Re: Byron Katie (the Work) and Eckhart Tolle Legit??
Posted by: corboy ()
Date: March 26, 2009 09:40AM

Josh Baran's 'Sorting It Out' apprently started in 1979, rather than 1977, as I'd thought ealier.


And this article claims that SIO had offices in both Berkeley (northern California) and in Los Angeles.


New Age Defectors Look for Help Getting Back to Ground
The Mill Valley Record, April 3, 1985
~ author: Molly Colin ~

Rothbaum, an East Bay social worker, and Josh Baran, a former Zen Buddhist monk and a self-styled public relations consultant, formed Sorting It Out in Berkeley in 1979, with the assumption, said Rothbaum, "that we were interested in spiritual growth."
Rothbaum and Baran say they have seen more than 2,000 clients from more than 250 groups.

"We don't do deprogramming - kidnapping. We do transition deprogramming," Rothbaum emphasized.

Three or four years ago a "rash" of JDC leavetakers sought assistance from the two counselors, Rothbaum said. "The JDC contacted him (Baran) and told him people are saying we're a cult. They asked him to mediate."

When contacted in Los Angeles, where he also has an office, Baran said "The JDC asked me to help resolve some of the problems. I talked to both sides of how they could right the wrongs."

Baran said his efforts did not meet either side's expectations. "Some leave-takers still felt they were not heard. Essentially, they felt they could not communicate with the leader clearly.

"It's a system of a perfect master at the top, incapable of human error," Baran said.
Since that incident, Baran said the church has contacted him "from time to time". Six weeks ago, a church representative called to ask him for his mediation services again because a number of people had left.

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Re: Byron Katie (the Work) and Eckhart Tolle Legit??
Posted by: corboy ()
Date: March 26, 2009 09:57AM

Note this article, originally cited by Jay-C, making it seem that Josh Baran started his Sorting It Out services in 1977 was not a report from someone who had left a Muktananda community. (Though JB is referred to as providing such services to former Muktananda people on a discussion thread on AOL).

This report was from a former member of the Da Free John community.

One area where this person made a minor error was stating Baran was the author of a book entitled Dark Zen, when that actually was not a book but a review article for a book by Brian Victoria, entitled Zen at War, from which I quoted earlier.



1977 - These were very interesting times for me as my transition from the community to the world was rapid, pleasurable and confusing. I still sincerely believed in conquering my spiritual immaturity and rejoining the community, but my new friends had no such illusions about themselves. Over the course of time, our household became a kind of way station for people leaving the community to come and talk it out with us. Josh Baran, the author of the book on "Dark Zen”, was an exit counselor who would frequently come over to our house and talk to the people who were leaving. I came to learn that some people were actually being offered money by the community..'

by contrast, here is the report from Mill Valley Record


New Age Defectors Look for Help Getting Back to Ground
The Mill Valley Record, April 3, 1985
~ author: Molly Colin ~

Rothbaum, an East Bay social worker, and Josh Baran, a former Zen Buddhist monk and a self-styled public relations consultant, formed Sorting It Out in Berkeley in 1979, with the assumption, said Rothbaum, "that we were interested in spiritual growth."
Rothbaum and Baran say they have seen more than 2,000 clients from more than 250 groups.

Still, whether Baran launched Sorting It Out in 1977 or in 1979, he was still of sufficient reputation to be consulted as late as 1985, two journalists, Dan Lattin, and Molly Colin.

Six to 8 years is a goodly length of time to spend on as important and helpful a project
as cult exit counseling.

Why not list it in one's resume today, when the topic remains of the utmost importantance?

We have plenty of media consultants. There is no shortage of PR liasons.

But experienced and skilled exit counselors...we need them more than ever.

Why be shy about having been of service, and in such an important way and (depending on the chronology, one year before Jonestown...or one year after Jonestown?)

PS: For those who happen to be visiting Northern California and want to go and weep, visit Evergreen Cemetary in Oakland.

About four hundred of the people who were murdered at Jonestown, Guyana, CE 1978, lie buried there.


If you happen to be in the area late November, phone the cemetary. They may know whether someone is going there to honor the day.

To quote the words at Yad Vashem Holocaust Memorial in Jerusalem, Israel:

People Be Vigilent

Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 03/26/2009 10:04AM by corboy.

