Re: Turning Point Church World Outreach Center-Tell Your Story
Posted by:
Brokenhearted
()
Date: April 27, 2009 09:44PM
TP attender,
Do you have concerns about the finances at TP?
Do you know where the money from the stewardship campaign has gone?
Do you know what Pasotr Mike's salary is? Have you heard that when anyone on the salary board disagrees with giving Pastor Mike even more, their loyalty comes into question?
Do you understand the apostolic ministry? Do you understand why it's not biblical?
Do you know why it has not been announced to the general body? Do you know why staff was told not to talk about it, or to answer any questions about it?
Do you know why Pastor Jackie resigned? Emily Masten? Mauro Lasso? Susan Eskelin?
Do you know what might have changed so drastically that a woman who spent 12 years (maybe more?) of her life devoted to the kingdom under the direction of TP would suddenly up and leave?
Do you know why Pastor Jackie's resignation wasn't announced to the general body?
Have you watched the video that Braveheart posted about the word-faith doctrine?
Are you aware of what's being taught at SOMA?
Have you seen the evidence that the leaders at TP are being worshiped, and that leadership is encouraging it?
Do you understand that the lack of transparency, the lies and the secrets that TP leaders perpetuate is NOT the way a church should be run?
Do you disagree with the abusiveness that takes place to keep the body in line, to keep them from asking questions, to keep them in unity.....?
Do you have concerns about the finances at TP?
Do you know where the money from the stewardship campaign has gone?
Do you know what Pasotr Mike's salary is? Have you heard that when anyone on the salary board disagrees with giving Pastor Mike even more, their loyalty comes into question?
Do you understand the apostolic ministry? Do you understand why it's not biblical?
Do you know why it has not been announced to the general body? Do you know why staff was told not to talk about it, or to answer any questions about it?
Do you know why Pastor Jackie resigned? Emily Masten? Mauro Lasso? Susan Eskelin?
Do you know what might have changed so drastically that a woman who spent 12 years (maybe more?) of her life devoted to the kingdom under the direction of TP would suddenly up and leave?
Do you know why Pastor Jackie's resignation wasn't announced to the general body?
Have you watched the video that Braveheart posted about the word-faith doctrine?
Are you aware of what's being taught at SOMA?
Have you seen the evidence that the leaders at TP are being worshiped, and that leadership is encouraging it?
Do you understand that the lack of transparency, the lies and the secrets that TP leaders perpetuate is NOT the way a church should be run?
Do you disagree with the abusiveness that takes place to keep the body in line, to keep them from asking questions, to keep them in unity.....?
Re: Turning Point Church World Outreach Center-Tell Your Story
Posted by:
Brokenhearted
()
Date: April 27, 2009 09:55PM
Mark 13:21-23 (New International Version)
21At that time if anyone says to you, 'Look, here is the Christ[a]!' or, 'Look, there he is!' do not believe it. 22For false Christs and false prophets will appear and perform signs and miracles to deceive the elect—if that were possible. 23So be on your guard; I have told you everything ahead of time.
2 Thessalonians 2:8-10 (New International Version)
8And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord Jesus will overthrow with the breath of his mouth and destroy by the splendor of his coming. 9The coming of the lawless one will be in accordance with the work of Satan displayed in all kinds of counterfeit miracles, signs and wonders, 10and in every sort of evil that deceives those who are perishing. They perish because they refused to love the truth and so be saved.
Revelation 16:14 (New International Version)
14They are spirits of demons performing miraculous signs, and they go out to the kings of the whole world, to gather them for the battle on the great day of God Almighty.
Revelation 19:20
But the beast was captured, and with him the false prophet who had performed the miraculous signs on his behalf. With these signs he had deluded those who had received the mark of the beast and worshiped his image.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/27/2009 09:57PM by Brokenhearted.
21At that time if anyone says to you, 'Look, here is the Christ[a]!' or, 'Look, there he is!' do not believe it. 22For false Christs and false prophets will appear and perform signs and miracles to deceive the elect—if that were possible. 23So be on your guard; I have told you everything ahead of time.
2 Thessalonians 2:8-10 (New International Version)
8And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord Jesus will overthrow with the breath of his mouth and destroy by the splendor of his coming. 9The coming of the lawless one will be in accordance with the work of Satan displayed in all kinds of counterfeit miracles, signs and wonders, 10and in every sort of evil that deceives those who are perishing. They perish because they refused to love the truth and so be saved.
