Current Page: 6 of 154
James Arthur Ray -Inside accounts of James Ray sweat lodge tragedy
Posted by: The Anticult ()
Date: October 17, 2009 04:35AM

_______________QUOTE EXCERPTS from article__________________
[www.examiner.com]
Breaking news: Inside accounts of James Ray sweat lodge tragedy and retreat
October 16, Cassandra Yorgey

- "People are flailing in seizures; others are vomiting violently, or foaming at the mouth. Bodies are lined up unconscious, some are blue from lack of oxygen, but for some it is too late, they are already dead. Survivors that are barely able to stand struggle to help the others, they have had almost no food or water for nearly three days, even longer without sleep. It looks like a war zone, but for the incongruent figure of James Arthur Ray (a contributing author to The Secret) who exits the sweat lodge and stands tall with a big smile, the only one able to stand on his own volition. He is not concerned with the medical emergency going on full swing around him. He is not worried about the health and well-being of his followers who have paid $10,000.00 (tack on an additional 5,000.00 or so if you include flights, room and board, and camping supplies) to attend his retreat. In fact, he and his team urge people to stop taking care of others and focus on their own journey, assuring them they are fine and only “purging”. Someone finally realizes James Ray is not in control of the situation and calls 911."

- James Ray urged participants to forego sleep, insisting that working on their assignments all night would be more beneficial.

- immediately upon starting the retreat participants shaved their heads – before the sleep deprivation. Yes, even the women.

- Day Two the sleep deprivation has begun - but that by itself is not enough of a warning to foresee this tragedy. The real warning signs begin with the James Ray Games. One of the brave and recovering victims described a game they all had to play in which James Ray played God. Yep, you read that right; James Ray cast himself in the role of God and would then command participants to die. He would point at someone and they would have to fall down and play dead. They would be covered with a blanket and if they moved another person would "die".
- Kirby Brown exemplified the dangerous psychological twisting behind these games. After the game she was seen standing in line for the outhouse, clutching herself and crying. After another participant ushered her to the front of the line they asked her “Why didn’t you just get up and go?” She looked up sincerely and said she didn’t want to ruin the game for others.

- At the end of the second day the James Ray Vision Quest began. ... – So when I heard James Ray dropped everyone off in the desert with no food, no water, and nothing but a sleeping bag, the clothes on their back, and a notebook I start to sputter obscenities. No water, in the desert, for 36+ hours is dangerous.

- They were stranded alone, in the dark, in an unknown location in the Arizona desert.

- Sleep was still hard to come by because most participants were not prepared for the devastating cold that comes over the desert at night. ...Still, sleep was hard to come by in those temperatures, being fitful at best and it hardly alleviated the impaired thinking that has become prevalent.

- When James Ray’s team finally returned to pick them up from their isolation (surprisingly enough, James Ray was not fasting on a vision quest during this period, nor were his staff – ...the measly hour or so they had to eat and rehydrate themselves flew by. Food was hardly touched, most people opting to drink water first which quickly filled their newly shrunken stomachs

- We’ve painted a picture of the participants mental state leading up to the sweat lodge, and we know what happened when James Ray turned the relaxing Native American equivalent of a sauna into an endurance competition. He not only encouraged participants to stay and push past physical discomfort, he also actively dissuaded people that wanted to leave. The phrase “push through your threshold” was repeated often by James Ray. If participants didn’t make it to the door fast enough they had to wait for the next round. James Ray would slam the tarp shut shouting “Too late! Door’s shut!” and as he was sitting directly next to the door he was escalating it into a physical confrontation (not to mention he was the only one getting reprieve from the heat. Others could not feel a thing when the door was opened)

- He speaks of how throwing up is good and actually purging (it isn’t. it’s actually a sign of dehydration and many other bad things), and explains that passing out is common (it isn’t). He encourages people who find it too hot to bury their faces in the dirt, because it was cooler.

- These honorable participants tried time and time again to re-organize and keep everyone safe, but at every stage they were thwarted by James Ray and his staff. Participants who expressed concern over others were told time and time again to focus on their own journey, and not to interfere with another’s. Once outside the enclosure some people were physically restrained from helping the rescue effort by staff members. One unconscious victim was dropped on their head while staff carried them out of the sweat lodge.