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Byron Katie (the Work), Stephen Mitchell, Seung Sah, RandomStu
Posted by: The Anticult ()
Date: March 26, 2009 12:18PM

There are even more dots that haven't yet been fully connected in this. Perhaps more information will be forthcoming.

There is Stephen Mitchell, who was/is deeply connected with (Seung Sahn) Kwan Um School of Zen []
Seung Sahn is the same so-called Zen master who was busted for having sex with his students and disciples. Why hasn't Stephen Mitchell commented on that?
Do they think its ok to have sex with your Zen students, or not?
Now there are reports that Stephen Mitchell was being groomed to take over from Seung Sahn, and be the leader of the Kwan Um School of Zen? hmm...who actually owns/controls the Kwan Um franchise now? Has it been purchased in secret? Would anyone even know if it was?

Notice also previously in this thread, one of the members at the same Kwan Um School of Zen, a certain RandomStu aka Stuart Resnick, came into this thread making endless false and deliberate obfuscations?
Take note, that RandomStu openly flaunts and promotes the use of so-called "Entheogens", that is, psychedelic drugs. []
as well as openly breaking many other Precepts, yet Kwan Um School of Zen is proud of Resnick, and his own blog says he leads groups there. Here is RandomStu - Stuart Resnick, commenting on the..

QUOTE: "interesting (enjoyable?) part of psychedelic trips"
Early Video of "Magic Mushroom" Trip []
So clearly, the Kwan Um School of Zen thinks taking psychedelic drugs is just fine. If not, why is he teaching there?

There are many people out there who are political and fanatical believers in so-called "entheogens", which range from "natural" plant drugs, to MDMA Ecstasy [] to countless other psychoactive drugs and hallucinogens.
What if some "entheogen" fanatic in the system, even a rogue, likes to slip some entheogens in large brews of communal tea? (there are lots of online recipes for Magic Mushroom Tea). Done of course, in their mind "for your own good", for your "spiritual growth" to break down your boundaries? Even a tiny micro-dose would just do the trick.

There have been several reports now, of people "hallucinating" at some of the Byron Katie Schools, as well as mass-vomiting, and even mass erectile failure.

- There have been reports of mass-vomiting, with no known reports to the health department. Was it reported? []

- total erectile failure in groups of men []
QUOTE: "All of the men reported zero erectile ability during their stay...Either their diet was engineered to limit this ability or potassium nitrate was put into their food; probably the later."

- Hallucinations, there was the recent first hand account, of people feeling like they were on Magic Mushrooms.
I, also, noticed Katie saying things like "enjoy the trip, often."
"One such experience involved a spontaneous "trip" or altered state of consciousness that was very reminiscent of being on mushrooms. That particular evening was many days into the event, and I had not eaten much that evening (of my own volition). I had an extreme affinity for the wall to wall carpeting and was laughing intensely at the nature of "it" all and feeling a deep connection to those around me and the "oneness". I was disconcerted by these feelings as I noticed thoughts racing (not to mention loving wall to wall carpet!) and have had experience with both psychedelics and the mentally ill.
...Over the next couple of days I saw many other people who looked like they were tripping, too. If you have ever done so, you may notice a dilated pupil and demented look on the person's face."

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/26/2009 12:27PM by The Anticult.

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Re: Byron Katie (the Work) and Eckhart Tolle Legit??
Posted by: Jay Cruise ()
Date: March 26, 2009 12:23PM

Josh Baran has authored a book about Zen and a article/review for "Dark Zen" which as you say would be a minor error on the part of the person giving the account. Da Free John was a disciple of Muktananda which made me think this was Muktananda community but it appears he had cut ties at that time. I was more interested in the exit counselling which makes his current position seem unethical. There is more money in cults than cult activism which can be much more attractive than fighting them.

Here is a slightly more useful description of Baran starting on page 135. I sumarized some points from the book, also below:


Baran went to Shasta Abbey in north CA at nineteen (1970) to study Zen buddhism. For 10 years he studied under the monastery's teachers and became a Zen monk and Priest. In 1977 Baran quit the priesthood.

He moved to SF where he started working on a degree in religious studies at Antioch College. He met Susan Rothbaun at the Abbey who was given an ultimatum to cut ties with Baran. Rothbaun and Baran began talking with other ex-disciples of alternative religions in the Bay Area.

Together they Founded "Sorting It Out". Over seven years they assisted over 3000 people coming from 250 groups.

