this is terrible to put for all that effort for the late comers to just jump on board. At that rate they could have just had everyone show up the day of and put them all on stage and let what happened happend. That is not a cause. I am sick of that excuse.
for ex may contribution here where I am at a leader will take out $20 and make out 20 envelopes of all thier relatives and then say to me " they are making a casue" I always thought this was wrong. just to make numbers. Recently I read a SGI memo thats says flatly these people are not making a cause. Victory even though a small one.

Quote
Blue Lady
Somehow the impossible will occur on all 3 dates in 3 parts of the United States because we chant. If that’s the case let’s stop the oil spill in the gulf, lets dry the floods in Nashville, let’s stop the volcano in Iceland, Let’s get rid of the New World Order , the Bankers, Let’s bring our troop home from a phony war backed by the BANKERS..—that’s my rant for today

I totally agree with you Blue Lady. Nichiren spoke alot about the disasters happening in Japan in his time, I think if he were alive today those are exactly the things he would be concerned about! His main priority would not be pressuring people into being involved in an activity they don't understand, and which will bring them no benefit.

I think this is an important point, SGI says 'you are making a good cause' when you donate, do activities, shakabuku people. If that helps others and yourself attain happiness, understanding and peace of mind, then thats true. But if its true that SGI is a cult then all that those activities will do is help SGI become richer and more powerful.

Also while I'm here, I was thinking about Shakabuku recently. Now my understanding from Nichiren's writings and my own personal opinion is that only people who have attained a deep understanding of the Law and understand how best to 'preach' it to others should be performing shakabuku. I think it damages Buddhism and the Law when SGI members bring confusion and hurt to people in the name of achieving their shakabuku targets. Would Nichiren be happy about the underhand, sneaky, dishonest tactics SGI says people shoudl use when trying to shakabuku people. I dont know for sure, but I imagine he would be pretty pissed off! Also, I imagine most people began practicing Buddhism to calm their minds and gain a deeper understanding of themselves, which would have the effect of reducing stress in their lives. But what does SGI do? It gives you an arbitrary target of how many people you should shakabuku, then constantly pressures you to do more.

Also (last point) there is the idea in SGI that everyone is a Boddhisatva of the Earth the moment they sign the membership form and receive their Gohonzon. I think this is terribly destructive for a number of reasons: A) it gives people false hope that whatever they are doing in their life is right and acceptable, B)it gives people the false idea that they now have some understanding of the law, I think this discourages people from developing their spirituality and understanding, why would they need to do more? C) It immediately puts pressure on the person to act like a Boddhisatva, i.e shakabuku, donate money, dedicating all their free time to activities.

Whereas in reality the person now has a warped and self damaging image of themselves and the world.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/19/2010 02:53AM by DavidM.

A temple member will come back to SGI after 10yr absence. This temple member can be active on the old ARBN slander SGI like crazy. Next thing you know he gets promoted to District Chief only to disappear again.

Another temple member and family come back from the temple after 10 year absence. They quickly become the darlings of SGI – they are now put on a pedestal, used as examples at every meeting – give experiences of their life at the temple -- everyone loves them. He become District Chief – District falters only for him to disappear. I told the Area back then they were close to leaving SGI and going to temple. Of course I was ignore.

Another temple member same thing--- gone for 15 years-- Comes back to SGI . Less than 2 years later now promoted to Area Leader. What you say!!

Another member left SGI to practiced on his own after 10 years came back quickly became Chapter Chief now Area Leader. Had people doing Gongyo after meeting was over instead of before meeting . What you say!!!

Yet I have been here all along with all my other members and smaller time leaders and we are stuck in the same position for 10 to 20 years and if we say anything about moving on. We get the evil eye.

It is almost as if when you go to the temple and practice and come back to SGI you are a rock star. No I take that back. You are a Rock Star --to be applauded for your courage and if you bring back others with you--- well you can write your own ticket to fame.

I remember at the time my Area leader spent 45 minutes in a leaders meeting talking about how he got this temple member and his family back to SGI – mind you we had other things to discuss in this leaders meeting . But he went on and on ego tripping. One of the Men’s Division leaders asked him some innocent question. About the whole temple issue. This Area leader was rude and ugly to this MD leader. Do you know what this MD leader did sometime later? Steal one of the Gohonzon out of the Center, joined the temple and then left his practice and now he is a devote Christian of something like that. I guess he thought maybe it could work for him and he too could be a Rock Start – leaving SGI and coming back as temple reject and now SGI Rock Star--- Wonder what would have happen if the Area leader would have answered him in a compassionate manner.

This Area leader was rude and ugly to this MD leader. Do you know what this MD leader did sometime later? Steal one of the Gohonzon out of the Center, joined the temple and then left his practice and now he is a devote Christian of something like that. I guess he thought maybe it could work for him and he too could be a Rock Start – leaving SGI and coming back as temple reject and now SGI Rock Star--- Wonder what would have happen if the Area leader would have answered him in a compassionate manner.

