You've included me in your post and I did reply to you through your friend. It is good we can talk direct now.
> My main reason in posting what I wrote below is to
> provide a point of view that is the minority point
> of view on this board.
The way it is, is that this is a cult educational forum. And what this platform does is provide a safe place for people who are offering alternate opinions to whitewashed hyperbole.
I refer you not only to Shiningworld seminars, but also their e-satsangs. James SWartz is constantly bitching and bad mouthing almost anyone in the spiritual world. And, this leaves him by definition, as a supremo. It is a well known cult tactic.
It's made ridiculous as both him and Isabella simply cannot stop publishing students saying how glorious they are. It is strange they want, they need, the world to know how great they are! lol!
That is not necessary in actual vedanta.
> I have been studying with James for eight years.
> I and my friends have hosted and organized James'
> classes annually for the past eight years.
We will know one another likely. I know of many concerning things regard the way James Swartz is on some seminars.
> completely satisfied with my life and I owe my
> contentment to James.
That is nice. Unfortunately you do not owe contentment to James. If you do, then it is not what you think it is.
You are ananda. Limitless. Always. James Swartz is not responsible for Vedanta. He has got no credit to do with that. You are superimposing false attributes on him that are not valid.
This is the problem. He should never be allowing this. For it is what has created this 'inner circle' cult. If the teachings where proper toward you, you would not say this in regard to him.
If what you are talking about is enlightenment, you would not say that you owe this to a person. You always knew what you were. That language you are using is very problematic.
(For everyone watching, we are talking vedanta here. I'm going to show this person that James SWartz has not been teaching them accurately).
James has introduced me to
> a knowledge that has helped to set me free.
If that is the case, it is not what you think it is. The enlightened person would not say this. There is no person for such a , well, person, lol.
Enlightenment is knowing you were never bound. So you were never freed. But it goes further. As I know the Shiningworld tactical teaching of speaking from the 'jiva/person' perspective.
However, even from the person perspective, there is no limitation. A person is not separate nor different from Brahman. So there is the appearance of dvaita, duality. But never actually is.
So, who is where to free whom from what? Enlightened people know this, so would not say what you are claiming.
And that goes to another point. It is a very fine line when someone claims to be enlightened. Which your statement seems to be saying.
Of course, James Swartz is never done awarding such things in his e-satsangs. Strange that.
> Someone on this forum has consistently stated that
> James does not teach traditional Vedanta.
I don't speak for myself. It is not my interpretation. Not my personal judgement.
> not really care that James does not teach
> traditional Vedanta.
If you are one of their 'free people' (such an oxymoron!), and an organiser of their courses, and one of the current batch of chosen ones, I am surprised, in your favour, you would accept he doesn't teach traditional vedanta. It's a start, for you, at least :).
What James actually taught
> transformed my life meaningfully when I applied
> what James taught to my life. As they say, the
> proof is in the pudding.
So they say. But what kind of pudding are we talking about here? And what kind of cook? Using what kind of ingredients? All these things impact what one thinks they are eating. Yes?
How would one know they are tasting an authentic pudding, unless they are able to compare it with that which is authentic.
This is why those that have left Shiningworld, and are still leaving, go to actual vedanta. And they see the difference.
To be really direct to you, Vedanta is not about transforming your life. Why would it be? I get it, modern vedanta has this think about sorting out vasanas and thoughts. Never ending life management. Guna management! Lol.
Vedanta is about showing you that you are not the body nor mind. That you are not the person who is alive. This primary focus is important. You are talking too much from the perspective of the person. :) . So the focus is not about improving life, as that can sidetrack endlessly. As it does with SW students. The focus is on what you are. And this paradoxically does improve life. But the wording is very important as vedanta is an oral tradition and wording shows what is actually known.
> James has never set himself to be Miss Goody Two
> Shoes and taught me to become a do-gooder.
I don't know what you mean. If he doesnt live out being good, how can he teach you to be?
And you are using his cynical language. Do-gooders, are people who do good! lol. We simply do not put down people who want to do the right thing. And here we have firm proof of JS's mentality. He has taught you this, cause he taught me it also.
Those that put down the ones that try to do good, are de facto ignoring or complicit in bad behaviour. We have saw it here. Heather is a victim of child rape. And SW people who have no way of knowing think they have the authority to put her down.