Quote "The hours he spent listening to the SIO participants sharpened Josh Baran's understanding of how people behave when they feel their beliefs and sacred images are threatened. He gained a realistic view of how and why true believers can go off the edge psychologically. By the same token, he learned it was vital not to try to "deprogram" anyone, but instead show some respect for - indeed, to encourage the free expression of - differing viewpoints."

Baran was getting involved with California's nuclear disarmament movement. He volunteered with Ground Zero, a major antinuke group, and "discovered" he had a knck for developing communications strategy. He had the ability to carry messages to thousands or even millions of people.

May 1982 the ABC tv network announced the broadcast of The Day After. Rothbaun and Baran set to make it the biggest media event of 1983. 7 months before the movie went to air he helped form The Day After Project, funded by Ground Zero and Physicians for Social Resposibility. And on.

He started his own public relations firm after The Day After.

Baran was the president of a eponymous public relations boutique, known for counselling clients on the political and cultural left - People for the American Way, the ACLU, the Hollywood Women's Political Committee, the National Resources Defense Council, celebrities, entertainment companies, children's health causes, and various environmental and religious groups. He promoted high profile events in the 80s eg. pro-choice rallies and Farm Aid concerts. Active in Democratic Party politics and served as Californian press secretary for U.S. Senator Gary Hart's '84 presidential bid.

He had built an impressive list of contacts and "He knows a remarkable number of people from a remarkable number of areas of life."

Universal executives then recruited Josh Baran as a consultant.

Quote: "Josh Baran's experience with Sorting It Out prepared him for operating on this battlefield. He had seen the dark side of religious commitment, the tendency of some of its strains to erect a system of beliefs that denies the validity of other ways. Intolerance of any path but the one "true" way follows a similar
storyline everywhter, whether it is a cult's perfect master demanding a followers fealty to an ideal of spiritual purity or a religious leaders asserting that the United States is destined to be a Christian nation. Baran saw it as his mission to use the tools of public relations discipline to open up a space in people's minds for the concept of freedom of expression - to remind them that it is legitimate in America to write and read varied interpretations of art and religion, to have one's own internal definition of what is true."

Which is just horsecrap when refering to Baran who is now director of a organization run by an abusive leader like Byron Katie. The book keeps going about his Universal studios position.

From this you put together the time frame fairly accurately Corboy. Baran might have been working as an exit counsellor of sorts in 1977-78 before "Sorting It Out" or maybe that person had the year skewed which wouldn't be that difficult considering how long ago it was.


"Byron - You and Jesus...?" Byron: "Are One." - Conversation between author Christin Lore and Byron Katie.

"You even touch me and i'll fucking kill you!" - Byron Katie speaking to her daughter.

Both quotes taken from the book 'A Cry in the Desert: The Awakening of Byron Katie'

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Re: Byron Katie (the Work), Stephen Mitchell, Seung Sah, RandomStu
Posted by: The Anticult ()
Date: March 26, 2009 12:24PM

(connection to other Byron Katie thread)

Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"
The Work/Byron Katie-strong concerns []

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Re: Byron Katie (the Work) and Eckhart Tolle Legit??
Posted by: Jay Cruise ()
Date: March 26, 2009 06:11PM

More on Stephen Mitchell and the Kwan Um School of Zen:

"Stephen Mitchell was the first Western Monk ordained by Zen Master Seung Sahn and was known as Mu Gak Sunim for 14 years." (Also written Mu Gak Su Nim or simply "Mu Gak")


Here is a bunch of letters relating to Seung Sahn. One letter in 1975 mentions Mitchell being ordained as Mu Gak Su Nim and a number of references to Mu Gak.

In around 1989 (doing the math) he dropped this title so I propose this was due to the 1988 sex scandal. But his involvement doesn't end there. As well as "The Whole World is a Single Flower (Questions and Answer)" in 1992 and Mitchell's foreword also appeared in the 1997 "The Compass of Zen" by Seung Sahn.