@Blue Lady

I've always wondered how the "Latter day of the temple/gakkai" would work out. I'm not at all surprised that people returning from the temple are canonized given the tribal implications that can be taken from that. I'm sure there are a lot of insecure people with SGI who ask themselves "What if Ikea was wrong?" "What if he has led us astray?". Having someone come "back" from the temple can be pointed at as proving the "validity" of Ikea's decisions to move the SGI Multi-Level-Marketing scheme franchise to an independant organization. Hire a couple priests and a copy machine and you can set up your own "world peace" religion.

In many of the Gosho there are stories of this or that person who persecuted or killed and then died a horrid death of their own, so in the end the path you followed, right or wrong, eventually sums itself up in your life condition at the end. We will never know whether Ikea made the right or wrong choice, but I'm sure quite a few people's life conditions today are a product of its validity (or not). It certainly doesn't sound as if the old Gakkai Spirit is attracting the converts it once did, or that the numbers are "growing incessantly".

When Caesar rode triumphantly into Rome the senate had a slave ride with him holding a crown of laurel leaves over his head and whispering into his ear continuously "Remember, thou art mortal.... remember, thou art mortal". I wonder if there will be a new constellation eventually that is called "Ikea"...

Wakatta1



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/19/2010 07:49AM by wakatta1.

Quote
Blue Lady
on a seperate note-----
She had mention before that the new guidance book out that is paperback and yellow is not written by Daisaku Ikeda. I don’t rightly know because I have not bought it.
However yesterday at the Sophia group meeting one of the WD read from this book. I realize I have never heard guidance like that before. What I mean Pres Ikeda does not write like that or speak like that. IT was more AMERICAN thought process if you get my drift. It was for May 16th. Has anyone else gotten the impression that he has Ghost’s writers?
.

Blue Lady, have you ever heard of Lisa Jones? She's a journalist from Colorado, and a former SGI member who worked as a ghostwriter for Ikeda. She angered SGI by telling people that she was a ghostwriter. Usually, ghostwriters sign a contract promising that they will not tell anyone that they wrote the book. For this, they're paid well, probably much more than they could earn selling a manuscript of their own. She also posted an anti-SGI website. It seems that SGI's lawyers came after her. She had to quit speaking about SGI and she had to take her website down. This was in the 1990's.

This is from page 53 of this thread:

The case of Lisa Jones: She was a ghost writer for President Ikeda -- actually not an uncommon thing. According to Charles Atkins, who is quoted below, this kind of arrangement is common. Famous people often do not write their own books and speeches. Many celebrities rely on ghostwriters who are paid well for their work but receive no credit or royalties -- and this is all part of the ghostwriter's contract. Charles Atkins, who writes a blog for www.fraughtwithperil.com explains below how this works.

-----------------------Beginning of Quote, Fraught With Peril Website, Kempon Hokke Blog--------------------------------

What Lisa Jones was enountered with was this: the master of a religious organization of tens of millions, allowing professional and superbly adept minions to write books for the public forum, that would be credited exclusively to Him.

My opinion here is that there was an ethical breech at the highest possible levels in allowing this to happen. I'm quite sure Mr. Ikeda is fully capable of writing his own books and I am sure that once the work-for-hire project was finished, edited, translated back into Japanese, the book was gone over by Mr. Ikeda. That's a huge assumption on my part, as it's also quite possible that Mr. Ikeda never laid eyes on the manuscript but had a team of his most trusted editors like Ms. Shinbutsu, his personal English editor do that final bidding.

Either way, from a writer's standpoint, a $15,000 contract to sift through lectures, notes, previous works, assemble them and compose a manuscript on a subject that you're intimately familiar with, would be a dream come true. If Lisa were to put together a manuscript on Buddhism of her own, that would bear her name on the jacket, she would be lucky to get a thousand dollar advance against royalties. In truth, she might have to submit her manuscript to hundreds of publishers over the course of years before she got an offer - IF she got an offer.

That's why, a $15K deal to write a book for a world famous person is a deal that's damn near impossible to pass up. The fact that this project was offered to her speaks volumes to her level of expertise. Where the rub came in was after the fact, when the realization came that the organization was fooling the members and that burning question of how many other books were published under his name that he did not write? So, I do understand what she did and why she did it. I have asked myself many times if I would do the same and can't truly answer that question. What I can say is that I respect Lisa's guts to listen to her conscience and do what she thought was the right thing. The money and the prestige can be very tempting, but the rules are simple: if you take the money, they have bought your silence.

I do know one thing, they'll think twice before they do that again. If that's what Lisa Jones accomplished, we all owe her a debt of gratitude.

