Unless you were there, you never really know what happened. And even when you are there, as I was, you only see it from your own perspective. There are all sorts of contradictory stories. Consider the sources. In my experience, pre-ACB's death, Siddha was trying to follow and live the simple life of a sanyassi. And to teach and set up centers, which was the duty of a sanyassi. He did this. He had also given up all of his "Sai" followers, who joined ISKcon temples. I don't know of many people who would have done that. He really loved ACB. We used to dry mangoes to send them to ACB in India because he liked the ones from Hawaii and they were medicinal. There was correspondence and a positive relationship between ACB and Siddha.

In my opinion, he was sincere in the beginning, but, like any revolutionary, power, followers, and money got to his head. (E.g., Ortega is now a free market capitalist!) I also witnessed the abuse and anger against Siddha from ISKcon. There are many sides to history depending on where you stand and from where you look. I know ISKcon produces all these "memiors" and "portfolios" of ACB, but they are also unreliable. You do not know how easy it was to change and forge documents --- and realize that a lot of criminals were in charge of vast portions of the ISKcon empire with real estate and steady cash flow. Easy corruption - pre-computer times.

Look at the history of communism. It started off as an idealistic philosophy to help feed people and distribute resources fairly. It's leaders became corrupt and iconic. It's systems destroyed freedom, cultures, and spirit. (Read Piers Vitebsky's "The Reindeer People" how the cult of communism wiped out the Siberian native culture irreparably).

The main argument that I have against Siddha and ALL gurus and cults is how they clip the wings of the followers and suck the air out of their lives. You are right when you describe JG as paper mache! When they lose their sincerity and innocence, they have to create a fake mask to keep followers. you are right, if they were real teachers, their followers would grow and become teachers in their own right and inspire others. And as every good teacher knows, you have to let your students surpass you and let them go. Guru's can not do this. Independence of their followers is poison to them. Holding on to them is poison to them both.

It is fine to love and respect a great teacher or guru that you have learned something; even honoring them is appropriate. But to elevate a man to the level of worship has always led to corruption. Just look at the history of Rome and the Ceasars. (Great video - "I Claudius" or Gibbon's book, "Reflections on the Fall of Rome")

The main crime perpetuated by cult leaders is how they promote self doubt, how they undermine your own sense of self efficacy, your own inner authority and worth. The concept that you can not know God or advance spiritually except through someone else is a core belief that ensnares every cult follower. It's fine to seek out teachers and authorities and learn from them, but it is a pathetic relationship that is fostered by cult leaders with their followers. It undermines all innovation, growth, creativity, freedom, and life. In the end, we are all just ordinary men and women. And we are all equally capable of extraordinary things if only we had the courage and self confidence. It is this very courage and self confidence that is targeted by every cult and cult leader. The only difference is how the paper mache mask is painted. Underneath each mask lies the same creature.

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The main crime perpetuated by cult leaders is how they promote self doubt, how they undermine your own sense of self efficacy, your own inner authority and worth. The concept that you can not know God or advance spiritually except through someone else is a core belief that ensnares every cult follower. It's fine to seek out teachers and authorities and learn from them, but it is a pathetic relationship that is fostered by cult leaders with their followers. It undermines all innovation, growth, creativity, freedom, and life. In the end, we are all just ordinary men and women. And we are all equally capable of extraordinary things if only we had the courage and self confidence. It is this very courage and self confidence that is targeted by every cult and cult leader. The only difference is how the paper mache mask is painted. Underneath each mask lies the same creature.

This is undoubtedly one of the best observations I have yet seen on the guru/pupil relationship. So well put.

Thank you.

I felt the same way. I put a cleaned-up version of it at the bottom of the website I authored about a cult (and credited it correctly with a link back to this post, which is the best I can think to do atm).

--NCCG_Concern
[www.geocities.com]

Zelig,

I always enjoy your posts and find them to be extremely insightful and thought provoking. If anyone should write the first book ever about SOI (<<polite/desperate hinting) I hope it will be you.

Why have people not exposed Chris Butler' s cult to the media? It would seem that could be of help in deterring some and support for others.

Thanks for the kind words folks.

