For those that may not already know, the Web site "Relgious Freedom Watch" linked above, is run by the Church of Scientology.

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Radha Krishna das
I do not know what other groups do. They do not have a bonafide spiritual master such as Siddhaswarupananda Paramahamsa so I have no interest in their practices.

So you are saying that this was a directive from butler?

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You do not agree that one is better off to have a brain that is filled with God than thoughts of sex, empty material desires, delusions of movies, rock music, gossip, violence etc. It is the nature of this material world that one becomes contaminated. The process of Krishna Consciousness is about purifying. There is no other way than so called 'brain washing'.

Ah but do people freely submit to this brain-washing? You stated that people do not want to hear about God so obviously you feel you need to trick these people into doing so. By using false advertisements and hiding the true nature of your cult you are deceiving people into doing what you think they should be doing. Where is it written that a bona-fide guru should deceive people in this way?

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One should surrender based on the three conditions dictated by the Scripture - the qualities of the Spiritual Master, the Lord in the Heart and the Scripture. By this way there is no mistake that can be made. A spiritual master supoorts what the Scripture says and Krishna in the heart makes the individual steady in their devotion.

So you've changed your story here. It is necessary to question someone claiming to be a bona-fide spiritual master. Where is the line drawn between speculative reasoning and not making a mistake? Many people on this thread have done this already and have come to the conclusion that Chris Butler is not what he claims to be. They have been discussing the various aspects that they find unrelated to scripture or past spiritual masters (don't forget this method) or qualities that seem unbecoming of a pure devotee of Krishna and are here to make public those things you keep hidden and from new devotees. So until you are willing to explain or challenge all the accusations on this thread you yourself will remain a fraud. Attacking Cara's or my character will not help you as neither of us have even been to Hawaii. We do not run a cult nor do we have any control over what other's think or contribute to this forum. A

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Radha Krishna das
Does your audience and your "devotee" friends know that you are a mystic?

Yes what is a mystic Ray? Where does it say that a mystic cannot be a devotee nor that it is anymore offensive than being for example a dress maker?

If Cara was a mystic then i'd think that was kind of cool. Although your claim of this is rather unsubstantiated. A

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emntk

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Radha Krishna das
Does your audience and your "devotee" friends know that you are a mystic?

Yes what is a mystic Ray? Where does it say that a mystic cannot be a devotee nor that it is anymore offensive than being for example a dress maker?

If Cara was a mystic then i'd think that was kind of cool. Although your claim of this is rather unsubstantiated. A

[b:490538cf07]Damn! Those SALEM WITCHES pop up everywhere! Burn em! Drown em! Kill em! Uppity women deserve to die, eh Rasha Kishka das?[/b:490538cf07]

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Radha Krishna das
Maybe it should from your point of view, but this has already been explained to you, and in truth my directives come from Srila Prabhupad who is a direct link to God. Your 'beloved' can leave at any time that he wants. No person is restraining him. It was made clear to him when he made his intentions with you known that he can make this choice, but he will not be able to see his son for the sake of him being raised in Krishna Consciousness and setting a proper example. It was made clear to him that it is a sin to be divorced and to leave one's responsibilities. To end his idea of a relationship with you was the best thing for his spiritual life according to Srila Prabhupad - and he is a student of Srila Prabhupad.

No my brother is not being restrained. He is to follow Butler's will or his relationship with his son is in jeopardy. I think this is called blackmail.

[qoute]
Yes but you don't see Krishna DO you? You see Nrsimha. That is not the same thing at all, and you know this.[/quote]

So a person who sees one form of the supreme being somehow MUST be given a different contradictory dialect than another form? These different forms of the same supreme being are not in contact with one another? This also supersedes ones ability to receive contact with another form of the Supreme Person?

Pralad is a pure devotee and he sees Nrsimha everywhere as stated by Butler and scripture. Further Butler states that if a person is attracted to a particular form of the supreme person and prays to that form it is fine. This does not jeopardise their relationship with SOI and is a personal thing that should not be discussed with materialists. In the spiritual world there are different planets for worshipping the supreme being in different forms and methods. He does not state that a person can only pray to one form of the Supreme Bieng. So you are directly contradicting your own spiritual master here as well who apparently directed you to speak on this forum.