Revelation 16:14 (New International Version)
14They are spirits of demons performing miraculous signs, and they go out to the kings of the whole world, to gather them for the battle on the great day of God Almighty.
Revelation 19:20
But the beast was captured, and with him the false prophet who had performed the miraculous signs on his behalf. With these signs he had deluded those who had received the mark of the beast and worshiped his image.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/27/2009 09:57PM by Brokenhearted.
Re: Turning Point Church World Outreach Center-Tell Your Story
Posted by:
tpcwocattender
()
Date: April 27, 2009 11:06PM
Quote
Brokenhearted
TP attender,
Do you have concerns about the finances at TP?
Yes, I have. There is a level of transparency that is common among churches that is lacking here at tpc. The have budget meetings that are open to the congregation but these do not talk about SOMA. I am not so consumed by what a particular person makes. I am more interested in how our churches resources can do Gods work in our community. I believe tpc could do better.
Do you know where the money from the stewardship campaign has gone?
I have not checked. I know some went to the new SOMA building. That was part of the plan though. I have not asked to see the current balance of the checking account. I have not had a reason to.
Do you know what Pastor Mike's salary is?
I have heard the rumors. I don't have proof. I would address this not as an issue of how much he makes rather how it impacts the churches ability to provide services to the community.
Have you heard that when anyone on the salary board disagrees with giving Pastor Mike even more, their loyalty comes into question?
I have not
Do you understand the apostolic ministry?
I understand how Mike being an apostle looks like at tpc. There are several ways to view an apostolic calling. I am not ready to lump Mike's calling in with some of the radicals if that is what you are implying. This is something that is still an ongoing investigation of mine.
Do you understand why it's not biblical?
What is not biblical? Pastor Mike's interpretation of his calling?
Do you know why it has not been announced to the general body?
Yes, that was Mike's choice. That apparently will chance soon.
Do you know why staff was told not to talk about it, or to answer any questions about it?
Not true, I have had absolutely no issue asking questions of staff or elders.
Do you know why Pastor Jackie resigned?
Yes, I spoke to her personally.
Emily Masten?
Yes
Mauro Lasso?
No
Susan Eskelin?
No
Do you know what might have changed so drastically that a woman who spent 12 years (maybe more?) of her life devoted to the kingdom under the direction of TP would suddenly up and leave?
Who are we speaking of?
Do you know why Pastor Jackie's resignation wasn't announced to the general body?
I know what the thinking was and whole heartily disagree and told the leadership I disagreed.
Have you watched the video that Braveheart posted about the word-faith doctrine?
Not yet, I plan to.
Are you aware of what's being taught at SOMA?
No, I have not attended. I know what is rumored by those that have not attended. My questioning of graduates have yielded inconsistent answers.
Have you seen the evidence that the leaders at TP are being worshiped, and that leadership is encouraging it?
I have seen people take what I would call an unhealthy interest in what leadership thinks of them. This is common in every church I have attended. The one thing to remember is that this is not usually encouraged by the leader. In the case of tpc I have no evidence that it is encouraged. You could use the 'honor' or 'service' as evidence of this. I would not fault that line of thinking, it has merit.
Do you understand that the lack of transparency, the lies and the secrets that TP leaders perpetuate is NOT the way a church should be run?
I agree with the lack of transparency 100%. The others (lies, secrets and deception) I am investigating.
Do you disagree with the abusiveness that takes place to keep the body in line, to keep them from asking questions, to keep them in unity.....?
I ask questions and have not been abused so I can't speak to that. I believe there should be unity. I guess I don't know how to answer the main question mainly because I have not seen or experienced it.
I hope this helps.
Re: Turning Point Church World Outreach Center-Tell Your Story
Posted by:
onevoice
()
Date: April 28, 2009 12:01AM
I think most people are here because they require and are asking for HONESTY.
That being said I would like to share some of my experience with the Word of faith movement.
I have been a type I diabetic for 33 years of my life, diagnosed at age 7. I don't know why to this day, I could speculate, ie: generational sin in my family line. I really don't know.
What I do know is this: when pastors use the pulpit as a device to tell people that if they aren't healed they truly haven't recieved their salvation, their not holy enough, the list could go on I suppose.
When my spouse and I first attended a church when newly married we heard such a message and questioned it, "if you don't recieve healing you won't make it to heaven".