A contract writer, which I was at one time for the SGI, signs away their rights to royalities and credit. This arrangement is extremely common in professional writing. The whole idea is for an expert writer to take on an agreed upon project for pay without credit - it's standard. A ghost writer is someone who is employed on contract to write and possibly help edit a work of fiction or perhaps non-fiction. The difference between a ghost writer and a contract writer is the same as the distinction between a hooker and a call girl.

Where legal trouble emerges is when a contract writer breaks their contract and discloses the specific nature of their work for hire, thus diminishing possible sales of the published work, as well as impuning the credited author. Every writer knows this. You sign a contract as a writer for hire, you take the money, keep your yap shut, and let others take credit for your work. Standard, standard, standard.

I will say this about my own writer for hire with the SGI, without disclosing which project(s) I worked on: They paid me on time. They were very involved in the process. There were more editoral layers than skins on an onion. AND, when we were done, they didn't use a single sentence I wrote. In other words, the SGI completely wasted the members' money on a writing project that they ended up doing themselves. Their finished project of the work they contracted me to write? A best seller for them that I consider utter crap. They probably thought my submission was crap, but I have to confess that what they published was awful.

Charles, Mr. Writer for Hire, and if the price is right, I don't kiss and tell.

Posted by Charles at October 4, 2009 02:27 PM

Thanks so much for stating that "SGI members are not evil or bad people -- not at all" and that "person who told you about chanting Nam-myoho-renge-kyo and invited you to a SGI meeting is probably sincere, well-meaning and genuinely wants you to be happy." I need so much to remember that this is how I feel as I slowly divest myself of 22 years of active participation. My biggest reason for leaving has more to do with my dissatisfaction with the organization's lack of actual Buddhism, its focus on mentor-disciple, and its intolerance toward and ignorance of other Buddhist sects.

Hey Blue Lady, thank you for your comment about Rock the Era. SGI can forget it if they think they are going to get me to run around "supporting" the Youth Division to fill up this venue here that holds 8000. That place will be conspicuously not full. Furthermore, I agree that there are MUCH more important things to chant about and show up for than this event for an organization that does nothing to make the world safer, healthier, or more peaceful. All the books, videos, poetry, exhibits, and teas with famous people appeal to some people's vanity and desire to feel important. These activities do nothing to advance such a lofty and nebulous term like "world peace." Duh, who doesn't want that.

Hey Rothaus, thank you so much for your sympathy. I really need it along with a lot of compassion. Reading the posts continues to open my eyes. I was always bothered by somethings in SGI and felt I had nowhere to go to vent my complaints. For now writing here is helping a lot. But 22 years of practice and having introduced my mom 20 years ago. It's a lot of responsibility. I may have to go into therapy to deal with this. I am suffering so much over all of this. I just gave $1000 for the May contribution. Other years I even got a few non-SGI friends to contribute, using the Pride Parade expenses as a ruse. How could I do this to them or myself? Now I see SGI is a billion dollar organization that indeed does not need my money to run the community centers. That's why I donated. I thought I was supporting a struggling US Buddhist organization( I knew the Japanese branch was wealthy) to make comfortable local meeting places possible. I am not sure I regret giving the money, but I doubt I will do it again. But I have given lower sums for the past 21 years. All of this is too much. I want to cry. I want to tell my mom what I have discovered, but she's 75 and I don't want to do anymore harm. The poor thing feels like she has failed to introduce any new members despite how hard she practices.

Yes, thanks I knew Charles personally back in the day. I remember him telling me he was writing his book and just knew that the SGI would promote and support it just like they were doing with everyother non-Buddhist on Middle Way Press. Somehow SGI rejected him. I do not know why. I just knew at the time his book would help members who were suffering from cancer.
Fraught with Peril – I read from time to time.
Linda I read her archived site and I remember hearing about her on ARBN or the IRG I think?






quote tsukimoto]

Quote
Blue Lady
on a seperate note-----
She had mention before that the new guidance book out that is paperback and yellow is not written by Daisaku Ikeda. I don’t rightly know because I have not bought it.
However yesterday at the Sophia group meeting one of the WD read from this book. I realize I have never heard guidance like that before. What I mean Pres Ikeda does not write like that or speak like that. IT was more AMERICAN thought process if you get my drift. It was for May 16th. Has anyone else gotten the impression that he has Ghost’s writers?
.

Blue Lady, have you ever heard of Lisa Jones? She's a journalist from Colorado, and a former SGI member who worked as a ghostwriter for Ikeda. She angered SGI by telling people that she was a ghostwriter. Usually, ghostwriters sign a contract promising that they will not tell anyone that they wrote the book. For this, they're paid well, probably much more than they could earn selling a manuscript of their own. She also posted an anti-SGI website. It seems that SGI's lawyers came after her. She had to quit speaking about SGI and she had to take her website down. This was in the 1990's.

