Australian cult: Anyone recognize this?
Posted by:
Dave McKay
()
Date: November 08, 2006 06:32AM
Reinhard is a staunch pacifist and did not lift a finger against them. He is also very skinny (as Zeusor would be quick to point out) and would have been incapable of defending himself against two much heavier men. He was knocked out with what must have been the a single punch, although he can remember staggering toward the front gate. (The attack took place in the front yard of Joe's parents' house, when Reinhard, Jeremy, and Joe turned up to let his parents know about his decision to join the community.) Jeremy saw Joe's half-brother drive up in a truck and jump out just before Joe's father laid into Reinhard and he shouted to Reinhard to run before jumping the fence himself and running. He was chased by John (the half brother) for a short distance, but John returned to where Reinhard was lying on the ground and started kicking him, first in the face and then in the back. The hospital report says that Reinhard had several cuts to the face that needed to be stitched, two broken teeth, bleeding on the brain, a factured spine, and lots of bruising.
Australian cult: Anyone recognize this?
Posted by:
zeuszor
()
Date: November 08, 2006 06:35AM
Here's a good article that helps in explaining exactly how the leader of a group that is much like the JCs twists the Scriptures (especially Luke 14:33, with the Roberts group it 's Luke 14:26) in order to fool potential recruits into giving up their lives for the leader of the group:
[www.culteducation.com]
[www.culteducation.com]
Australian cult: Anyone recognize this?
Posted by:
Gladitzover
()
Date: November 08, 2006 07:10AM
QuoteQuote
matildaQuote
cultmalleus
Yes, I agree that this is the allegation. From what I know and understand of Dave McKay, he is more than a little inclined to sensationalise and exaggerate. I would like to see and hear the evidence from both sides. I read somewhere that Reinhard had his eyes open and could see but that he was unconcious? Is that possible. [/color]
Yes, I also believe that violence is wrong. However, I would like to know what actually happened on that night. I did not see nor did not read any interviews or acounts given by the family. Can you tell me what exactly the circumstances were? [/color]
It is hard to know what to believe. Anyone who has been closely involved with DM knows that he will lie, exaggerate and sensationalise for his own purposes.
Regardless, Joe's family reacted badly and the violence should not be condoned.
I'm pretty sure that DM said that the "trial" was being done because the authorities had not pursued Joe's family. At the end of the video it said that Joe's father and brother were being prosecuted for beating up Reinhard. So...this was obviously just a ploy to drive a larger wedge between Joe and his family and get some publicity at the same time.
Australian cult: Anyone recognize this?
Posted by:
zeuszor
()
Date: November 08, 2006 07:13AM
Quote
apostate
What got me was Dave's response to the reporter when she said he was humiliating the family. He got a little bug eyed, as though annoyed that someone would dare say something contrary to him, talking down to her, "Look they humiliated themselves, alright". Right there you could see that angry glint in his eyes. He is still the same guy. Angry before, and angry now.
This man is as dangerous as a serial rapist or murderer. He must be stopped, by any legal means necessary.
Australian cult: Anyone recognize this?
Posted by:
matilda
()
Date: November 08, 2006 07:22AM
Quote
GladitzoverQuoteQuote
matildaQuote
cultmalleus
Yes, I agree that this is the allegation. From what I know and understand of Dave McKay, he is more than a little inclined to sensationalise and exaggerate. I would like to see and hear the evidence from both sides. I read somewhere that Reinhard had his eyes open and could see but that he was unconcious? Is that possible. [/color]
Yes, I also believe that violence is wrong. However, I would like to know what actually happened on that night. I did not see nor did not read any interviews or acounts given by the family. Can you tell me what exactly the circumstances were? [/color]
It is hard to know what to believe. Anyone who has been closely involved with DM knows that he will lie, exaggerate and sensationalise for his own purposes.
Regardless, Joe's family reacted badly and the violence should not be condoned.
I'm pretty sure that DM said that the "trial" was being done because the authorities had not pursued Joe's family. At the end of the video it said that Joe's father and brother were being prosecuted for beating up Reinhard. So...this was obviously just a ploy to drive a larger wedge between Joe and his family and get some publicity at the same time.
Precisely Gladitzover. I do not think that anyone would be condoning violence by informing the courts about this sgroup and how it operates. In law, mitigating factors can be taken into consideration.
Australian cult: Anyone recognize this?
Posted by:
Jack Oskar Larm
()
Date: November 08, 2006 07:35AM
Quote
zeuszor
Those pictures are not funny, Jack. This is a particularly volatile cult. What's next with this bunch? How you see it as funny is beyond me. If you saw somebody being raped would you think that that was funny too? ... This is funny to you?
Sorry if I offended you Zeuszor. I would not be laughing if the whip was in Dave's hands. The fact that this cult leader is being whipped is not funny, I agree, but sometimes I let off steam by laughing at the absurdity of it all.
