independent of the teacher.
And he makes it clear that spiritual experience is as much a hindrance to jnanam as it can be of benefit.
He makes it very clear that jnanam is not an event, and that our true nature is indeed ordinary.

In my experience James is extremely generous, he gives without asking anything for return. This is my experience and I have been very close to James for about 5 years, attending at least 15 seminars and staying with him closely. He even provided me free accomodation at the retreat center and invited me for food when I was eating with him at restaurants. He never asked for a dime. His teaching was always only donation.
I never have met such a generous person in my life before! And this is no exaggeration. You can write him anytime and be sure to receive a fair reply within days without any demand for something in return. He always points out that this is the way he learned it from his Guru.

These are just my two cents. And if I forgot something of your criticism against James, let me know! I am happy to look into these things for my own benefit of clarity.

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Re: James Swartz—What is the Truth?
Posted by: Valma ()
Date: December 13, 2019 06:51PM

Hello everyone,

Time to wish everyone a Happy End of Year even if it looks gloomy in many ways in terms of justice and Truth on the planet.

Thanks to this Forum opportunity to discuss the challenges we face when we enter the world of modern spirituality. Thank you for everyone here with whom i could share views, private messages, educate myself and finally move towards saner fields.

Happy baking, Heather! You know i do not doubt what you went through and i dont need any "proofs" to know that you come from a genuine brave place as someone who went through deep hurt and abuse and overcame the worst!

With my best wishes to all with a valuable article on Spiritual Bypassing worth reading by anyone on a spiritual path:

[www.learnreligions.com]

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Re: James Swartz—What is the Truth?
Posted by: earthquake ()
Date: December 13, 2019 09:00PM

Quote
'Aenas'
>
> I took a look at your posts but I have the feeling
> that the James you have met, is a different James
> I have met.


It's not. It's also the same JS who posts modern vedanta teachings online.



Quote
'Aenas'

> Swami Dayananda, Swami Paramarthananda, Swami TV,
> Neema, Radha,... James always pointed out that
> there are more teachers and publicly admitted of
> reading transcripts of Swami Dayananda and Swami
> Paramarthananda. He encouraged me to study with
> Chinmaya Mission, and the above mentioned
> teachers.

That has got nothing to do with SW teaching things that are modern vedanta



Quote
'Aenas'
> James teaches the bhakti and jnana path, with
> bhakti/karma yoga as the preparation for jnana,
> liberation.

What do you mean by 'bhakti'? There are many verisions of modern vedanta that teach varying depths of the above. You are confused as to the definition of modern vedanta. And this is because of the way the pramana is used. That is, because of the way vedanta is taught.


Quote
'Aenas'
In that way he is not teaching modern
> vedanta of four paths. He makes it clear that
> jnanam is the way to liberation which requires a
> qualified mind, acquired through karma, values and
> bhakti.

In what way is he not teaching modern vedanta? You have not quantified this so far, lol. You picking something out of the blue does not invalidate anything.

In any event, if someone is 'not' teaching modern vedanta in any way, does not mean they are not teaching it in other ways.



Quote
'Aenas'
>
> James says that nididhyasanam does not end for the
> Jiva, that is because once nididhyasanam has done
> its job, the small, inadequate,emotional jiva is
> no more because tripti, perfect satisfaction, has
> replaced the small inadequate jiva vritti. This is
> how Swami Paramarthananda explains it too.

As we are seeing from our exchange there is not enough precision. Saying Swami Paramarthananda says something has to be put into context and looked at properly. For already imprecise claims are being made here, that are not established. :).

To be precise you wrote the above shows that nididhyasana does NOT end for jiva. However, the above is the way scripture says, and that is that it DOES end for jiva, which is my point.

However, Isabella has publicly posted that it does not. And incase it gets removed, I have saved copies of it among other things. Who did she learn vedanta from...



Quote
'Aenas'
>
> James also makes it clear that the teaching is
> independent of the teacher.

Lol. Yes, this is traditional vedanta teaching. Both him and Isabella teach this. However, for teachers that are so impersonal, they are very personal to students who do not do as they are told in their private lives. Students have been subjective to am immense amount of spiritual and emotional manipulation. Much of it is documented. Either in private, or publicly.



Quote
'Aenas'
> And he makes it clear that spiritual experience is
> as much a hindrance to jnanam as it can be of
> benefit.
> He makes it very clear that jnanam is not an
> event, and that our true nature is indeed
> ordinary.

Yes he does say this. Which does not mean he is not teaching other problematic things.


Quote
'Aenas'

> In my experience James is extremely generous, he
> gives without asking anything for return. This is
> my experience and I have been very close to James
> for about 5 years, attending at least 15 seminars
> and staying with him closely. He even provided me
> free accomodation at the retreat center and
> invited me for food when I was eating with him at
> restaurants. He never asked for a dime. His
> teaching was always only donation.
> I never have met such a generous person in my life
> before! And this is no exaggeration. You can write
> him anytime and be sure to receive a fair reply
> within days without any demand for something in
> return. He always points out that this is the way
> he learned it from his Guru.

