D of D,
I was just reading this morning in the daily bread 1Peter on the responsibilities of a deacon and thought about posting it. Good posting.
Thanks
Outreach

While no one wants to hurt anyone at TPC, we must always speak the truth in love because ultimately that is the only thing our Father in Heaven will bless and annoint. That is what members of this forum, or most of us, are doing.

God does things for a season and for a reason. The Fathers thoughts are not our thoughts! While our Father in Heaven might not reign in Pastor Mike now, he will only let this go on for so long and when he decides the season is over -- well lets just say I am so glad I am not on staff nor an elder or deacon at TPC. The battle is not ours, but the Lords. Jesus is walking with each individual who has left Turning Point and our Father in Heaven chose to open our eyes and remove us from TPC for a reason. Hold fast to your Faith in our loving Father in Heaven and he will make somthing good result from all this hurt and pain.

Daughter of Dorcas

Dear Pastor Jeff Barns,

The definition of gossip is idle talk or rumor about the personal or private affairs of others. I really don't see where the posts on this forum fit the definition. Information is researched and verified -- usually by more than one source. We have no interest in the personal lives of anyone at TPC which does not impact the performance of their professional duties and obligations. A lot of really God fearing people have left Turning Point because of the lack of accountability, inappropriate and inexcusable professional behavior of Pastor Mike, lack of transparency, questionable financial and budget decisions, a ridiculous salary for Pastor Mike. The list could go on and for the record please see the following:

While no one wants to hurt anyone at TPC, we must always speak the truth in love because ultimately that is the only thing our Father in Heaven will bless and anoint. That is what members of this forum, or most of us, are doing.

God does things for a season and for a reason. The Fathers thoughts are not our thoughts! While our Father in Heaven might not reign in Pastor Mike now, he will only let this go on for so long and when he decides the season is over -- well lets just say I am so glad I am not on staff nor an elder or deacon at TPC. The battle is not ours, but the Lords. Jesus is walking with each individual who has left Turning Point and our Father in Heaven chose to open our eyes and remove us from TPC for a reason. Hold fast to your Faith in our loving Father in Heaven and he will make something good result from all this hurt and pain.

So in closing I am sure that one of those who have been asked to monitor and disrupt this forum will print this out if you don't see it yourself.

We know that TPC has lost the covering of the Lord. We are not stupid or possessed. We are intelligent people who know what the Bible says is right and appropriate and in the end that is the guideline we all are to live by. Unfortunately it would appear that some at TPC are have lost sight of that and are after what they can get in this world.

Daughter of Dorcas

The monthly salary figure for Pastors Mike and Cindy is $15,000.00 per month, this was figure was checked and confirmed by asking church leadership point blank. They were uncomfortable to be sure and added that it is not church policy to discuss salaries' but the figure was confirmed. My question is why not? It is the God's money, it is the money freely given by members of the body of the church. Anyone who has ever attended and given money to TPC has a right to know where their money went. TPC is not a for profit entity, or at least it is not supposed to be a for profit entity. According to the Secretary of State it is a non-profit. So where is the money going?

On April 29, 2009 the attached information was updated. These salaries are in line with what the average person in this area makes in this area of Snohomish County and according to everything I have read that is what a Pastor's salary is supposed to be. Based on years of experience Pastors Mike and Cindy should be paid $51,000 per year for Pastor Mike and $25,500 for Pastor Cindy, given her duties, years of experience as a Pastor (since SOMA graduation seems to be the benchmark for everyone except Pastor Mike). Sorry, decipling during office hours should not be covered by salary compensation as non-staff deciplers are not paid. Teaching SOMA classes should be paid out of separate funds from SOMA tuition as well as rent and utilities for the building they use which was bought with stewardship money.

If rational logic were applied to the money received and spent by TPC, then their monthly income would be enough to more than cover everything in the budget with money to spare. In reading books and articles on toxic churches since leaving TPC, at the suggestion of a pastor who gave me a list of books to read, rational thinking does not apply at TPC it is all about honoring and blessing Pastor Mike at the expense of his flock. It is all about Pastor Mike's ego and his personal belief that he is deserving of double honor which he equates with $$$. Pastor Mike's actions and attitudes toward double honor and how it applies to him are narcissistic.