Eager to recieve all that God had for me I began to study for about a year on healing scriptures, getting them into my heart if you will, James states "as a man thinks in his heart so is he".
I then fleeced the lord for a sign to really know that I would know it was time to step out and trust in his words about healing.
Went to a crusade, recieved the holy spirit and took this as "my sign" it was time to stop taking my insulin.
In that time I stopped taking insulin, I got all the symptons of having very high blood sugar, my spouse was increasingly growing aggitated, fear had crept in but didn't want to squelch my faith.
After I could no longer walk down the hall, vomitting all over and my legs turning blue, the pastors wife, elder and my spouse, decided it was time to take me to the ER..
I remember being on that table in the ER having the nurse ask me "why did I not take my insulin?" I couldn't tell her why, what an embarrasement to my God and what a terrible testimony from yet another wacked out Christian as to why God chose not to heal them.
My point is this:
the bible states that God's word is the same yesterday, today and forever. Jesus did heal still does, I believe this, but when a person in authority uses his position to question one's salvation because maybe they haven't received their healing, they are treading in very dangerous territory.
I have been saved 22 years, been married almost 20 and my spouse knows me better than anyone on this earth, but only God truly knows my heart, not any one man or women.
Our fruit is what we are to be known by in this life, what we do, how we act, what we say.
Be very careful leaders in the church when talking on this subject as not receiving my healing almost made me walk away from my faith, almost died, 16 years ago. God has kept me every day of my life, it is his will whether or not I receive healing,not how good I am or not in my life. It is for a reason I have diabetes, I don't know why and honestly I will ask when I see my father face to face. I do not believe it is because I am not holy or spiritual enough, that is ridiculous thought, that belief would make my faith in Christ about me and my works and not the free gift of salvation that he paid for me on the cross.
Last final thought unrelated,
I have been married almost as long as the Villamors and marriage is hard, wonderful and everything in between. At best it would be difficult to be objective about my spouse being in such roles as elder, pastor and my spouse and keep it all seperated spiritually, and emotionally, get real, come on... again honesty is what is required among other issues.
I have some loose ends to finish at tp for my own integrity reasons and may share more later about a sporatic moment and disscussion I had with mike later and has some bearing on what most are asking for in leadership.
While walking today listening to my worship music, there is a song on it from Casting crowns, called "stained glass masquerade" seems to sum up what most are asking for on this blog!
That being said I would like to share some of my experience with the Word of faith movement.
I have been a type I diabetic for 33 years of my life, diagnosed at age 7. I don't know why to this day, I could speculate, ie: generational sin in my family line. I really don't know.
What I do know is this: when pastors use the pulpit as a device to tell people that if they aren't healed they truly haven't recieved their salvation, their not holy enough, the list could go on I suppose.
When my spouse and I first attended a church when newly married we heard such a message and questioned it, "if you don't recieve healing you won't make it to heaven".
Eager to recieve all that God had for me I began to study for about a year on healing scriptures, getting them into my heart if you will, James states "as a man thinks in his heart so is he".
I then fleeced the lord for a sign to really know that I would know it was time to step out and trust in his words about healing.
Went to a crusade, recieved the holy spirit and took this as "my sign" it was time to stop taking my insulin.
In that time I stopped taking insulin, I got all the symptons of having very high blood sugar, my spouse was increasingly growing aggitated, fear had crept in but didn't want to squelch my faith.
After I could no longer walk down the hall, vomitting all over and my legs turning blue, the pastors wife, elder and my spouse, decided it was time to take me to the ER..
I remember being on that table in the ER having the nurse ask me "why did I not take my insulin?" I couldn't tell her why, what an embarrasement to my God and what a terrible testimony from yet another wacked out Christian as to why God chose not to heal them.
My point is this:
the bible states that God's word is the same yesterday, today and forever. Jesus did heal still does, I believe this, but when a person in authority uses his position to question one's salvation because maybe they haven't received their healing, they are treading in very dangerous territory.
I have been saved 22 years, been married almost 20 and my spouse knows me better than anyone on this earth, but only God truly knows my heart, not any one man or women.
Our fruit is what we are to be known by in this life, what we do, how we act, what we say.
Be very careful leaders in the church when talking on this subject as not receiving my healing almost made me walk away from my faith, almost died, 16 years ago. God has kept me every day of my life, it is his will whether or not I receive healing,not how good I am or not in my life. It is for a reason I have diabetes, I don't know why and honestly I will ask when I see my father face to face. I do not believe it is because I am not holy or spiritual enough, that is ridiculous thought, that belief would make my faith in Christ about me and my works and not the free gift of salvation that he paid for me on the cross.
