I just posted a long message on the message board regarding HAI, which, gratefully, I won't repeat here in full.

I've been associated with HAI since 1990, and brought my husband into it. He became like a kid in a candy story with the availability of casual sex, and became involved with other women there since they all made themselves available so easily. Needless to say, we are in the middle of a divorce.

My experience of HAI is that it is a place that very vulnerable women gravitate to because they desperately need fulfillment, and they are "taught" that fulfillment is in playing sex games with the men. The men, of course, are mostly there for the casual sex. It amazed me to see the number of relationships where the men had a number of casual girlfriends and the women sat at home smiling nicely. Its hard to think anything else when management condones the polyamourous lifestyle and encourages multiple romantic relationships. All of the mumble/jumble about communication/honesty/accountability etc. is all just that...mumble jumble so that the leadership can get their sex kicks.

From what I've seen, only the really fat and ugly people seem to think that HAI is noble and true; those who are attractive are too busy having sex.

I absolutely agree with the comments in this thread regarding the sexual aspects of HAI. Over time, I came to see that it is a training ground to find vulnerable women who can be convinced to make themselves available to the men who are in the group seeking casual sex. It is not sold that way, but that is what it is. The group is run by people who all believe in poly marriages (if any marriage at all) and they are all looking to add to their harems. My husband got caught up in it, and he announced to me that I no longer met his needs because I wouldn't do kinky sex, and he was going to get his needs met at HAI.

Well... I'm definitely a fat woman and I had no end of men (and women) hitting on me while I was associated with HAI. I do think they prey on bigger people because they tend to have lower self esteem and are desperate for any modicum of attention.

I am VERY relieved to be out of it. I'm now married to a wonderful man who loves me for who I am and would never consider the destructiveness of asking for me to share him.

Thank you for the long post.

See: [forum.culteducation.com]

I am truly sorry that your involvement with HAI has resulted in your divorce. I thnk that you are right; it does appear to attract vulnerable women (and men) and groom them for sex. Level 4 is the first opportunity for this - although what goes on behind closed bedroom doors at earlier levels is a moot point. HAI covers itself by recommending a 'responsible sex talk' between intending couples. The fact that those individuals may have commited life-partners at home does not seem to feature in the discussions.

From experience it does seem that the majority of participants are 'singles with hang-ups' seeking easy sex because it is not available to them via the usual social channels of meeting others.

The poly aspect is well and truly founded in the late Stan Dale's own 'marriage' to two women. It has been rumoured in the above thread (or maybe elsewhere) that the younger women was under-age when he first had sex with her. Go figure.

ST



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 06/14/2008 03:14AM by SeekingTruth.

I met Stan Dale and both of his wives at the first two workshops that I did in California in the early 90's. I think he simply grew tired of one, met someone new, and made nice by keeping the old one around. Yes, the second wife was much younger and runs the organization now that both Stan and his first wife have died.

It certainly had the appearance of polygamy and reflects a great deal about the people who are still involved in HAI. The idea is "the more the merrier" and sex is a free-for-all. I didn't buy into this concept, so my husband just created it on his own without mentioning anything to me.

Daydreamer...

I didn't mean a personal insult by referring to fat people...but you do make a point that many heavier people have lower self-esteem and are therefore, much more vulnerable to the sexual attention at HAI. I remember talking to one woman who said that she never got any sex except when she came to workshops. Very sad.

I congratulate you on a successful marriage!

And it's funny... sex is not supposed to be happening at workshops, at least not the earlier ones.

If I ever went to another workshop, I would have the courage to stand up and say NO to the nudity and just watch them all supposedly honor my choice but at the same time gently encourage me to let go of my boundary and follow what THEY think is the right choice.

Sickening.

Of course, I'll NEVER go to another workshop... but I wish I'd had the courage and knowledge back in 2005 that I have now.

DayDreamer....I appreciate your swift kick-in-the-pants on the other "thread" regarding HAI. I am 99% certain that EXPOSITION1 is my husband, Dennis Jimmink. I also know the person that he was referring to as my friend, and am grateful that she has not yet posted anything, just to keep the opinions pure and honest. She also had a very bad experience at HAI.

What a fascinating discussion. I was curious about HAI and found these threads. I did Level 1 and I must admit that I was quite uncomfortable with a number of the exercises - but that largely had to do with my fear of the unknown and the possibility of being naked with strangers. I actually was clothed for much of the workshop as were others. That said, pushing through the fear was quite helpful. The group was seemingly "normal" although there were some people that were (like most of us from time to time) working through either personal or relationship issues. The facilitators were really just wonderful though. I would admit that HAI is not for everyone but I don't think that's HAI's fault or a knock on the program. If you were uncomfortable, you can just walk out the door. No biggie. I liked many of the people I met, still correspond with one or two of them. I thought the program was quite genuine and I have no doubt that it had a positive impact on a number of people. It's an experience that I will remember - perhaps in part because it was unique. No pressure to advance to another level, no weird crazy sex orgies - sorry folks. I'm pretty conventional but open to new things and development. I really enjoyed it and might explore another class when I have the time. Again, I understand others may have had different experiences and I think situations might be different depending upon different variables (participants, facilitators, location). I did my workshop at Harbin which is beautiful.

I just wanted to chime in because I think the workshop I attended was a rewarding personal experience for me.

It was a stretch at some points - but that's one of the reasons I wanted to do a workshop. To grow and to learn and to meet other similar minded people.

DCEsquire:

"HAI is not for everyone"?

This is a mantra amongst LGAT apologists.

And you appear to be a here to offer apologies about the group such as -- "The facilitators were really just wonderful..."

Were the "facilitators" Licensed mental health professionals?

How were they professionally credentialed in California to help participants "working through either personal or relationship issues"?

See [www.culteducation.com]

Clinical psychologist Philip Cushman studied "mass maranton training" groups like HAI.

He pointed out 13 liabilities that such groups often posses.

1. They lack adequate participant-selection criteria.

2. They lack reliable norms, supervision, and adequate training for leaders.

3. They lack clearly defined responsibility.

4. They sometimes foster pseudoauthenticity and pseudoreality.

5. They sometimes foster inappropriate patterns of relationships.

6. They sometimes ignore the necessity and utility of ego defenses.

7. They sometimes teach the covert value of total exposure instead of valuing personal differences.

8. They sometimes foster impulsive personality styles and behavioral strategies.

9. They sometimes devalue critical thinking in favor of "experiencing" without self-analysis or reflection.

10. They sometimes ignore stated goals, misrepresent their actual techniques, and obfuscate their real agenda.

11. They sometimes focus too much on structural self-awareness techniques and misplace the goal of democratic education; as a result participants may learn more about themselves and less about group process.

12. They pay inadequate attention to decisions regarding time limitations. This may lead to increased pressure on some participants to unconsciously "fabricate" a cure.

13. They fail to adequately consider the "psychonoxious" or deleterious effects of group participation (or] adverse countertransference reactions.