It does raise a couple of questions: 1) What is Dave's motivation for being whipped? Did he wrong the community and needed to be punished?2) Is he developing a culture of violence - a kind of Cult of the Whip - so that he can justify punishing others?
Anyway, thanks for your concern. I'll try and moderate my reactions in future.
Jack.
Australian cult: Anyone recognize this?
Posted by:
zeuszor
()
Date: November 08, 2006 07:56AM
Quote
Jack Oskar LarmQuote
zeuszor
Those pictures are not funny, Jack. This is a particularly volatile cult. What's next with this bunch? How you see it as funny is beyond me. If you saw somebody being raped would you think that that was funny too? ... This is funny to you?
Sorry if I offended you Zeuszor. I would not be laughing if the whip was in Dave's hands. The fact that this cult leader is being whipped is not funny, I agree, but sometimes I let off steam by laughing at the absurdity of it all.
It does raise a couple of questions: 1) What is Dave's motivation for being whipped? Did he wrong the community and needed to be punished?2) Is he developing a culture of violence - a kind of Cult of the Whip - so that he can justify punishing others?
Anyway, thanks for your concern. I'll try and moderate my reactions in future.
Jack.
Hey, if you don't have a sense of humor, you don't have anything. It just seemed like an insensitive thing to write. I mean, people all over the world are reading this. Have some respect for Joe's family. Dave tooking the whipping to prove the "love and forgiveness" he has toward Joe's family. My concern is that if you look at the activities of this group over time, and especially over the past ten-odd years, you'll find that they've become progressively more and more overtly violent and attention-seeking. Kidneys, whips, the Virgin Army deal (vascectomies)...I see a certain symbolism in the use of the whip...like Dave is literally "lashing out" by organizing and pulling off this odd masochistic exercise. You'll also see if you study Dave's writings much (as I have) a preoccupation with martyrdom and death. I saw the film of the trail and whippings like Dave was saying "f**k you" to an unreceptive world. So what's the next stunt gonna be, Dave?
Australian cult: Anyone recognize this?
Posted by:
apostate
()
Date: November 08, 2006 01:32PM
How stupid of David McKay to say there is no peer pressure for his group members to donate kidneys when they all have to wear T shirts telling people to donate kidneys. The sheer act of doing that would cause a cognitive dissonance that would need to be reckoned with if the wearer had not already donated their kidney.
Australian cult: Anyone recognize this?
Posted by:
Gladitzover
()
Date: November 09, 2006 03:29AM
Quote
apostate
How stupid of David McKay to say there is no peer pressure for his group members to donate kidneys when they all have to wear T shirts telling people to donate kidneys. The sheer act of doing that would cause a cognitive dissonance that would need to be reckoned with if the wearer had not already donated their kidney.
I am a bit confused. There seems to be a bit of a contradiction concerning the group at the moment. They talk about deciding everything democraticly but then Fran mentioned earlier in this thread that all the bases operate autonomously.
If each base is autonomous now and DM is part of the Australian base. I wonder who it was in the US base that thought up the trial and floggings. Hhmmm.
Does anyone in the group (besides DM) come up with these kind of ideas? Does anyone disagree when these ideas are posed to the group?
It seems like in a group of 30 people -who are all free to think for themselves- there would be SOMEONE who thought it was a bad idea.
Maybe we could hear from that JC. Maybe they could write and tell us about the process, i.e. what happened when they told the group that they disagreed with the idea. I would find that very interesting.
Of course it possible that no one disagreed. Maybe they all thought it was a brilliant idea and they had to draw straws to decide who would be lucky enough to get whipped.
Australian cult: Anyone recognize this?
Posted by:
rrmoderator
()
Date: November 09, 2006 03:59AM
Dave:
You should be ashamed of what you did to Joseph and his family.
He had a bright promising future and scholarship opportunities. You imposed upon him and have negatively affected his future.
Fox News exposed you for what you are.
Perhaps you should have thought of that before attempting this latest publicity stunt to garner attention for yourself.
Hopefully, anyone donating money to you and your group will see this news report and stop enabling you.
It is wrong to recruit minor children without parental approval as you have done repeatedly.
You had no right to intrude upon the Johnson family and work with Joseph the way you did. It was wrong.
You should be ashamed of what you did to Joseph and his family.
He had a bright promising future and scholarship opportunities. You imposed upon him and have negatively affected his future.
Fox News exposed you for what you are.
Perhaps you should have thought of that before attempting this latest publicity stunt to garner attention for yourself.
Hopefully, anyone donating money to you and your group will see this news report and stop enabling you.
It is wrong to recruit minor children without parental approval as you have done repeatedly.
You had no right to intrude upon the Johnson family and work with Joseph the way you did. It was wrong.
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