This is from page 53 of this thread:

The case of Lisa Jones: She was a ghost writer for President Ikeda -- actually not an uncommon thing. According to Charles Atkins, who is quoted below, this kind of arrangement is common. Famous people often do not write their own books and speeches. Many celebrities rely on ghostwriters who are paid well for their work but receive no credit or royalties -- and this is all part of the ghostwriter's contract. Charles Atkins, who writes a blog for www.fraughtwithperil.com explains below how this works.

-----------------------Beginning of Quote, Fraught With Peril Website, Kempon Hokke Blog--------------------------------

What Lisa Jones was enountered with was this: the master of a religious organization of tens of millions, allowing professional and superbly adept minions to write books for the public forum, that would be credited exclusively to Him.

My opinion here is that there was an ethical breech at the highest possible levels in allowing this to happen. I'm quite sure Mr. Ikeda is fully capable of writing his own books and I am sure that once the work-for-hire project was finished, edited, translated back into Japanese, the book was gone over by Mr. Ikeda. That's a huge assumption on my part, as it's also quite possible that Mr. Ikeda never laid eyes on the manuscript but had a team of his most trusted editors like Ms. Shinbutsu, his personal English editor do that final bidding.

Either way, from a writer's standpoint, a $15,000 contract to sift through lectures, notes, previous works, assemble them and compose a manuscript on a subject that you're intimately familiar with, would be a dream come true. If Lisa were to put together a manuscript on Buddhism of her own, that would bear her name on the jacket, she would be lucky to get a thousand dollar advance against royalties. In truth, she might have to submit her manuscript to hundreds of publishers over the course of years before she got an offer - IF she got an offer.

That's why, a $15K deal to write a book for a world famous person is a deal that's damn near impossible to pass up. The fact that this project was offered to her speaks volumes to her level of expertise. Where the rub came in was after the fact, when the realization came that the organization was fooling the members and that burning question of how many other books were published under his name that he did not write? So, I do understand what she did and why she did it. I have asked myself many times if I would do the same and can't truly answer that question. What I can say is that I respect Lisa's guts to listen to her conscience and do what she thought was the right thing. The money and the prestige can be very tempting, but the rules are simple: if you take the money, they have bought your silence.

I do know one thing, they'll think twice before they do that again. If that's what Lisa Jones accomplished, we all owe her a debt of gratitude.

A contract writer, which I was at one time for the SGI, signs away their rights to royalities and credit. This arrangement is extremely common in professional writing. The whole idea is for an expert writer to take on an agreed upon project for pay without credit - it's standard. A ghost writer is someone who is employed on contract to write and possibly help edit a work of fiction or perhaps non-fiction. The difference between a ghost writer and a contract writer is the same as the distinction between a hooker and a call girl.

Where legal trouble emerges is when a contract writer breaks their contract and discloses the specific nature of their work for hire, thus diminishing possible sales of the published work, as well as impuning the credited author. Every writer knows this. You sign a contract as a writer for hire, you take the money, keep your yap shut, and let others take credit for your work. Standard, standard, standard.

I will say this about my own writer for hire with the SGI, without disclosing which project(s) I worked on: They paid me on time. They were very involved in the process. There were more editoral layers than skins on an onion. AND, when we were done, they didn't use a single sentence I wrote. In other words, the SGI completely wasted the members' money on a writing project that they ended up doing themselves. Their finished project of the work they contracted me to write? A best seller for them that I consider utter crap. They probably thought my submission was crap, but I have to confess that what they published was awful.

Charles, Mr. Writer for Hire, and if the price is right, I don't kiss and tell.

Posted by Charles at October 4, 2009 02:27 PM[/quote]

Quote
doubtful
Hey Rothaus, thank you so much for your sympathy. I really need it along with a lot of compassion. Reading the posts continues to open my eyes. I was always bothered by somethings in SGI and felt I had nowhere to go to vent my complaints. For now writing here is helping a lot. But 22 years of practice and having introduced my mom 20 years ago. It's a lot of responsibility. I may have to go into therapy to deal with this. I am suffering so much over all of this. I just gave $1000 for the May contribution. Other years I even got a few non-SGI friends to contribute, using the Pride Parade expenses as a ruse. How could I do this to them or myself? Now I see SGI is a billion dollar organization that indeed does not need my money to run the community centers. That's why I donated. I thought I was supporting a struggling US Buddhist organization( I knew the Japanese branch was wealthy) to make comfortable local meeting places possible. I am not sure I regret giving the money, but I doubt I will do it again. But I have given lower sums for the past 21 years. All of this is too much. I want to cry. I want to tell my mom what I have discovered, but she's 75 and I don't want to do anymore harm. The poor thing feels like she has failed to introduce any new members despite how hard she practices.

Same here this year was the first time I gave more than in the past. I had no idea the American branch was just as wealthy.