- After paramedics responded, James Ray was escorted away by police; however he chose his right to silence. Police are reported to have released James Ray that evening, at which point he immediately left the state (this is based on other reports in the media).
[www.examiner.com]
________QUOTE EXCERPTS from article________________

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: James Arthur Ray -Inside accounts of James Ray sweat lodge tragedy
Posted by: The Anticult ()
Date: October 17, 2009 04:43AM

Note that according to the reports in the article, the LGAT seminar Guru and their staff were NOT fasting.
That was predicted earlier in this thread, as the Guru and mass persuasion leader does not "fast" as the fasting is designed to break down people's resistance to indoctrination.

And the Guru sits close to the door, to make sure he gets plenty of oxygen.


One question that has not been asked, is if anyone was given any "herbal vision quest" hallucinogen's like "peyote" with the food or water? One would have to wait for the medical reports for that.

Options: ReplyQuote
James Arthur Ray - Colleen Marian Conaway, http://twitter.com/AFGrant
Posted by: The Anticult ()
Date: October 17, 2009 02:31PM

This is a very sad and hearbreaking update.
Has this been looked into properly?

A certain "AFGrant" made a twitter the day Colleen Conaway died. (see below)
__________QUOTE______________
AFGrant twitter
[twitter.com]
Today with James Ray: wallets, phone, id taken and we put on old clothes to wander San Diego as homeless. I witnessed a suicide attempt :(
8:22 PM Jul 25th from web
__________QUOTE____________________

Notice that at the James Ray Creating Absolute Wealth seminar, as predicted in this thread, their WALLETS, PHONE and ID were TAKEN, and the seminar attendees put on old clothes to wander San Diego as homeless.

So Colleen Conaway, as predicted, appears to have not had ID on her as their wallet, phone and ID were taken from them at the James Ray CAW seminar.

Did anyone inform the police who had died, and turned over her ID to them?
What happened on the scene?

There are more comments appearing on the internet from Colleen's friends and family, can anyone let people know if all of this was investigated at the time?
Is there any more evidence on Twitter, or on the internet about this?

So did Colleen Conaway die while actually attending and doing a "homeless" exercise at the James Ray CAW seminar in San Diego?
If so, why was this not reported as such?
And why was it not reported that another attendee at the same seminar appears to be the main witness to her death?




___________QUOTE________________
AFGrant Twitter: [twitter.com]

[twitter.com]
Today with James Ray: wallets, phone, id taken and we put on old clothes to wander San Diego as homeless. I witnessed a suicide attempt :(
8:22 PM Jul 25th from web


13-hour-long day one of Creating Absolute Wealth has ended. Now have hours of homework or rather, "growth opportunities" before any sleep.
9:57 PM Jul 24th from web

Fly to San Diego in morning for James Ray's "Creating Absolute Wealth". 3 day event and I have no idea what is going to happen. I love that.
8:28 PM Jul 22nd from web

_________QUOTE________________






Quote

Below is a quote from someone with a blog called "The World of AF Grant" [www.afgrant.com] who took the Creating Absolute Wealth with James Ray seminar In San Diego in July 2009. He is promoting the seminar.

He goes onto describe a "suicide" he saw at a mall, without naming the mall.
Did he not realize at any point, that was Colleen Conaway, a fellow participant at the James Ray CAW seminar?
It also seems odd how he says,

"I was the only witness who had the vantage point to know it was intentional".

So he was physically very close to her, but did not recognize her from the seminar?

That blog entry was written over a week after the seminar.
Didn't anyone tell him that one of the seminar attendees died, and it was Colleen Conaway, a fellow seminar attendee, the same death he witnessed?

And since the blog was posted, has anyone asked him if he knew it was a fellow seminar attendee? Are there any comments about Colleen Conaway on the blog?

Another strange coincidence mentioned, is how just after the death, he ran into another fellow James Ray CAW seminar attendee named "Lori" in the same mall?

Was going to the Horton Mall part of a group event field trip outing of the James Ray Creating Absolute Wealth seminar?



__________QUOTE____________________
[www.afgrant.com]
Tuesday, August 04, 2009
Creating Absolute Wealth with James Ray

"One detail I can share is something I witnessed which certainly proved to be the lowlight/highlight. I was wandering around San Diego alone, wondering what I was going get from the weekend; what did I need to learn most? I spotted a woman standing outside the railing of a balcony on the third level at a mall. I thought it was some sort of stunt because ComicCon was going on. She jumped. It wasn't a stunt. I was the only witness who had the vantage point to know it was intentional.