I am also a victim of Shiningworld Cult. And others are in contact with me. I say to you, just because James Swartz has not sexually assaulted you, does not mean he didn't to someone else. So, your experience, if it even is actual, does never invalidate anothers.
> James taught me is how full, whole and complete I
> am, a simple fact that I never knew until I
> learned this from Vedanta via James as Isvara's
Traditional Vedanta does NOT teach this. For a very good reason. So this is not what you think it is. It is not what you are being told. There is absolutely no way that vedanta can, or any teacher can, show you what you are. This is very incomplete teachings.
Vedanta, and any teacher cannot show you what you are as you already know what you are. You always did. The sanskrit words ananda and anantam show this. Limitless and Infinitude. The use of pronouns is crucial in vedanta. And saying 'me' is supposed to refer to you, Brahman. You always knew.
Vedanta, and a real teacher, will only show the mind what you are not. Notice I did not say 'will show YOU' what you are not. Dont forget you are not the mind that has been exposed to vedanta, in this context.
More importantly, James taught me
> what I need to do to prepare my mind so this
> important knowledge about myself becomes firm.
The credit for those teachings has got nothing to do with James Swartz. Krishna in the Bhagavad Gita is a good candidate for that. Isvara, God owns the credit. James Swartz also uses the teachings from Swami Dayananda. Even though Swami Dayananda refused to teach him. Which is fine, but JS should take not credit, and teach what I have just said.
Anyhow, if he taught you something that has set you free (you used past tense, attained, earlier), why are you speaking here from the point of view of sadhana? Ongoing, needing knowledge for firmness?
> Suppose you learned something about yourself that
> transformed your life in the the utmost positive
> way possible and you find out that the person who
> taught you this most wonderful thing about
> yourself actually had a heinous past. Does the
> knowledge of this person's past negate what the
> person taught me about myself that I value so
> much? I understand that it might be the case for
> some people, but I know that the knowledge would
> not negate the wisdom for me.
Yes, it does. For anyone that can think for themselves. The fact that a teacher carries on lieing would in fact show they do not have the moral compass for truth. This is very suspect. And it lends support, that a teacher delivering a spiritual message to students, who hides the fact they have done terrible things to students. is dangerous.
You know something, people ignored Osho and his antics for years. As well as mooji, and Andrew Cohen. Etc. I'm becoming more and more resolute that we should start to become much more visible and organised in regard to telling the truth about Shiningworld.
I believe that
> Jesus would be happy to learn from sinners as well
> as do gooders and I personally think that sinners
> have more to teach me than the do gooders.
Learn what from sinners? What are you even hypothetically talking about in regard to Jesus?
And anyhow, people that do good are what is called dharmic. Get with the program, lol.
> I personally do not want to ignore a good message
> that is delivered by a flawed messenger.
Of course you would not. And I excuse you for this flawed thinking. There is no judgements on you. The thing is, that according to actual vedanta, once things are changed and brought in, on the calling of one person, it can be detrimental to that which one wants to attain. This is why the vedanta pramana, means of knowledge, has to be precise.
In any event, your by-passing of not seeing the importance of accurate teachings is another symptom of the god-like persona of James SWartz. You won't see what is obvious.
> I recalled reading someone on this board saying
> that all or nearly all of James' students that he
> has interviewed became disillusioned, disenchanted
> or disgusted with James after associating with
> James for many years. I want to say that
> certainly is not my experience and the experiences
> of my friends who have studied with James for many
> years. James is the most important teacher I have
> ever had and I had the benefit of studying with
> many teachers who have taught me how to lessen my
> suffering as a human.
You are speaking about me. There are many students of James Swartz. Not as many as actual vedanta, but still a sizeable few hundred, give or take. I am in contact with around 30 of those former students, who have been traumatised in varying degrees with his horrible behaviour. You must remember, that many come to Shiningworld already traumatised. And the behaviour of James and Sundari Swartz is terrible in regard to some of these students that they already know are vulnerable.
Just because not everyone has been abused hardly means anything. Jeffrey Epstein did not rape everyone he was in contact with. With James Swartz, the abuse is selective, and often behind closed doors. I know because it happened to me. And if you are calling me a liar here, I am smiling at you and telling you directly, you do not have a clue what you are talking about. I have much proof that has been gathering with myself and others for some time.
