Once again I ponder my issues and especially with my leaving TPC.

Lets be real here for a second, for all you TPCers who read this... I know who some of you are.

Let me take some time to explain some things. Most people at TPC will assume and conclude that it was an easy choice to leave and that we are stupid for not having good reason.

Lets be raw for a second which one of the three reasons would you think is a bad reason for leaving a church.

- A pastor who lies....

now you know i was once in your shoes too, i was in leadership at TPC and I thought the people on this website were full of it, boy was i wrong... my point is if you search out TPC you will find the same things everyone of us did.... lies as far as your eyes can see

- A church that is not fincially accountable...

They dont provide fincial information disclosing where the money goes they don't fill certain tax forms prventing them from being accountable.

Go ahead ask for them...fill me in on what Pastor Mike is making these days...

- Doctrine,

Now wait before you write this one off like I would have just 10 months ago. Doctrine is very important because what the bible is commuicating is very important. If you or I mess up, it is on our heads. Please do a in-depth study of what you believe and why. When I did I threw out many belifes in Apostles and Prophets, although i beleive in the giftings. The roles do not come with out great consqunces for sin. Like stoning... and if you want to be called a prophet and are willing to let me stone you if you make a false prophsey then you can by all means become a prophet, have the role.


Sorry for my rablings.. what i wanted to say was think, study, and for gods sakes (and yours) do yourself a favor and don't take no for an answer! Biblical truth is important and if you believe that then finding truth should be a noble task.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/09/2009 03:31PM by Forgiveness_101.

Sorry for the second post in a row I did not want to put two different topics in one post.

This thought came from and is more personal than the last, when i was talking with my friend mitchel. A very good friend who has been going to church for some time and has listened to me talk about this for about 6 months now.

In our conversation I talked about how I dispise and yes "Hate" TPC and how I am learning to seperate my feelings of love and hate.

Let me preface the conversation just a little. I, just like many others at TPC have only gone to TPC, which leaving might often result in people to conclude that God is bad, dosen't exsit, or is crule so therfore want nothing to do with him. I am very glad that God given me a brain that concludes that he is good, and that something went very wrong.

So having only gone to one church my whole life and only having one church to base my Christianity on, I kicked the whole bag out. I actually came up with a word picture that i will shortly describe.

TPC is like a bag of poop, and yes there are some good things in TPC. We will call these good things marshmellos. (Side note: This is why when ppl tell me there are good things at TPC i get rather annoyed, because anyone who looks at a bag of poop with corn stuck in it doesn't say "hey what nutritious poop" they say "that is disgusting, how could you have stayed in there for so long?") And now consqently when ever someone presents a marshmello in front of me, I disect it and scrtinize it.

Does anyone else feel like this?



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 09/09/2009 03:34PM by Forgiveness_101.

1 Peter 5:8 (The Message)

He Gets the Last Word

8-11Keep a cool head. Stay alert. The Devil is poised to pounce, and would like nothing better than to catch you napping. Keep your guard up. You're not the only ones plunged into these hard times. It's the same with Christians all over the world. So keep a firm grip on the faith. The suffering won't last forever. It won't be long before this generous God who has great plans for us in Christ—eternal and glorious plans they are!—will have you put together and on your feet for good. He gets the last word; yes, he does.

What is moving and shaking at TPC? [www.lttnministries.org.au]

Saddened

Churches come and go. Attendance goes up and down over time. The years may bring Holy Spirit led positive change or satan caused challenges.

However, the power of Jesus Christ is not diminished!

Only by discounting and discrediting Jesus could Pilate, the Romans, and the Pharisees crucify Jesus. That’s precisely the reason why we need to acknowledge Jesus as our Savior. The human race has an uncanny ability to rationalize unethical and sinful behavior, compromise our values, and let people of questionable and selfish motives into positions of leadership. TPC needed to discredit Pastor Jackie because she stood up to Pastor Mike in a leadership meeting and told him he was wrong and that she didn’t agree with him. She resigned over this and other ethical differences after just being restored as an Elder. This left egg all over Mikes face. Mike does not like egg on his face and neither do the Elders. Jackie’s resignation gave Mike and TPC leadership a problem and they dealt with it just as the Pharisees did with Jesus. They sought to discredit her and crucify her personal and professional reputation in the court of public opinion. However - they failed! Why? The reason they failed so miserably was that Jesus was standing with Jackie and Sid Singer. Their plot turned into even more egg on Mike’s face and another fine mess for TPC because it was not motivated by Godly motives. The outcome has become the further loss congregants who realized what Mike and the Elders were doing and their purely human and selfish motives. The only person Mike has to blame for his current problems at TPC is himself.