Last final thought unrelated,
I have been married almost as long as the Villamors and marriage is hard, wonderful and everything in between. At best it would be difficult to be objective about my spouse being in such roles as elder, pastor and my spouse and keep it all seperated spiritually, and emotionally, get real, come on... again honesty is what is required among other issues.
I have some loose ends to finish at tp for my own integrity reasons and may share more later about a sporatic moment and disscussion I had with mike later and has some bearing on what most are asking for in leadership.
While walking today listening to my worship music, there is a song on it from Casting crowns, called "stained glass masquerade" seems to sum up what most are asking for on this blog!
Re: Turning Point Church World Outreach Center-Tell Your Story
Posted by:
TurningPointReject
()
Date: April 28, 2009 01:19AM
Quote
tpcwocattender
Do you disagree with the abusiveness that takes place to keep the body in line, to keep them from asking questions, to keep them in unity.....?
I ask questions and have not been abused so I can't speak to that. I believe there should be unity. I guess I don't know how to answer the main question mainly because I have not seen or experienced it.
I hope this helps.
TPC Attender,
Thank you for taking time to answer the questions posed to you. I am curious about a statement you made in your answer to the last question: "I believe there should be unity".
Would you please share more detail about what you mean by the aforementioned statement. What do you mean by "unity"? What might that look like at TPC? Unity in what? Through what? For what? And how should "disunity" be handled?
Thank you,
TPR
Re: Turning Point Church World Outreach Center-Tell Your Story
Posted by:
Brokenhearted
()
Date: April 28, 2009 02:25AM
Do you have concerns about the finances at TP?
Yes, I have. There is a level of transparency that is common among churches that is lacking here at tpc. The have budget meetings that are open to the congregation but these do not talk about SOMA. I am not so consumed by what a particular person makes. I am more interested in how our churches resources can do Gods work in our community. I believe tpc could do better.
Do you know how the resources at TP are used? Do you have specific concerns outside of SOMA? What are your concerns about SOMA?
Do you know where the money from the stewardship campaign has gone?
I have not checked. I know some went to the new SOMA building. That was part of the plan though. I have not asked to see the current balance of the checking account. I have not had a reason to.
Well, I can tell you that about half of the stewardship money is gone (maybe more?). It was moved to the general fund b/c the income was not meeting the budget. I have to ask how that is good stewardhip?
Do you know what Pastor Mike's salary is?
I have heard the rumors. I don't have proof. I would address this not as an issue of how much he makes rather how it impacts the churches ability to provide services to the community.
I am not currently in a position to provide *proof* but I have had it confirmed by reliable sources that Mike makes $10,000 a month. I would guess that high of a salary is effecting the services to the community when things like the benevolent ministry, breakfast for the set up crew, not providing the neccessary supplies for the ministries are being cut, but Mike is still receiving his salary.
Have you heard that when anyone on the salary board disagrees with giving Pastor Mike even more, their loyalty comes into question?
I have not
I have. Anyone who disagrees with *honoring* Mike financially is shamed into *unity*.
Do you understand the apostolic ministry?
I understand how Mike being an apostle looks like at tpc. There are several ways to view an apostolic calling. I am not ready to lump Mike's calling in with some of the radicals if that is what you are implying. This is something that is still an ongoing investigation of mine.
I'm not implying anything. I'm saying that Mike as an apostle, w/out accountability is not biblical. In fact, the bible warns up time and time again not to follow false prophets and apostles.
Do you understand why it's not biblical?
What is not biblical? Pastor Mike's interpretation of his calling?
Creating a new denomination in which you are the sole leader, the top authority. Did you know that Pastor Mike can't be fired? He will remain in his postion above TP (and all TP church plants) ? Did you know that each church tithes to him?
Do you know why it has not been announced to the general body?
Yes, that was Mike's choice. That apparently will chance soon.
I pray that you are right. How long are you willing to wait for that to change?
Do you know why staff was told not to talk about it, or to answer any questions about it?
Not true, I have had absolutely no issue asking questions of staff or elders.
You ask, but are you getting answers? There WAS a memo sent out to all staff members instructing them to direct all questions to Jeff Barnes or Kari Lewis...nobody else should be talking about it.