From Stephen Mitchell's site advertises this book showing so it would be hard to believe he has an issue with Sahn's indiscretions.
In the Kwan Um School of Zen 2002 summer/fall magazine:

"He said, “I’m Mu Gak.” Then I said, “Mu Gak?” He replied, “That means ‘no enlightenment.’” Now that was really interesting, because I had been searching for enlightenment for a very long time and this guy was named “no enlightenment.” It turned out that Mu Gak Sunim actually was Stephen Mitchell, the famous poet and translator, who many of you in this audience know quite well. The two of us went out and had a cup of coffee. In the ensuing conversation he told me a great deal about Zen Master Seung Sahn and finally he said, “If you would like to meet him I can arrange for him to come to Yale and give a public talk.” I, of course, agreed and about a month later Zen Master Seung Sahn and Mu Gak Sunim came and gave a talk at Berkeley College. Zen Master Seung Sahn was answering questions after Stephen’s opening remarks."

"In the autumn of that first year in New Haven, Zen Master Seung Sahn and his first Western monk, Mu Gak Sunim (now Stephen Mitchell) came to Yale. Mu Gak Sunim delivered a stunning dharma talk, followed by Zen Master Seung Sahn taking questions and answers. At one point he asked someone in the audience, “What is your
name?” But after a response of ‘John’ or ‘William,’ Zen Master Seung Sahn laughingly retorted, “Oh, that is only your body name, but what is the name of your true self?”


So as well as still refering to Sahn as his Zen Master he is well respected within the Zwam Um School of Zen. After all he edited and compiled the teachings of Seung Sahn. This makes a clear connection between Stephen Mitchell and the largest Zen zchool in the west.

Stephen Mitchell also brings to Byron Katie the experience of forming an international school and being the author of that schools of a religious text, hence why previous books were destroyed.

1995 - "Is Stephen Mitchell himself a spiritual teacher? 'I've heard of people learning things through my work,' he says. 'But I couldn't begin to teach until I finished my own inner homework.' He pauses and smiles. 'Maybe in a couple of years.'"


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Re: Byron Katie (the Work) and Eckhart Tolle Legit??
Posted by: corboy ()
Date: March 26, 2009 10:10PM

You dont have to read books if you hang out with people who have both read books and have written them.

So...even if BK hasnt read books, or at least has not read many books(as hubby Mitchell claimed in his interview with Scott London...she had the good taste to associate with people who have read the books.

BTW Mitchell in that interview sounds like Archie Bunker, from All in the Family.

If you combine that interview with reading his correspondance as quoted by Janaki...

its enough to ruin a person's appetite.

Let us look at an author named Elliott Isenberg. Why him?

You'll find out in a minute.


Sunyata : The Recollections of a Rare-Born Mystic by Betty Camhi, Elliott Isenberg Softcover, North Atlantic Books, ISBN 1556430965 (1-55643-096-5)

This book was published in 1990

Losing the Moon, by Byron Katie, in its first printing, was published by The Work Foundation in 1998.

The 1990 book, by Camhi and Isenberg, has to do with the career of a Danish born mystic, Alfred Sorenson, whose career is detailed in Wikipedia.


(excepts, quoted as of march 26, 2009 7:33 PST)


India’s rich spiritual heritage provided a perfect environment for Sorensen’s natural mystical attitude.

During his first stay in the country Sorensen had been initiated into Dhyan Buddhism, but it was Ramana Maharshi who was to provide the biggest influence on his spiritual life.

He had read Paul Brunton’s classic A Search in Secret India (1934), and soon after he met Brunton who arranged for Sorensen's first visit to Sri Ramana.

Sorensen made four trips to Tiruvannamalai between 1936 and 1946, staying for a few weeks each time. It was during his visit to Sri Ramana that Paul Brunton told him that Ramana had referred to him as a ‘janam-siddha’ or rare born mystic[2].
A profound experience occurred to Sorensen while he was on his third visit to Sri Ramana in 1940: “Suddenly, out of the pure akasha and living Silence, there sounded upon Emmanuel [his preferred name for himself] these five words ‘We are always aware, Sunyata!’”[3] Sorensen took these five words to be mantra, initiation and name. He would use the name Sunyata, or subtle variations on it for the rest of his life.
Although Sorensen, or Sunyata, as he came to be known for the last forty four years of his life, kept his Almora hut as his base he would continue to travel around India visiting friends and ashrams, especially during the cold, Himalayan winter months. Sunyata many prominent spiritual teachers in addition to Ramana Maharshi, including Anandamayee Ma, Yashoda Ma, Swami Ramdas and Neem Karoli Baba.