> I have the following thought to share with
> Heather. Suppose James raped Heather. I imagine
> that the rape experience was physically painful
> and psychologically and emotionally wrenching to
> Heather. To allow the supposed perpetrator the
> power to affect Heather to the extent that it
> affected Heather to this day after all these
> decades is ....... (fill in the blank; I am at a
> loss for a word to describe this jiva condition).
> A person once asked the Dalai Lama if he is angry
> at the Chinese. He said something to the effect
> "The Chinese already take my land. I am not going
> to let them take my mind too." You do not see the
> Dalai Lama going around badmouthing the Chinese
> even though they stole his land and killed his
> disciples. He has more sattvic things to do with
> his time. Blaming someone is very useful; it
> deflects the attention from issues in ourselves
> that we do not want to face.
You have got no moral right to use spiritual teachings against a child rape victim. You should be ashamed of yourself. You are the perfect example of the disgusting acceptance that within Shiningworld, of James SWartz being a rapist, cult leader, and destroyer of vulnerable lives.
You have came on here directly, and repeated this again. And this is because you are trying to create a flaming response on here, and use that to solidify keeping members in Shiningworld. The teacher is adharmic. His language is so toward a lot of the world.
The students be adharmic. For they ignore the wrongs of the teacher.. And are thus complicit. The students also challenge those who speak the truth.
Your cult leader wants to bad mouth the whole world. Though neither him, his wife, nor any of you who are interacting here, even see that Isvara wants this, has willed it. For the challenge to Shiningworld does not exist for no reason.
> If James did what Heather accused him of doing, I
> believe that James will get his reckoning with
> Isvara. James has had a good life so far and we
> will see what results Isvara will deliver to James
> for the rest of his life if we still are around to
> see it.
You would find real vedanta useful. You simply cannot place expectations on Isvara. Where you never taught Karma Yoga properly?
Anyhow, dispassion is also not about ignoring adharma. That is by-passing. A big sign of modern vedanta. And what you are doing now.
> What I noticed about the writing in the cult forum
> is that there is a huge emotional charge behind
> the writing of the people on this forum who are
> critical of James. Emotional charge is often a
> very useful indicator of something that we are
> uneasy with that we do not want to look at.
Yes, it is true that the victims of abuse of James SWartz hold trauma. Do you expect them to have enjoyed it? Get real, will you, lol!
Modern vedanta again. In actual vedanta we do not by-pass life. In actual fact, do you know something? Jnani, enlightened people do not run from anything. For they know there is not one thing to run from another.
So James Swartz, stop running.
> I know of many people personally who have
> benefited much from James' teaching and whose
> lives have been transformed for the better due to
> James' teaching.
I was one of them. Until I was a victim of abuse. But Heather, she was also one who benefited from him, until he began what he did. The point is, just because something that has happened to some, and not to others, hardly means anything positive in regard to him.
> I have listened to Vedanta teachings from various
> American and Indian teachers and I find James
> Swartz's style to be the best. I found James'
> commentaries on the various texts like the Gita &
> Panchadasi to be more useful to me than the actual
> texts themselves.
I am so glad you have added this to your original response. I cant stop laughing. You are elevating James Swartz above Krishna. Isvara, god, owns the Gita. The Gits is not comparable to a modern vedanta teacher. James Swartz and what he says, can not ever be above what God revealed in the Bhagavad Gita.
As far as Panchadasi goes, it is an advanced text. And there is no way, none at all, that James SWartz is as accomplished as the author. Oh his ego, power trip would like to be. But no chance. Megalomania this is. And you are showing strong cultist symptoms. James Swartz is almost messianic it seems.
What is it he says? Money, sex and power. Are the three downfalls:
1. Well by his own admission he had been a sex crazed lothario, and he bedded at least one student, who he went on to marry. He has been accused of child rape and also being thrown out of Chinmaya ashram for bedding a student there.
2. He won't reveal his ten year finances, independently. And, mmmm, just what is the situation with the appearance of the spanish love nest... I wonder ;) .
3. He has such power over his students, that even you, free person, you say he is better than the word of God, in explaining things. Better than the Gita and Panchadasi. He has so much power over you, you don't care what he teaches, or who he has abused, or raped. If it makes you feel good, you're in!
Thankyou for the advertisement of SW.
I know they are waiting for the responses. And they will be making a collective effort. So, go ahead, Ze high command. Have at it...
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/18/2019 03:48AM by earthquake.