I gave statements to the police and mall security. If you know anything about me, you know suicide is about the biggest button I have to push. Later, I found myself standing where she jumped from, it had only been about a half-hour but the blood stained concrete was cleaned up and the t-shirt kiosk the woman landed on was once again selling "I Love San Diego" shirts to tourists. It was so surreal to see how quickly life moves on.
I couldn't understand why she would do it. Why anyone would do. And I cried. Tears of joy - joy for being alive. That was HUGE for me. And while standing there, I noticed Lori walk into the scene below - first time I've seen her all day...."
____________________________



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 10/17/2009 02:37PM by The Anticult.

Options: ReplyQuote
James Arthur Ray - Colleen Marian Conaway, secrets and lies
Posted by: The Anticult ()
Date: October 18, 2009 03:28AM

Another thing that has become abundantly clear with James Arthur Ray, is the incredible influence and power he has over those who have attended many of his seminars.
His "advanced students", as the lingo goes.

Like most other LGAT seminars, the seminar guru makes his followers SWEAR TO SECRECY the things that go on behind closed doors in the seminar. They tell their followers this is for others, but in fact its about keeping the techniques of what goes on SECRET, so they are more powerful on newbies.

Once a person studies up on these advanced LGAT seminars, the techniques don't work as well, as you can see what he is trying to do to you. So this is why everyone from Landmark to Byron Katie to James Arthur Ray try to make their followers keep everything secret. They even sign them to gag-orders, but also use every technique of coercive and permissive influence in the book on them.
(most people don't seem to know yet that "Voluntary permissive influence" is far more powerful than coercive influence).
The LGAT seminar leaders are many years ahead of most of their critics.

But it goes much deeper than that in this case.
Its very clear that James Ray has a group of core people around him, who will carry out his wishes.
There also are those who appear more than willing to spin-doctor, distort, and lie on his behalf. Of course, that gets more approval from the Master.

That being said, there also has to be a number of those involved who have doubts, or who have left the James Ray situation. Hopefully their conscience will prompt them to speak out about things they have seen.

For example, what really happened with Colleen Conaway at the Horton Plaza in San Diego on July 25 2009?
How many people from the James Ray seminar were at the mall at the time?
Was everyone from the seminar there?

There are already a couple of online statements found so far, that show a number of people from the James Ray CAW seminar were at the mall at the time. One comment is framed as to sound like it was a "coincidence" they bumped into other participants. Ain't buying that one.

At minimum, these LGAT's send groups out with a "buddy", never alone.
On top of that, they ALWAYS have the LGAT seminar "minders" breathing down people's necks. So someone is not telling the entire truth.

Another simply spoke of how the police were called to an event. There might be more postings elsewhere, if so, please link to them.
__QUOTE_______
[www.cbsnews.com]
"I was emotional damaged myself at the event in San Diego. It took me a couple of months just to gather myself together again to be able to function. [...]It was the 2 "outtings" that threw me for a loop. We were dropped off in a city and told to "act" homeless. It was traumatic for me and then we were dropped off at one of the richest neighborhood in the US for a scavenger hunt. It was during these 2 events that I had emotional trauma. There was also an incident where the police were called."
______UNQUOTE_________________


And looking at the information posted online, there appears to be a 2 day delay before they were able to identify Colleen Conaway.
[www.examiner.com]
[www.examiner.com]
(notice the comments from months ago pointing the blame at the James Ray seminar)

Can it really be that she died at the Horton Plaza mall without her ID on her, and no one from the James Ray seminar spoke up and identified her?

Anyone who was there that day, and knows what happened, was everything reported?
If not, now is the time to do so.



[www.examiner.com]
* YCSO Detectives continue to actively seek out participants of past events conducted by James Ray who may have had, or be aware of, similar experiences like the circumstances from the October 8th event at the Angel Valley resort. Those persons with such knowledge are urged to contact the Yavapai County Sheriff’s Office via email by accessing www.ycsoaz.gov, or calling Yavapai Silent Witness at 1-800-932-3232.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: James Arthur Ray - Colleen Marian Conaway,
Posted by: The Anticult ()
Date: October 18, 2009 05:54AM

Recent comment here...

Breaking news: Inside accounts of James Ray sweat lodge tragedy and retreat [www.examiner.com]
____excerpt QUOTE__________
Disturbed says:
I was at CAW July 24-26 and was never made aware that any of the participants were missing much less dead despite the fact a "buddy" system was in place. I found out due to this recent tragedy that there was in fact a tragedy at my event too. ...
October 17, 3:53 PM
_______quote________________

So who was Colleen Conaway's "buddy", in the buddy system?