From at least the 1930s Sunyata wrote diaries and reflections. His writing used a highly idiosyncratic, playful language to express the spiritual concepts that he focussed on. He often combined English and Sanskrit, used obscure literary terms or invented his own words. In 1945 he wrote Memory, an autobiography, which is the core of Sunyata – The life and sayings of a rare-born mystic[4]. Sunyata continued to write throughout his life and another collection of his writings is collected in Dancing with the Void.

[edit] The move to the USA

In 1973, members of the Alan Watts Society who were travelling in India after the Watts’ death dropped in on Sunyata and were impressed by his spiritual understanding. One of the group told him “You’ll be in California next year.” To which Sunyata replied “But I have nothing to teach and nothing to sell.” To which he was told “That’s why we want you.” [5]Sunyata flew to the US for a four month trip from late 1974 to early 1975.

In 1978, the Alan Watts Society arranged for a final permanent move to California where he lived until his death in 1984. While in America Sunyata held weekly meetings at Alan Watt’s houseboat SS Valejo**, where he would answer questions from visitors[6]. On 5 August, 1984, Sunyata was hit by a car when crossing the road in Fairfax, Ca. and died eight days later.

[edit] Teachings

Although Sunyata denied that he had a 'teaching', he expounded an Advaitic world view and maintained that he had always known "the source and I are one".

Like Ramana Maharshi, Sunyata regarded silence both as the highest teaching and "the esoteric heart of all religions".[7] Silence for Sunyata was the stilling of desires, effort, willfulness and memories.

Sunyata coined words himself to convey some of his more unusual perceptions. 'Innerstand' meant an intuitive comprehension that did not involve the intellect or effort, while 'headucation' was mental conditioning. Those of us who falsely identified with our individuality he referred to as 'egojies' (-ji is an honorific suffix used in India) and he was fond of the Japanese Zen term 'Ji Ji Muge'[8], meaning the interdependence of all things.

Sunyata's understanding of his essential nature was condensed in the word Mu, a Chinese term similar to the Sansrit term Sunyata, which he used both in reference to himself and as an

**In Bartley's biography of Werner Erhard, he describes Werner having met Watts on that same houseboat. It would be interesting to run Google and find out if 'Sunyata' went to Esalen. In any case, Watt's houseboat seems like a floating Esalen...saints, rogues and hustlers all boiling together.

One avenue of research is to get old books such as Losing the Moon (I found a copy for $2.00 at a used bookstore).

Once you get a copy or photocopy in your hot hands, look for the names of people who are thanked. Look at the names given for those who take the photos or do the editing.

In the case of Losing the Moon, the editor is Ellen J. Mack.

Special thanks is given in the 'About this Book' section to someone named Elliott Isenberg.

Now, if you Google Ellen J. Mack, you dont get much. She did do a lot of travelling in India lookng for advaita teachers.

But if you google Elliott Isenberg, he turns out to be a therapist with 20 years of experience.

Losing the Moon was published in 1998

Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 03/26/2009 10:33PM by corboy.

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Re: Byron Katie (the Work) and Eckhart Tolle Legit??
Posted by: corboy ()
Date: March 26, 2009 11:11PM

Years back, I read a biography of young James Boswell, by Frederick Pottle. Pottle tells us that its become myth, a broadly held assumption that the first real book Boswell published was the classic Life of (Samuel) Johnson, which came out when Boswell was middle aged.

Pottle tells us that Boswell was actually an old hand at both writing and at publishing, and that he had been publishing articles and even books, from the time he was in his twenties. Far from Life of Johnson emerging, full formed, as a stunning miracle seemingly from nowhere, Boswell's career as a writer had been decades long, before he produced his masterpiece.

The real lesson, both from this anecdote, and from Buddhist teachings on cause and effect (aka dependent origination, aka 'karma') is that No Thing ever comes from non existence.

There is no such thing as magic and no such thing as spontaneous enlightenment, either.

If something seems magical or spontaneous, its just because one doesnt have the needed data to trace the chains of cause and effect.

The cause and effect is there. One just cant see it.

(My fun comes from knowing this, even when I dont yet have the info to trace it all out yet.)


In 1945 he (Sorensen/Sunyata) wrote Memory, an autobiography, which is the core of Sunyata – The life and sayings of a rare-born mystic[4]. Sunyata continued to write throughout his life and another collection of his writings is collected in Dancing with the Void.

***So this material ,via a Danish born advaita mystic who died in 1984, may have served at the very least, new set of catagories through which BK could refract her material into a new and perhaps more broadly marketable pattern.