Traditionally this is the way of things, but you are superimposing attributes on him that are not valid. Any teacher would only accept donations. It is not a big deal. It does not make them generous. It is tradition and the way dakshina works is very important. However, since this is the case, it is another sign, of students not understanding the tradition and glorifying a teacher. This is a problem, as it makes the students blind to bad behaviour.

However, trying to claim JS is never asking for money is ridiculous. Students were in his seminars last year in Europe when he specifically asked for money for the property in Spain. And much to students discontent. This is a no-no.

The penny must drop here. Just because you have not had money took and been burned, does not mean others haven't. Just because you have not been subjected to spiritual abuse, does not mean others haven't'. Just because you have not been sexually abused, does not mean others haven't.

You will not even accept this, and that is because you are fully conditioned by the cult. So much, that you actually tried to invalidate a victim of sexual assault. And you talked to us about adharma?


Anyhow, it is no longer voluntary donations when there is an expectation and a lobbying in course, for cash.

I am also going to tread a fine line here. But, him and IS have been getting money of students and then burning them. They will read this, and they know what I am talking about. I would like to see their independent financial records for the last 10 years published on their website. Independent. Cults tend not to do this. Let's drill into their finances.





Quote
'Aenas'
>
> These are just my two cents. And if I forgot
> something of your criticism against James, let me
> know! I am happy to look into these things for my
> own benefit of clarity.

You say you have read my posts. Though you have not addressed a single point in the modern vedanta teachings that they teach. The deflection won't work with me, I'm very focused.

You are also not interested in your own clarity. You are interested in debunking things. I feel that you are allowed to interact here with me, so you don't need to pretend. I'm not.

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Re: James Swartz—What is the Truth?
Posted by: Aenas ()
Date: December 13, 2019 09:23PM

" Though you have not addressed a single point in the modern vedanta teachings that they teach."

As far as I understood, modern vedanta is the personal interpretation of Advaita Vedanta. I thought I did explain that james teaching is based on swami Paramarthananda and Dayananda.
Can you outline in what way it isn't?

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Re: James Swartz—What is the Truth?
Posted by: earthquake ()
Date: December 13, 2019 09:56PM

Quote
'Aenes'
-------------------------------------------------------
> " Though you have not addressed a single point in
> the modern vedanta teachings that they teach."
>
> As far as I understood, modern vedanta is the
> personal interpretation of Advaita Vedanta.

Modern vedanta is using aspects of personal interpretation. You are going to see how your own words here show James Swartz is teaching modern vedanta.

Quote
'Aenes'
I
> thought I did explain that james teaching is based
> on swami Paramarthananda and Dayananda.
> Can you outline in what way it isn't?

Did you really read all my posts? I don't think you did. I was an integral part of SW. You dont need to tell me what they teach. But I will tell you the way things are behind the hyperbole.


James Swartz has not been taught by either Swami Paramarthananda nor Swami Dayananda. In fact, Swami Dayananda refused to teach him after throwing him out after two weeks!

And here is the problem. For JS to try to say he is teaching what they teach, he can only have read from books, etc. However we know that that causes problems. Anyone reading this, I am advising them to differentiate the effect of sidhis on the students own reasoning.

And here we have uncovered, in your own words modern vedenta...

Modern vedanta is created by a person's own personal interpretation of traditional teachings. They do this as they are not being taught properly. And someone who has not got the teacher as THEIR teacher, is not being taught properly.

James Swartz was not taught the pramana that Swami Dayananda taught. He was refused that opportunity by Swami Dayananda.

He is not teaching what Swami Dayananda taught, as Arsha Vidya Parampara do that. And James SWartz is NOT in that lineage.

Also, and this is crucial. Swami Dayananda takes to task the use of charts saying maya, etc. JS uses those charts.

Swami Dayananda says there is no such thing as self realisation. That it is modern vedanta. James Swartz teaches this extensively. Most confusingly, as I have had to resolve this wrong teaching for many of his students.

James Swartz also uses the modern vedanta teaching of: Brahman plus Maya = Isvara. SWami Dayananda says this is a modern vedanta teaching and is very wrong.


There are tons of stuff. So, he is not teaching what Swami Dayananda taught. James Swartz was not taught to do so in the Guru-student lineage. And he has adopted problem modern vedanta teachings into Shiningworld based on his own personal interpretation.

Yes, you said it. He is interpreting what of Swami Dayananda is valid and what is not. He cannot have it both ways.

If you are a genuine seeker, look at this properly. If you are merely cult member. Ignore Swami Dayananda, even though you invoked his teaching here.

He is taking aspects of the mentioned teachers and using it or discarding things that dont fit in with his own personal view. This is not teaching what Swami Dayananda taught. It is modern vedanta.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/13/2019 10:11PM by earthquake.

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Re: James Swartz—What is the Truth?
Posted by: Panos ()
Date: December 13, 2019 10:35PM

heather i am not james you are so wrong - i can give you my e mail if you want or scype or even give you my GREEK steady phone number to prove it to you... not hidding anything here.... kisses from Athens Greece

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Re: James Swartz—What is the Truth?
Posted by: Panos ()
Date: December 13, 2019 10:44PM

The passion to superanalise and anonymously try to cancel any repply from anyone that is talking for James favor...clerly shows that is a proffesional scam attack... sorry guys try to keep it more simple next time..... Kisses from Athens Greece...... Panos

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