Grace and forgiveness are Pastor Jackie's answer to her trials. Pastor Mike and the TPC leadership could learn a lot from Pastor Jackie on the right and wrong way to handle life's trials. Unfortunately, they are letting the enemy motivate their actions and reactions to life's trials because they certainly are not acting in a Godly manner.

All we can do is pray for them to accept Jackie's grace and forgiveness and repent for their failings and ask God to redirect their steps. This is exactly what we need to be praying for in agreement and unity. So that no other TPC staffer or congregant has to go through the trial's that Pastor Jackie has.


D of D

As I've watched TP over these many months I've noticed an ever increasing theme: constant error. Even when they make a seemingly good decision it's tragic. Everything Mike does to 'fix' things makes things worse. At every turn there is a curse. Everything he does turns bad right now and makes him look worse. I believe God is allowing it to bring him to repentance but I don't believe that day will come. there have been too many prophetic words and dreams showing utter distruction but these dreams and words have all been discredited. I believe he still has the choice but somehow, like Pharoah, I think God has hardened his heart so that he might learn this lesson for real, once and for all. It's as though all blessing is gone and they are being led by the enemy completely. We have stopped praying for them - it was weird but ater a year of prayer we felt like God told us to. What a sad thing. I feel for all those who got saved at TP and know no other church - they are the most grevious victims that suffer. Don't loose heart because there are many good churches out there. Sit the pastors down and ask them clear questions - we did knowing that we could risk being in the 'no church zone' for a while.

BTW:
Someone asked earlier about the $187K/yr. I believe that this was started in September but before that I think it was half that as the elders wanted Mike and Cindy to have double honor. I may be wrong but I know he hasn't gotten 187K for three years.

Also the Mt. Vernon TP has now decided Jackie stole from them. It's so insane. Mike has done this several times in the past. He is charachtarized by issuing the "alienate and ostrosize" rule agianst those who oppose him. He's done it to his wifes family, to several past elders, best friends, staff members and oh yeah, the 300 who just left... I guess we're all just nuts... I can't tell you how many times we've wished it was us who were wrong - it would be so easy because we would like to believe we'd repent and all would go back to normal. One day I was begging God to speak to me - was i wrong - what was going on, etc. I did the old "I'm going to open my bible and point" to hear from God. So I opened it up (fully expecting silence) and pointed to Ezekiel 34. I didn't know what Ezekiel 34 said nor had anyone been talking about it at that time but there it was, imagine my utter shock. I was both devastated and elated that God was confirming that our leaving was right and we left long before this hemorrhage.

Be encouraged, prophets have spoken and they have mocked them. God will not be mocked. Pray for those who bring them word that they won't be devoured by that Jezebel spirit.

Die Quietly

Point made Die Quietly. God's will be done in this matter and if it is Ezekiel 34, then I am glad I will not be anywhere near TPC when it happens.

D of D the point I took from what you were saying was if they went after Pastor Jackie for confronting Mike and disagreeing with him, then no one whether staffer, congregant, or ex-TPC member is really safe from personal and public attacks by a man who is watching his world fall apart and striking out at any and everyone he blames for his problems -- with the exception of himself of course.

Saddened

TPWOC sermon for Sunday, Sept.6 The Terror of Fear by false( I am pretending to be a) prophet Cyndi Villamor is now online at TPWOC home web site. Cyndi asked the people, How many of you would like to get smart today? Cyndi is going to show us how to be smart. Cyndi says first you must give your tithe to her and Mike or the terror of fear will get you, your car engines will blow up, its just ridicules, alot of bad stuff might happen! What does the fear of God look like? Terror with a understanding and respect of the awesomeness power of God. Cyndi wants the money to keep coming in so she says that if you don't tithe to us then you are in sin. So much for the cheerful giver.Cyndi is using the scare tactic to keep the inner circle intact. Cyndi says just ask God for wisdom, that is why Cyndi is so much smarter and perfect because she really thinks she is some special annointed prophet. I mean she really recieved wisdom from God when she booked false prosperity postive confession word-faith teacher Casey Treat and false teacher Dave(I want to be the next Tony Robbins) Martin for the TPWOC decipleship conference. If we don't believe like Cyndi we are just untrained, we lack faith and we our just plain arrogant. I mean we don't know the scriptures like Cyndi.We must understand the prosperity God of Cyndi,and not be so rebellious. Cyndi says rebellion is the sin of divination and arrogance is the evil of idolatry. We are just rejecting the word of God. Arrogance is insubordination, being pushy and being presumptuous.Cyndi says with pride there is no room for God and we have missplaced fear. We are afraid of people instead of her prosperity God.She says , people can't send us to hell and we are afraid to offend people. If I don't speak the way I should what is God going to do to me. We should not have a state of fear over people. Especially the people who have left TPWOC. Cyndi is looking for mighty men( i guess mike is not enough for her) who give her strong support and will stand there ground when everyone else is running away(leaving TPWOC). Mighty men are confident of victory, don't let them defeat you, we must defend our ground and not back down. We must be willing to stand completely alone when everyone else is fleeing. We must show strong support for Mikes kingship. Don't get me wrong Cyndi's sermon had some good stuff in it and sometimes I think she does alot better job teaching then her husband Mike. She tells us how to protect our children with the correction of the Lord but she is forgetting all the false teaching she is giving her children. I believe she thinks we should not be selfish but all the prosperity promises in the bible are hers for the taking. I think the Villamors problem is they have to much prosperity in there spirit. The bible says blessed our the poor in spirit,for theirs is the kingdom of heaven. We can talk about the fear of God and use the bible to prove our point. And it is good to fear the Lord. What God does Mike and Cyndi fear, is it the God of prosperity and popularity! Mike and Cyndi claim to be an apostle and a prophet. They have never been one, not now ,not ever!