Do you know why Pastor Jackie resigned?
Yes, I spoke to her personally.
Emily Masten?
Yes
Mauro Lasso?
No
Susan Eskelin?
No
There are members of leadership that do not agree with the new direction that Mike is leading the church. They can't stop him, so instead of staying, they are leaving.....
Do you know what might have changed so drastically that a woman who spent 12 years (maybe more?) of her life devoted to the kingdom under the direction of TP would suddenly up and leave?
Who are we speaking of?
I was originally thinking of Pastor Jackie when I wrote this....but I have since considered all the people that are leaving TP. Do you know how many years these people have invested in TP? Do you think that these servants in Christ are leaving on a whim? Do you not think that perhaps they see things, or know things that would cause them to turn away from TP? These people are not falling away, they are not forsaking Christ. They are leaving b/c of the very things that TP is doing against the people of God, against scripture, against God himself.
Do you know why Pastor Jackie's resignation wasn't announced to the general body?
I know what the thinking was and whole heartily disagree and told the leadership I disagreed.
Were you given an opportunity to voice your disagreement?
Have you watched the video that Braveheart posted about the word-faith doctrine?
Not yet, I plan to.
Please do, it is fill of excellent info.
Are you aware of what's being taught at SOMA?
No, I have not attended. I know what is rumored by those that have not attended. My questioning of graduates have yielded inconsistent answers.
Your questions of graduates are inconsistant b/c what's being taught is ever changing. The students are being taught to worship Mike. They have been taught that a deacons role in the church is to serve the leaders (when it clearly states in the bible that a deacon's role is to serve the body).
Have you seen the evidence that the leaders at TP are being worshiped, and that leadership is encouraging it?
I have seen people take what I would call an unhealthy interest in what leadership thinks of them. This is common in every church I have attended. The one thing to remember is that this is not usually encouraged by the leader. In the case of tpc I have no evidence that it is encouraged. You could use the 'honor' or 'service' as evidence of this. I would not fault that line of thinking, it has merit.
I would agree with you that this is common. However, I have witnessed leaders encourage this....look around you, how many men and women look like M&C?
Do you understand that the lack of transparency, the lies and the secrets that TP leaders perpetuate is NOT the way a church should be run?
I agree with the lack of transparency 100%. The others (lies, secrets and deception) I am investigating.
I pray that you get answers.....we all deserve them.
Do you disagree with the abusiveness that takes place to keep the body in line, to keep them from asking questions, to keep them in unity.....?
I ask questions and have not been abused so I can't speak to that. I believe there should be unity. I guess I don't know how to answer the main question mainly because I have not seen or experienced it.
Well, I am very glad that you have not been abused. I am sorry to say though, that is not true of many (most?). I have witnessed it, I have experienced it myself. Can you share what you think unity looks like, how it looks at TP, and how it should be maintained? To what extremes is it okay to go to keep unity?
Yes, I have. There is a level of transparency that is common among churches that is lacking here at tpc. The have budget meetings that are open to the congregation but these do not talk about SOMA. I am not so consumed by what a particular person makes. I am more interested in how our churches resources can do Gods work in our community. I believe tpc could do better.
Do you know how the resources at TP are used? Do you have specific concerns outside of SOMA? What are your concerns about SOMA?
Do you know where the money from the stewardship campaign has gone?
I have not checked. I know some went to the new SOMA building. That was part of the plan though. I have not asked to see the current balance of the checking account. I have not had a reason to.
Well, I can tell you that about half of the stewardship money is gone (maybe more?). It was moved to the general fund b/c the income was not meeting the budget. I have to ask how that is good stewardhip?
Do you know what Pastor Mike's salary is?
I have heard the rumors. I don't have proof. I would address this not as an issue of how much he makes rather how it impacts the churches ability to provide services to the community.
I am not currently in a position to provide *proof* but I have had it confirmed by reliable sources that Mike makes $10,000 a month. I would guess that high of a salary is effecting the services to the community when things like the benevolent ministry, breakfast for the set up crew, not providing the neccessary supplies for the ministries are being cut, but Mike is still receiving his salary.
Have you heard that when anyone on the salary board disagrees with giving Pastor Mike even more, their loyalty comes into question?
I have not
I have. Anyone who disagrees with *honoring* Mike financially is shamed into *unity*.
Do you understand the apostolic ministry?