In many cases, people who narcissistic:
* Seek constant attention and admiration
* Consider themselves better than others
* Exaggerate their talents and achievements
* Believe that they are entitled to special treatment
* Are easily hurt but may not show it
* Set unrealistic goals
* May take advantage of others to achieve their goals

It has been mentioned in a post on one of the forum threads that Pastor Jeff Barnes and Kari Lewis cut off someone wanting to meet with Pastor Mike because he is to busy to meet with members of his flock. Are they aware of the problem and think by isolating Pastor Mike they are protecting not only him but their livelihood? The pastoral staff has a duty to shepherd and protect their flock and the elders have a duty of oversight of the senior pastor, The problems at Turning Point are never going to be resolved unless there is some intervention by reasonable and responsible members of the body. Unfortunately, that does not appear a possibility with the leadership so firmly entrenched. Pastor Mike needs help and the elders are sticking their heads in the sand rather than give this man the help that he needs. Double shame on each and every one of them.

Double praise and honor to our Father In Heaven who could cure all the problems at TPC if the pastoral staff and leadership would repent and ask for his help.

Daughter of Dorcas

Great post DoD! So true, too. Thank you for the information.

I've wondered how the body would react to the real numbers of how the budget is spent at the yearly bogus ratification meeting. That meeting is only to make themselves look good and people trust them! I know I always trusted that money was spent wisely. Learning otherwise made me feel deceived.

The change in budget figures is a first step for TPC to live within the tithes and offerings it receives. However, there still needs to be checks and balances so that funds cannot be diverted from ministries to fund salaries and junkets for the staff. Their needs to be complete transparency in the financial affairs of the church so that if tpcwocattender walked in and asked to see how the tithes and offering have been spent for the last six months they can be provided with actual and real time information. This includes salaries as well. TPC is not a for profit business. It is a non-profit tax exempt entity which is fully supported by the families that attend their. Truthfully, an independent budget analyst should be retained to review this new budget and see if it is a reasonable and appropriate allocation of church funds and report back to the body of TPC. If that means that some senior staff find their salaries, in keeping with area norms for pastors in this area based on experience, cut and more junior staff salaries raised to a living wage then that is how it should be.

The 1/10 of all tithes that Pastor Mike wants to be paid to his new entity should not go to Pastor Mike on top of his salaries. He receives a salary from TPC Marysville. Instead it should go to fund the overseas missionaries that TPC has relationships with.

Pastor Mike needs another sabbatical so that he can find his way back to his roots. Back to the pastor who made the enemy cower in fear every time he got up to speak. Back to the days in the old building when we had three services each Sunday. Back to the pastor who was down to earth and approachable who was the man of God that God told "all or nothing" all those years ago. Putting on airs and trying to be something your not is worldly it is not of God. Jesus did not die on the cross so that Pastor Mike could have the house on the hill with the ampitheatre in the back yard. Pastor Mike needs to humble himself. Pastor Jeff Barnes needs to humble himself. If you want to be God's chosen leaders at TPC you had better do his work and stop chasing after worldly luxuries.

Daughter of Dorcas

I'm beginning to think that the change in the budget is simply a pr stunt. It is my understanding that there was quite a bit of *fluff* in the original budget for this year, and that's what has been cut, in addition to the salaries and benefits for the two employees that resigned.

I can think of two more employees that probably should not be on staff......does TP really need to have two worship directors? I'm sure that one would suffice. And I'm wondering what Pastor Cyndi does for TP these days. The last I checked, she was a soma instructor (getting paid seperately for that job) and she held discipleship in the office during office hours.....Perhaps they should consider cutting her position too.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/07/2009 12:29AM by Brokenhearted.

Pastor Cyndi's job is to be the prophet of TPWOC and guide us into the future with the truth of Gods word. Does anybody know what the average prophet makes in our area?

Okay, I realized that probably sounded harsh. I honestly don't want to see anyone out of a much needed job. Pastor Cyndi is a 3/4 time staff person, making 50k a year, I really do wonder what her job description is, how she *earns* her paycheck. Does anyone know what she does, what her position is now (she used to be worship director, but there are two others on staff doing that job)?