Ah yes, the NEP. Have a look at the link, it's very ironic. At least back then we were happy for a 10 cent per tract dony average and it was much less long winded to get to the point. What's the going rate now? ("Spare a few dollars for the printing cost?" "Urg, here you go, I'll pay you to stop bothering me" Book goes in bin. Phew, now my dony averag
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Back again after a long time. An interesting newsletter. Bit like the "Time warp". A step to the left...then a step to the right... Now they're going all Greeny and Permaculture; What happened to "Beware the New Age" Dave? The aim of course is to disorient the followers with contradictory ideas until only one principle remains; the Fuhrerprinzip. I had a look
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Hi, I went on 2 retreats when I was a young adult and a few years later I joined a proper cult for 8 years (the Jesus Christians/Dave McKay) so I am intimately familiar with at least one cult. They do not seem to me to be a cult. You do the retreat and then you go. I found some benefit to the practice, and no harm, but I did not continue meditating afterwards, although I kept the concept of al
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Good luck, Malcolm, but there are lots of other volunteer opportunities that seem a lot (sorry, alot) better. Lots of other voluntary opportunities on that site look much more sincere and open in that they are just there to do the job, working for love instead of working for an organisation or an ideology. That whole volunteerism philosophy that has so many multifaceted opportunities looks to be
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Yes, very well indeed, so many good things in my life. Depressing to think what I would have missed out on if I was still a member. We have only one life, t'will soon be past, only what's done for love will last. Glad to be recovered from the delusions of the JC's.
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Zeusor, you have inspired me. MckayJesus Appears to the Disciples 36 While they were still talking about this, MckayJesus himself stood among them and said to them, "Grievance be with you." 37 They were startled and frightened, thinking they would have a long meeting. 38 He said to them, "Why are you troubled, and why do doubts rise in your minds? 39 Look at my hands.
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Dave McKay SAYS "We wanted to make a point about the need for punishment" "We took it on ourselves" Dave McKay DOES: Sue for 3 million dollars! C'mon, sing along all you ex JC's (to the tune of the grace "Make us your Body"; or "We are his Body", depending on your era) Guitar intro: Make us some money, Sue them with pride, The punish
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

In my listening time with God I recieved a radical revelation for the Jesus Christians! I have the perfect group that is only for "new bottles" to join. Old bottles will surely crack with this one. Financial Services Volunteer Corps Seriously, they are doing wonderful work making banking and financial services transparent and accessible to the poor, kickstarting and enabling economi
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

some thoughts as I watched this fascinating program, in response to the valid question that Freeganism could not work on a large scale Sue said "Well I suppose thats where my faith in God comes in to it." What sort of answer is that? Does she have faith that after the Tribulation a great golden pyramid city (ala COG) will come down heavily laden with bounteous provisions of rubb
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Apostate, you are certainly not talking to yourself. Many of us are eagerly reading it. When Dave cannot answer criticisms directly, because the truth hurts, he tries to shoot the messenger. Increasingly he is clutching at straws. Thank you for your contributions which I will back up as being very relevant criticisms.
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

I remember feeling like Kirstie, the exhultation, the joy. Imagine how it was for the COG's when they first started, and they had THOUSANDS all believing and feeling they were at the threshold of the coming of the Kingdom of Heaven, like the "Dawning of the Age of Aquarius", it must have been a mind blowing ecstacy. When hard times come, it's all a "test".
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

I think it's important to get some perspective. I certainly don't dwell on my time in the JC's. It was a significant part of my life, and it is important to reflect and learn. It is important to alert those who might be decieved by the JC relating. They are full time commited "relaters", always trying to get new "sheep". I have a responsibility to be part o
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Apostate, thanks for your posts and the initiative to create a set of posts especially for Quakers. I actually attended some Quaker meetings after leaving the group as a way to heal after being in the Jesus Christians. I was certainly surprised that this very tolerant, pluralistic and gentle group was infiltrated later on by the JC's. I consider their philosophy and modus operandi are c
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Apostate, that wasn't just ANY sin, that was the cardinal sin of THEFT!!! It must be one of the most wicked sins in the JC's rulebook to deserve such punishment! That is the Jesus message they are getting out with that stunt. Preach it, brother! Whippings for theft! Whippings from FULL Gospel Jesus Christians! Amen! What an AWESOME witness to new disciples and new lamblings an
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

mistake please erase
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

I noticed a strange inconsistency the other day on their website. Apparently the JC's in Kenya volunteered as observers/scrutineer's for the recent election under the United Nations. However, their prophetic beliefs are that the UN is going to be the direct forerunner of the most evil System of the Antichrist in a new One World Government. Their theological beliefs are that Jesus wil
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