I understand how Mike being an apostle looks like at tpc. There are several ways to view an apostolic calling. I am not ready to lump Mike's calling in with some of the radicals if that is what you are implying. This is something that is still an ongoing investigation of mine.
I'm not implying anything. I'm saying that Mike as an apostle, w/out accountability is not biblical. In fact, the bible warns up time and time again not to follow false prophets and apostles.
Do you understand why it's not biblical?
What is not biblical? Pastor Mike's interpretation of his calling?
Creating a new denomination in which you are the sole leader, the top authority. Did you know that Pastor Mike can't be fired? He will remain in his postion above TP (and all TP church plants) ? Did you know that each church tithes to him?
Do you know why it has not been announced to the general body?
Yes, that was Mike's choice. That apparently will chance soon.
I pray that you are right. How long are you willing to wait for that to change?
Do you know why staff was told not to talk about it, or to answer any questions about it?
Not true, I have had absolutely no issue asking questions of staff or elders.
You ask, but are you getting answers? There WAS a memo sent out to all staff members instructing them to direct all questions to Jeff Barnes or Kari Lewis...nobody else should be talking about it.
Do you know why Pastor Jackie resigned?
Yes, I spoke to her personally.
Emily Masten?
Yes
Mauro Lasso?
No
Susan Eskelin?
No
There are members of leadership that do not agree with the new direction that Mike is leading the church. They can't stop him, so instead of staying, they are leaving.....
Do you know what might have changed so drastically that a woman who spent 12 years (maybe more?) of her life devoted to the kingdom under the direction of TP would suddenly up and leave?
Who are we speaking of?
I was originally thinking of Pastor Jackie when I wrote this....but I have since considered all the people that are leaving TP. Do you know how many years these people have invested in TP? Do you think that these servants in Christ are leaving on a whim? Do you not think that perhaps they see things, or know things that would cause them to turn away from TP? These people are not falling away, they are not forsaking Christ. They are leaving b/c of the very things that TP is doing against the people of God, against scripture, against God himself.
Do you know why Pastor Jackie's resignation wasn't announced to the general body?
I know what the thinking was and whole heartily disagree and told the leadership I disagreed.
Were you given an opportunity to voice your disagreement?
Have you watched the video that Braveheart posted about the word-faith doctrine?
Not yet, I plan to.
Please do, it is fill of excellent info.
Are you aware of what's being taught at SOMA?
No, I have not attended. I know what is rumored by those that have not attended. My questioning of graduates have yielded inconsistent answers.
Your questions of graduates are inconsistant b/c what's being taught is ever changing. The students are being taught to worship Mike. They have been taught that a deacons role in the church is to serve the leaders (when it clearly states in the bible that a deacon's role is to serve the body).
Have you seen the evidence that the leaders at TP are being worshiped, and that leadership is encouraging it?
I have seen people take what I would call an unhealthy interest in what leadership thinks of them. This is common in every church I have attended. The one thing to remember is that this is not usually encouraged by the leader. In the case of tpc I have no evidence that it is encouraged. You could use the 'honor' or 'service' as evidence of this. I would not fault that line of thinking, it has merit.
I would agree with you that this is common. However, I have witnessed leaders encourage this....look around you, how many men and women look like M&C?
Do you understand that the lack of transparency, the lies and the secrets that TP leaders perpetuate is NOT the way a church should be run?
I agree with the lack of transparency 100%. The others (lies, secrets and deception) I am investigating.
I pray that you get answers.....we all deserve them.
Do you disagree with the abusiveness that takes place to keep the body in line, to keep them from asking questions, to keep them in unity.....?
I ask questions and have not been abused so I can't speak to that. I believe there should be unity. I guess I don't know how to answer the main question mainly because I have not seen or experienced it.
Well, I am very glad that you have not been abused. I am sorry to say though, that is not true of many (most?). I have witnessed it, I have experienced it myself. Can you share what you think unity looks like, how it looks at TP, and how it should be maintained? To what extremes is it okay to go to keep unity?
Re: Turning Point Church World Outreach Center-Tell Your Story
Posted by:
tpcwocattender
()
Date: April 28, 2009 02:26AM
To answer TPR question on unity. There are several things that bring unity to a specific body (I.e. Tpc). I was referring to a churches vision and/or mission statement. I agree and support tpc's vision and mission. I would like to see more emphasis on benevolence. That is something that individuals can fulfill without a church specifically calling it out.