Yes I did pay attention and your explanation of this philosophy is completely nutty. A

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zelig
[b:e64909aeb2]Damn! Those SALEM WITCHES pop up everywhere! Burn em! Drown em! Kill em! Uppity women deserve to die, eh Rasha Kishka das?[/b:e64909aeb2]

Hey Zelig! good to see you're back. Hope you had a great trip.

We've been having some fun :lol: Women are just too docile to understand and are condemned to hell for trying :twisted: Ash

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Radha Krishna das
Where is this lecture? This is unsubstnatiated blasphemy. You cannot prove that this lecture exists can you? If you have a copy of such a lecture why don't you publish it on-line to PROVE that Srila Prabhupad is NOT a bonafide Spiritual Master - a pure devotee would never say such a thing!!

Here is the excerpt from the lecture.

[www.youtube.com]

So you have made a claim against your own spiritual master. I'll take that bet. What do I win?

This is just one of the examples of things that are irrelevant. The catalogue no. is provided in the video description so you can go and check for yourself that it has not been edited or taken out of context. A

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emntk

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Radha Krishna das
Where is this lecture? This is unsubstnatiated blasphemy. You cannot prove that this lecture exists can you? If you have a copy of such a lecture why don't you publish it on-line to PROVE that Srila Prabhupad is NOT a bonafide Spiritual Master - a pure devotee would never say such a thing!!

Here is the excerpt from the lecture.

[www.youtube.com]

So you have made a claim against your own spiritual master. I'll take that bet. What do I win?

This is just one of the examples of things that are irrelevant. The catalogue no. is provided in the video description so you can go and check for yourself that it has not been edited or taken out of context. A

[b:68945c927f]You broads deserve the Rick Ross Cult Buster Award of the Year[/size:68945c927f][/color:68945c927f] for this one!!!!
A Perry Mason ending! A Mike Wallace moment! A Borat revelation! Sweet![/b:68945c927f]

emntk (Ashleigh), No my brother is not being restrained. He is to follow Butler's will or his relationship with his son is in jeopardy. I think this is called blackmail.

Your brother can choose to read this forum or to make contact with you or whomever else that he wishes. The fact is that like many of Srila Prabhupad's followers he would most likely be dead from the despair of a life without Krishna have no semblance of life outside of his current situation. Instructing someone as to their rightful actions according to the teachings of a Bonafide Spiritual Teacher and reminding them of their responsibilities may be perceived from a mundane perspective as blackmail, but it is infact a loving and responsible action towards a God-brother. Emotion, familial attatchments, which are false constructs of this material world, and romance, which is the doing of Maya, has no place in how to live a life which is pleasing to God.

Clearly there is no reasoning with angry and destructive people. As it says in Bhagavad Gita when lust is impeded it leads to anger. Clearly you were searching for something which you did not find with Srila Prabhupad and gave your devotion to anger because your lust was dissatisfied.

I do not speak for Srila Prabhupad, only for myself as someone who tries to be a devotee. Clearly I am imperfect for stating in frustration at reading such offences that a pure devotee would not say such words, since a pure devotee has said them. The problems of this world are temporary while God is eternal is what that lecture is about.

Even if I am wrong in my beliefs, and I do not for a moment wonder that I am, I have given my life to a peaceful existence, doing no harm to others, not even to animals, free from the anxieties of sex life, drugs and gambling. If I do not attain to Krishna then I have lost nothing. You have given yourselves to unregulated lifestyles and anger directed towards those that seek to live such a life as I have described. Is this really what you want to give your life to? Who do you see as being the loser of the situation? You have a choice for it not to be you.

I respectfully request that cultreporter (Cara) and emntk (Ashleigh) resign from this forum and cease directing their anger and disappointment of spiritual life onto innocent people. You are only instigating anxiety, confusion and dissatisfaction for people that are mostly strangers to you. You are attempting to lead people yes through making them angry like you. You have made association with other disillusioned devotees rather than seeking out those who have the life you both once had the opportunity to live for yourselves. Association with devotees is essential for spiritual advancement and you have alienated yourselves from Srila Prabhupad's entire Australian community. Do not progress any further for your own benefits, I say this to all here, towards being unforgivable.

All sincere followers of Srila Prabhupad, I urge you through the strength of prayer to the Divine Lord to bring an end to such blasphemy. There is no competition between us and them on this level.