How many people from the James Arthur Ray CAW were at the Horton's Plaza mall?
Where were the seminar "coaches" and volunteers and "staff" they use?

Options: ReplyQuote
James Arthur Ray - 3rd person dies in Ariz. sweat lodge
Posted by: The Anticult ()
Date: October 18, 2009 01:26PM

[www.google.com]

3rd person dies in Ariz. sweat lodge ceremony case
(AP) –

FLAGSTAFF, Ariz. — A Minnesota woman who was hospitalized with damage to multiple organs after she was overcome in an Arizona sweat lodge ceremony died Saturday, sheriff's officials said.

The death of 49-year-old Liz Neuman brings the total number of deaths from the Oct. 8 incident at a resort near Sedona to three, Yavapai County sheriff's spokesman Dwight D'Evelyn said.

Authorities are treating the deaths as homicides, but no charges have been filed.

Neuman was among more than 50 people crowded inside the sweat lodge run by self-help guru James Arthur Ray. An emergency call two hours after they entered the lodge reported two people not breathing.

Twenty-one people were taken to area hospitals with illnesses ranging from dehydration to kidney failure. Kirby Brown, 38, of Westtown N.Y. and James Shore, 40, of Milwaukee died upon arrival at a hospital.

The cause of their deaths hasn't been determined. The results of their autopsies are pending further testing.
________________________

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: James Arthur Ray - Colleen Marian Conaway,
Posted by: The Anticult ()
Date: October 18, 2009 04:04PM

An alleged "Former employee" of James Ray International (25 people?) has made a couple of comments below.
They make some interesting, yet complicated comments.
[cosmicconnie.blogspot.com]
QUOTE about Colleen Conaway:
"I know someone from the James Ray team who was at that event (she is no longer employed for James Ray and for obvious reasons) and she feels that sometimes, the participants have an emotional experience and that none of the James Ray team is equipped to handle the situation. She is certain that this woman was having such an experience and was all alone at the time."

Actually, knowing how these types of advanced LGAT seminar events operate, one can be very certain Colleen was NOT alone. They have a "buddy system" as mentioned, and all of these LGAT seminars are just crawling with "coaches" and volunteers and "staff" who can be in everyone's faces 18 hrs a day. That is a fact.
So frankly, it is not logical or believable in the least that Colleen was alone, unless they saw her emotionally spinning out of control and abandoned her. (Most LGAT's carefully watch if people start flipping into a mental-breakdown or psychosis from the extreme seminar-stressors, and simply ask them to leave and/or kick them out of the seminar. They don't even take them to the Emerg, as they fear the liabilities. They just sign them out, or kick them out.)
That is also a well-known fact. They don't want to be held responsible.

Isn't it more believable that whoever was there at the Horton Plaza and knew what happened, just got the hell out of there quick?
And the witnesses that did talk to the police, who apparently somehow saw the suicide was "intentional", who knows if the police were told about the James Ray CAW seminar connection? That is obviously up to the authorities in such a serious matter.

But even at the so-called "sweat lodge", James Ray (and perhaps others?) did not to talk to the police, and apparently still haven't? And don't forget, the police also said James Ray was not the only person of interest. Every LGAT guru is surrounded by a "team" who know EVERYTHING that goes on. Another fact of reality.
It is not logical or believable in the LEAST that Colleen Conaway was completely alone for so long that no one knew anything about anything.

Another interesting comment made is that none of the employees of the James Ray company were told or knew about the death of Colleen Conaway?
But what about the rumor mill that goes on at all of these companies?
Right below the news reports, there were SEVERAL direct comments from family/friends of Colleen Conaway who were asking questions and even pointing the finger at the James Ray seminars. Its all there in black and white in the comments.
[www.examiner.com]

Recently some complete strangers who knew NOTHING about any of this previously, in a few hours, were able to figure out Colleen Conaway died in San Diego at the same time as the seminar from information available on the public internet!
So no one is going to be foolish or naive enough to believe that months later, people from that San Diego seminar or the company knew nothing about Colleen Conaway's death.
Seems that no one knows nothing about anything.

But of course, such serious issues are up to the authorities.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/18/2009 04:10PM by The Anticult.

Options: ReplyQuote
James Ray Games- Colleen Marian Conaway,
Posted by: The Anticult ()
Date: October 18, 2009 04:44PM

Another thing to take into consideration, are the reports in the article below that the James Ray "staff" were actually interfering in the rescue efforts.

Was there interference in what happened at the Horton Plaza?