I will try and anticipate something you or others are thinking. Is tpc's mission being carried out? No, I don't think we 'nurture' our congregation as stated in our mission. This has been a point of conversation when I have had the opportunity to talk to leadership. Both in and out of my influence.
The church (tpc) could rally around the vision of the church right now. It would help bring us together during an admittedly hard time not to run away.
Obviously we as the bride of Christ unify under the call to go and make disciples of all nations and to make Him know by how we love one another. The essentials of what salvation is and the trinity are the doctrinal foundation we unify on.
Does that help?
I will try and anticipate something you or others are thinking. Is tpc's mission being carried out? No, I don't think we 'nurture' our congregation as stated in our mission. This has been a point of conversation when I have had the opportunity to talk to leadership. Both in and out of my influence.
The church (tpc) could rally around the vision of the church right now. It would help bring us together during an admittedly hard time not to run away.
Obviously we as the bride of Christ unify under the call to go and make disciples of all nations and to make Him know by how we love one another. The essentials of what salvation is and the trinity are the doctrinal foundation we unify on.
Does that help?
Re: Turning Point Church World Outreach Center-Tell Your Story
Posted by:
tpcwocattender
()
Date: April 28, 2009 02:46AM
There are a lot of follow-up questions to answer as a result of recent posts.
There is a lot I personally am seeking proof to validate. As I stated, I am aware of several people doing what I am doing. I think it is only a matter of time before transparency will be the answer that will stop the exodus. If they aren't going to go down that path it will be sad.
To answer a few follow-up questions.
I have been given an opportunity to speak my disagreement. I haven't got all questions answered yet.
I have heard the curriculum at soma is changing. I don't know specifically what is changing.
My investigation so to speak is ongoing and will end with me leaving or feeling satisfied that I and my family are where God wants us and we are safe from being mislead. That is going to take more time. I have no problem sharing my experience once complete.
There is a lot I personally am seeking proof to validate. As I stated, I am aware of several people doing what I am doing. I think it is only a matter of time before transparency will be the answer that will stop the exodus. If they aren't going to go down that path it will be sad.
To answer a few follow-up questions.
I have been given an opportunity to speak my disagreement. I haven't got all questions answered yet.
I have heard the curriculum at soma is changing. I don't know specifically what is changing.
My investigation so to speak is ongoing and will end with me leaving or feeling satisfied that I and my family are where God wants us and we are safe from being mislead. That is going to take more time. I have no problem sharing my experience once complete.
Re: Turning Point Church World Outreach Center-Tell Your Story
Posted by:
TurningPointReject
()
Date: April 28, 2009 03:33AM
Thank you TPCAttender.
Of the following teachings that have and do occur at TPC; which do you agree with and which do you disagree with:
Spiritual Parenting
Double Tithing
Honoring
Covenant Relationship
Covering
Healing
Word of Faith
Prosperity
Demonic Possession
Return of the Apostolic Ministry
Accountable only To God
Thank you, as I know there is much to respond to.
I will understand if you choose not to respond.
TPR
Of the following teachings that have and do occur at TPC; which do you agree with and which do you disagree with:
Spiritual Parenting
Double Tithing
Honoring
Covenant Relationship
Covering
Healing
Word of Faith
Prosperity
Demonic Possession
Return of the Apostolic Ministry
Accountable only To God
Thank you, as I know there is much to respond to.
I will understand if you choose not to respond.
TPR
Re: Turning Point Church World Outreach Center-Tell Your Story
Posted by:
Miki
()
Date: April 28, 2009 03:59AM
Dear TPC Attender,
You offered to have coffee with people. I have extended that offer, yet I still haven't heard from you.
It's a matter of heart. This is between you and God. Mike & Cyndi and God. All of the forum and God. We here cannot try to convince you of the evidence of Spiritual Abuse, etc. TPCC is absolutely NOT a biblically sound church and it's hurting the community and people.
So to you I say.... seek and you shall find (your answers). No one can try to convince you or help you get/find your answers.... only you.
God Bless You!
Miki
You offered to have coffee with people. I have extended that offer, yet I still haven't heard from you.
It's a matter of heart. This is between you and God. Mike & Cyndi and God. All of the forum and God. We here cannot try to convince you of the evidence of Spiritual Abuse, etc. TPCC is absolutely NOT a biblically sound church and it's hurting the community and people.
So to you I say.... seek and you shall find (your answers). No one can try to convince you or help you get/find your answers.... only you.
God Bless You!
Miki
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