The attention placed on Jackie is intended to be a a diversion from the core issues. But now it appears to have backfired and has served to remove another layer of masking and the issues for TPC have deepened. Even if Jackie did mishandle some finances it has absolutely no bearing on the key issues of the church. I have never seen an organization handle money perfectly that is why an audit is needed and "the books" in their entirety need to be open to the church members. If there are no wrong doing then it will not be an issue for the church.
Personally I will not belong to a church that will not reveal ALL financial records to any member, any time that it is requested. We are called to be stewards of what he has provided.

If Turning Point is to survive it MUST disconnect from key people that are having major negative influence . If not, then the church will continue to spiral down, out of control. Look to see what is happening in Sacramento and expect much of the same.

Elders - the blood will be on your hands. Don't be afraid, take courage and do what is right in the sight of God. All eyes must turn to Jesus and not to man. Jackie took courage and for that I have much respect for her. I know it was very difficult but in the end, she keeps her integrity, and it is sure to please the Lord. Be individuals and seek Him first, do not be intimidated, manipulated or pressured. What is your character? What is your integrity worth to you? It is your responsibility. Find the truth and present it to Him, Jesus Christ, the author of your salvation. Man will not be there with you when you face God on judgement day. Because of your position you will answer for not only your life but also how you handled the responsibilty for the life of the people. Are there people being hurt? Your family, children, friends and community, are watching you. You will influence many of them deeply. This HUGE ERROR with how you handled Jackie to save your church is a mega strike sure to last a lifetime.

1 Tim 2:7
For God did not give me a spirit of timidity, but of power, of love and of self-discipline.

Don't get me wrong Cyndi's sermon had some good stuff in it and sometimes I think she does alot better job teaching then her husband Mike. She tells us how to protect our children with the correction of the Lord but a quote from buddy ted haggart preached good messages right up to the time he was busted

I said I was all done with Turning Point and I am. All the events of the past month are mind boggling and so disheartening. Come on Elders! Stand up, how can you all be so ignorant to the Word really. Shunning and disassociating with the evil doers? Mike Villamor does NOT have the discernment of Paul, and Pastor Jackie is not a gossip or slanderer. I encourage her to begin to warn people against TP as I am doing now. If that makes me a gossip and slanderer then so be it! Cindy and the elders have their definition of gossip. WRONG! Telling the truth with the correct motivation is not wrong, and who are they to judge her heart. Her poor son and daughter in law, what kind of position did the elders put them in. Can they hang with mom and dad or will they be fired. WRONG WRONG WRONG God help Turning Point and those still there! Judgement comes hard. From 1000 last year at this time to 400 (if they say 500 they are lying) down to one service at the High School! Just go back to the bldg you own. Start being a good steward of Gods money now. Have two services there. You are at where you were (even less) when you moved into the Jr hi. Explain where 400k has gone from the Bldg fund. Did Pastor Jackie steal that too? You are tredding on very thin ice. All your prophets have left, you only have Kim and Cindy left. Hmmm again less accountability! More crap is coming! Villamors, Barnes, Olins, Koellmers (who by the way themselves have received lavish gifts from thiefs in the congregation) YES investigate that fraud man. and sadly the Lewis' you all will answer for what you have done. Yes cindy, good sermon FEAR THE LORD!!!!