[b:4b07b161c2]WHY I WON’T WRITE A BOOK OR GO TO THE MEDIA [/b:4b07b161c2]

1.) I like my privacy. I don’t want some idiot follower to hunt me down and harass me or my family.
2.) A book could potentially hurt some innocent people.
3.) All the information I have is 20 years old. I don’t have the time or inclination to do the proper research for a book. I’ve already written about my most bizarre experiences and observations.
4.) The only book I would ever write, would be a fictionalized account, preferably a comedy!
5.) The Cult Ed website is a free and safe place for people to read and post anonymously. It is easily “googled” and well moderated. That’s how I found it, by “googling” several of Chris Butler’s names. It has many resources for people in various stages of leaving cultdom and for concerned family and friends. This Cult Ed site is doing a good job. It’s stable, robust, and never goes down from attacks. Everything you need to know about Chris Butler is here and more information is being added all the time. It also gives you an opportunity to PM other registered members.
6.) Going to the media is not always the solution. The media is only interested in the drama of kidnappings, murders, child abuse, or mass suicide. Unless you are a Waco, a Jonestown, or die with a purple triangle over your face, they just aren’t that interested. The media also has a tendency to twist the truth to suit the ratings.
7.) My idea of happiness is not writing a “Cult of the Month” book or to have a reunion of ex-Siddha followers on the Dr. Phil show.

If for no other reason than SOI does not become the next Jonestown then I will keep going.

So far I have been writing about the cult for about the past month and in that time I have received lots of e-mails that show me that my so far simple effort has meant more to more people than I imagined that it would. Fortunately I do have the time and inclination to do research and as time consuming and emotionally draining as it can be at times even when I am only updating every few days I am still working on my little mission every single day.

I didn't have much of a life before SOI and now that they have broken me down even further than I was I do not have the things to lose that a lot of other ex-followers do. As always Zelig makes a lot of good points.

It only really takes one to do a lot of things and while all the encouragement and support is appreciated and I hope that interest and knowledge about SOI among others will expand by next year if my work now pays off there will be media stories and a book in 2007.

CultReporter, there is no one better qualified that you to write this book, Zelig, Rama, Just Googling and others here I am sure can help, and trust all will give you encouragement and support in what will be a trip that will be draining, exhausting and take much courage, stamina, intelligence and insight. From what I have read, you are "the one". We are all behind you and this forum itself has plenty of resources for writers!

All you will have to do is ask the right people if you need any help.

Note: If anything is going to put people's holy noses out of joint, it is going to be an expose book! :D (with reference to Zelig's comment about all necessary info being on the forum, a book is a different kettle of fish altogether from a forum, it is record on paper that will last for perpetuity, something like the pyramids! It is also something like building a pyramid, no easy task, but done correctly, will be a monument to the history of this time.

The question is whether your safety will be compromised if people know you are writing a book?

PPS Loved the latest chapter at [science-of-identity.blogspot.com]

With regards to my safety apart from earlier attempts to find out where I am and some threatening e-mails and phone calls months ago now I doubt that SOI will take anything seriously until after it happens. They seem very confident in the stability of the little world they have made for themselves. I doubt they think a simple woman can do much-obviously they have never heard of a woman scorned and I think heartbroken is even worse :( I have already changed my name since leaving so I am not really traceable and moved well away from the Gold Coast just incase. Some of them do really scare me.

Despite my experience I am not into revenge and I do not want to make any money out of this (I know from experience writing does not pay so well anyway - I used to write fiction before it was one of the things my faith directed I give up) I am more worried about 'the wimp' as TruthAsItIs calls him here, but he has made his own choice. As much as I feel they control him he was not born to SOI and I do not know him to be blind to many things that should make him think what he is involved with.

I don't think I could live with the guilt of the memories of the children there if I did nothing. I would have loved to have had children by now and I was very attatched to his son. No child should have that life forced on them.

I am getting right into some research at the moment and the other thread here has provided some really helpful leads for this and reminded me of things that I shouldn't overlook. Any help that anyone wants to offer is good. Sometimes my health really lets me down so please forgive me if I ever seem to be a little slow.

cultreporter~
Just make sure you and your publisher have a good lawyer and a lot of stamina. It can be done.