QuoteI was interested in your comments cultmalleous about the distribution of books. Was/is there a sales patter? Were some members more sucessful in gaining donatons due to how they framed their approach? Could you or the others perhaps give some examples of what worked and what didn't? My view is that the introduction of the books was a good tactic. Even though the production costs a
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Quote Tell us please, what do you see as being David's main faults or flaws in character and /or leadership style? What do you see as his strongest strengths? Where and when do you think he went wrong, if you do think that he did? I think it mostly revolves around fathers. His father, our fathers. Lack of effective fathering, whether too effeminate or too harsh or absent altogether. I
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

I do not really want to say who is nastier, it is a subjective thing. Suffice to say that, by following Dave's dictates, people have had to suppress parts of themselves, and have become bitter and nasty as a result. Dave is relatively free to do as he pleases, so he is not really bitter, and can be easier to get along with (as a member). Members in deputy leadership positions get critic
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

QuoteWhat were some of those good things of which you write, friend? What did you learn from your experience with them? What was DM like at the time you were involved? When exactly did you leave? Why? Just asking. Thanks for your kind questions. I learned to be disciplined, first externally, then internally in the JC's. I was in a state in my life where I felt I needed to join somethin
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Quotemalcolm...and in the event that you can't......just go the f*ck to hell (..your brother will kindly show you the door......)....and piss off with the divisive "hate-mongering" your brothers has bidden you spread here.....!! this is really so over the top. I have met much of DM's family including the brother I think is Aghast and he is just such a genuine guy. Really,
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

aghast; I am sorry to hear the effect of Zeusor's post on you and your mother. I would also like to put up my hand to disagree with dragging in people who do not wish to be involved in this forum, and I am saddened Zeusor that you would do that, especially if you have been not completely truthful. We have to be careful to hate the sin, but not the sinner, including when it is in regar
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

QuotehelloI was so pleased to see the same charm displayed on the Jeremy Kyle show for 1.4 million people to see. Pls note when Sue raises her voice in a semi - hysterical fashion. " Can't anyone see what's happenning here?!" That's the same warm up act I had from her initially.. " No, no- I'm the victim here".....sings Sue....then she harangues and
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Quoteapostate From the outside it LOOKS good, but once you are in you soon learn you are the gardener working on the presentation of the garden. It is not about eating anything substantial. The group is in effect an "empty well" and a "hidden reef". that is SO TRUE; it was interesting reading about a psychology student's recent stay with the JC's, called Ruth, she h
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Thanks Apostate for bringing some balance back. I too agree that Dave is not, on the whole, evil. He is certainly not as good or as humble as he thinks he is though! I think his problem is that he wants to be RIGHT more than he wants to love. He wants to be able to go before Jesus on judgement day and argue his right to get into heaven like a lawyer! Anyone with an ounce of theology should b
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

QuoteYasminHaivng not been a JC, I can't talk about the experiences of that group, so wanted to talk about my own experience,leaving my childhood group, and hope it might be relevant. Those people who finally helped me see reality were kind and gentle.They let me talk about the good stuff in the group,and acknowledged that some stuff was good, and then helped me to look at everything else
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Zeuszor, I did not mean to insult you or to imply that you are just out for publicity. I deeply respect and appreciate you and others for being up front. It's a great thing you do. In other circumstances, (i.e., being single) I would do the same. However, I have sacrificed enough and paid enough of a price to put a very high premium on the protection of my family from whatever Dave m
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

“In 25 years, there must be dozens of people who have left the Jesus Christians, who could have been produced as more reliable witnesses against us than Malcolm. David Lowe claims to have located sixty of them, and Brian says that every one of them has only negative things to say about me. So where are they? There are very few groups on earth that could boast a record of a quarter of a century wi
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Thanks for posting that documentary on the COG's Zeusor. A great education for anyone wishing to see the parallels between the JC's and the COG. The power that Dave has gotten within his little group has clearly corrupted him just as it did David Berg. I tend to believe that both of them had a sincere desire to serve God at the beginning but that their urge to power ended up consumin
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

sorry, that was just a parody clip, but it bore a resemblance to DM. This is the real one jackass
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"