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DayDreamer
Funny... I've heard some major complaints about Stan Dale and about Chip, specifically. Since they are so high up in the organization, it would seem rather unlikely that they would "clean things up." And given Stan Dale's health, it's even less likely.
Complaints? Hmmm, I thought that there were no complaints, at least that is what I read from some of HAI people. BTW, the facilators who told HAI was the person's family was Chip.
I personally don't think that they think there is anything to clean up. Isn't the first step to recovery admiting that you have a problem?
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DayDreamer
I did notice at both Levels I attended that there were repeaters. I can definitely see why someone may need a refresher on certain points, or would feel that they didn't work through certain things and felt the need to repeat the workshop. However, they have a huge advantage over the new participants - they already KNOW what is going to happen in the workshop as far as expectations, exercises, etc. That seems unfair in some ways. I participated in my workshops with another participant who'd been through all 7 levels repeatedly. He was also the perpetrator of some of the worst betrayal I have ever experienced. Needless to say, I was seriously hurt by it but also furious. Just because someone is still a "work in progress" doesn't mean they don't know common decency. He made a conscious choice to behave in a completely reprehensible manner. I believe he's one of the people involved in HAI who prey on others deliberately. Not exactly a stellar recommendation.
I don't see a problem with wanting a refresher or to work on certain aspects, but I get the impression from some of the people that is not what they are there for. You can see if it you pay attention. They scurry from where they are to the area around the person that they want to do the exercise with. It is especially revealing after you find out what the exercise is, which seems to have a major factor on the scurry speed.
I agree that it is unfair and I would say not honest. If they had all those who had already taken the workshop to raise their hands so that the new people can know that, I would not have a problem with it.
From what I have seen, it seems that the people who are really into HAI are the ones to watch out for. The new people seem to be honest and open, without an agenda. Many of those in power use that position to get what they want, protect their position and abuse their position to attack others. I am not sure of how everyone wins that way, but I am not sure that is really the point, it seems to be more of getting what you want.
The real problem is that it seems that HAI does not want to do anything about those who do what you say. You can't stop everyone, but you can kick them out, unless you prefer their money.
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DayDreamer
I have been told by various interns that the confidentiality is required for several reasons - one of which is because they think if people know what to expect, they are less likely to come and participate. In a way I think that's true, but it also sends another message to me. If sex (intercourse or any other) is occuring in a workshop, I WANT TO KNOW so that I can make the choice to not go. I should be able to make that choice with all the information. I don't feel that being expected to participate in sex with a stranger, or being expected to be present while others do so, is appropriate in any way.
I know what you are saying, but I have to wonder how many would attend if they knew what was going to occur. I don't think that I would have. I got a fair bit out of it, but I am also strong enough to do only what I wanted to and to resist the pressure. Not everyone is and that is a problem.
If you don't like what is going on, you could always leave the room. That does present a problem as you get singled out. I think the more important aspect is in what HAI presents as being acceptable behaviour in "public" (around others).
There is another aspect to keeping things secret and that is that there would be people who would attend just because they know what is going to go on (like some of the repeat people). This could attract more of the wrong type of people.
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DayDreamer
I'm someone who firmly believes that my level of appropriate intimacy with people is different depending on the individual. What I'm willing to do and share with Diashto is definitely much more intimate and in-depth than it would be with a casual acquaintance, if you know what I mean.
Yes, I know what you mean and I completly agree.
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DayDreamer
I'm also very monogamous, and have no interest in poly relationships of any kind, or any of the sexual escapades that many HAI people seem to think are so wonderful. In fact, I highly resent being told that my choice of monogamy is silly, unnatural, stupid or limiting - and people have actually said as much. I deserve to be someone's one-and-only, not merely one-of. However, I've actually been told that I'm cheating myself by not being willing to explore other people. Heh.. I find it interesting that those who have said such things are involved in poly relationships themselves and have an interest in getting me in bed.
Ahhh, that is where a problem occurs. If HAI were to really believe in choice, there would not be any such comments or pressure. I agree that there seems to be pressure in this direction, as well as trying to push what they think is acceptable, which I do not agree with. Anyone who says that to you is going against what HAI is supposed to be.
I would change what you said to be you deserve what you want, since that is more generic. Those people who want other things should be able to have them. To those of us who do not agree should not be said that we are wrong.
I think the last sentence says it all. The person saying that is not interested in what you want and only interested in what they want, very selfish and showing a complete lack of respect towards you and others.
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DayDreamer
And people wonder why I think that people in HAI are being groomed for group sexual activity.
Yeah, I can see that. I did not think about that aspect, but I have say that I agree. It would be nice if more people could disconnect a nude body from sex, but if the hidden agenda is sex, then it is quite wrong and not honest.
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DayDreamer
I agree with you, Ghost. Sex definitely IS more than just intercourse. Thank goodness :) But I don't want to be doing ANYTHING sexual with anyone other than Diashto, and I expect the same sort of fidelity from him. I don't see what is so wrong with that, but apparently others find it unnatural.
:)
There is nothing wrong what that, especially for you since that is what you want. On the other hand, you should be willing to accept others not wanting that (which I think you do). There are many things which I don't care to do and I don't think are right, but I don't think that I have the right to tell others what to do. Everyone should show respect and honor the choices of others. Unfortunately this seems to be lacking in HAI. It should be easy for a person to do all the workshop with clothes on, but it is not. What does that say about honoring the choice and being at choice?
It would be great to create an organization which actually does what HAI claims. I think that people could get a lot out of it.