What about the alleged "James Ray Games", quoted below?
Was some type of "death game" being played for some bizarre purpose?

____________________________________
[www.examiner.com]

QUOTE:
"These honorable participants tried time and time again to re-organize and keep everyone safe, but at every stage they were thwarted by James Ray and his staff. Participants who expressed concern over others were told time and time again to focus on their own journey, and not to interfere with another’s. Once outside the enclosure some people were physically restrained from helping the rescue effort by staff members."

QUOTE:
"The real warning signs begin with the James Ray Games. One of the brave and recovering victims described a game they all had to play in which James Ray played God. Yep, you read that right; James Ray cast himself in the role of God and would then command participants to die. He would point at someone and they would have to fall down and play dead. They would be covered with a blanket and if they moved another person would "die".

Options: ReplyQuote
James Arthur Ray - Liz Neuman, Luis Velasquez
Posted by: The Anticult ()
Date: October 19, 2009 01:10AM

The 3rd death from the James Ray sweat lodge is reported being Liz Neuman.

This appears to be a Huffington Post page for Liz Neuman. [www.huffingtonpost.com]

A comment she made to James Ray for his very revealing article that needs to be analyzed, where Ray tries to indirectly frame himself as an expert in genius and a genius himself...and clearly to try to rationalize his own behavior...

"What often appears to be dysfunctional to the mass majority may just be the hyper-functional behaviors of a true genius".
No One Who Was Normal Ever Made History: A Tribute to Michael Jackson by James Arthur Ray [www.huffingtonpost.com]
___________________________
[www.huffingtonpost.com]
QUOTE:
"Thank you James. That was beautifully said. And thank you for being miles ahead of the crowd, and I won't hold it against you that you are unable to master the moonwalk. Your genius truly runs deep and wide, and you impact the world in your unique and wonderful way. See you soon! :D
posted Jun 29, 2009 at 23:38:49
_________________________

She was listed as a "fan" of Luis Velasquez and Kathleen Schmidt, who are both big James Ray promoters.
Luis Velasquez appears to be the same person who posted a James Ray quote on Oct 13, 2009, which was after the tragedy in Sedona.

Luis Velasquez twitter: [twitter.com]
Remember: "Every individual who has ever succeeded has built an unbending belief, first and foremost, in themselves!" - James Arthur Ray
7:37 AM Oct 13th from web

Kathleen Schmidt [twitter.com]
[www.kathleenmschmidt.com]


James Arthur Ray is no "genius" of course. What he is, among other things, is an expert in manipulative persuasion techniques which he ruthlessly exploits on those without training or experience in those areas.
And the quote of James Ray posted by Luis Velasquez after the tragedy, shows the danger of these ideologies. An "unbending belief, first and foremost, in themselves" is actually very destructive as a form of absolutism and narcissism.
What ever happened to healthy self-doubt based on feedback from objective reality?

Its sad that some of those who have paid the ultimate price, were those who were the most idealistic, far too trusting, and idealized a man who is a professional manipulator.
The precise methods and techniques being used by people like James Ray need to be explained widely and with great specificity.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 10/19/2009 01:15AM by The Anticult.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: James Arthur Ray - Liz Neuman, Luis Velasquez
Posted by: The Anticult ()
Date: October 19, 2009 01:35AM

[www.google.com]
The AP says, about Liz Neuman

"The Rev. Meredith Ann Murray of Bellingham, Wash., who has completed all of Ray's retreats, said Neuman was among Ray's earliest followers and had attended dozens of his events."

This is what happens time and time again. Certain people can be quite suggestible to these powerful techniques, and they get lured into the Guru's LGAT seminar system, and literally go to dozens of "events", which are LGAT seminars. They effectively become "brainwashed" and end up giving every dollar they have and can borrow to the LGAT seminar guru. They also end up working for him/her for free for years on end.

In the most intense cases, the person gets to the point where they will literally do almost anything the Leader asks them to.
Its very powerful and deep indoctrination of people who are vulnerable to the specific techniques being used by LGAT gurus like James Ray. They are able to deliberately engineer that level of "worship" into their followers, and its done systematically, using very well known techniques to those who have been trained in this area of group persuasion.

The scary thing is the techniques are becoming so powerful, and easy to access, that a clever, charismatic and ruthless sociopath, can set up an LGAT seminar system to turn himself into a demigod in just a few years.

Options: ReplyQuote
Current Page: 6 of 154


Sorry, only registered users may post in this forum.
This forum powered by Phorum.