As measured using her books, BK first emerges to public view as a Woman-Christ desert savioress in the American South West as depicted in former nun Christin Lore Weber's presentation of Katie via Cry in the Desert, (now out of print) to....

(next incarnation)

A new age 'nondual' teacher by the sunny shores of Manhattan Beach, California--assisted by hanging out with an editor (Mack) who had travelled in India, and helped by another student, singled out for 'special thanks--(Isenberg) who had, in 1990, co-published a book on the very arcane subject of a Danish born convert to Indian mysticism.

a mystic who was deceased, just 6 years prior.

Losing the Moon, being also out of print and likewise hard to find.

(Note: Manhattan Beach, even in 1998, was a pricey place to live. A friend of our family lived there, and I often went to the house to visit. You mention Manhattan Beach and people go, 'ummmh!' the way they do when reminded of hot fudge sundaes).

Now, the current helper is a fuzzy, quasi Buddhist who has excellent ties to the maintream publishing and retreat scene.

BK Successive Changes in Public Image--refracted(?) through viewpoints and the belief systems of those assisting BK literary output (Weber, Mack/Isenberg, Stephen Mitchell)

Public Image/.....Helpers ('midwives')

Woman Christ--Christin Lore Weber--former Catholic nun, novelist, devotional writer

(Source--Cry in the Desert--copies now scarce)

Nondual/Avaita--(Ellen J Mack editor, Elliot Isenberg ('special thanks')--co author of a book on Sunyata/Sorenson Avaita and psychotherapist with a Ph.D dissertion on the issue or evil.)

(Source--Losing the Moon--copies now scarce)

Inspiration-Industry-Buddhism/(Stephen Mitchell, buddhist pedigree tied to Sueng Sehn, ties to literary agent Michael Katz of Esalen, co-taught some gigs with Jack Kornfield and Sylvia Boorstein which gave him access to Spirit Rock Meditation Center--all this before his marriage to BK)

Edited 5 time(s). Last edit at 03/26/2009 11:29PM by corboy.

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Re: Byron Katie (the Work) prolonged Eye-Gazing technique, induction
Posted by: The Anticult ()
Date: March 27, 2009 02:13PM


another very self-conscious technique that Byron Katie uses, is the prolonged Eye-Gazing technique.
There are many examples of her using that technique, seen in the conversion story by Carol Skolnick, blogs about the Byron Katie Eyes by the disgraced Neale Donald Walsch, advertising blogs by Stephen Mitchell []
and the initial induction by Byron Katie described in detail by Janaki on her blog []

there are probably more Eye-Gazing Byron Katie stories out there, if people have experienced that, please write out what happened in detail.

What they do now is they Pre-Frame people into this, and encourage them to gaze into the eyes of Byron Katie in photographs...(don't do that...that creates psychological projections) []
That is preparation work. Then if you meet BK at a BK School LGAT seminar, she may single a person out, maybe even in the toilet during a break, or at lunch, and in SECONDS be able to connect deeply with direct eye contact, and some bodily contact, touch, etc.

For example, deep gazing into a candle is a classic way of inducing self-hypnosis.
A better effect can come from Eye-Gazing, and on top of that, it builds deep instant intimacy between people.
there are even articles about "Hypnotic Gaze Induction", but some do it with a gaze, some with their voice tone, language patterns, etc. there are many ways to do it.

one MIGHT use deep eye gazing in marital therapy, to deeply connect with your spouse, for example.

But never allow someone who is functioning as a coach, Guru, Anti-guru, or whoever, to enage you with deep eye gazing. Its a common technique used in LGAT's as well, to create instant bonding, and Love-Bombs.

But if a Guru-type, gets you to gaze into their eyes, for 15-20 minutes, like some of them do, they can easily NON-VERBALLY "pace and lead" you into deeper states, which are in effect hypnotic trance states, which make you more suggestible. Then after this, they can start laying their suggestions in, and the bonding which has occured make them more powerful.
So its manufacturing a false-intimacy.

this is all done very deliberately and technically, of course. Byron Katie has been using this same method since at least the mid 1990's, so she has it down to an art. She may have been using it for 20 years by now, and after 20 years you can get pretty good at a technique. She could probably "convert" people now in 5 minutes, if they have been prepared beforehand, with photo's, YouTube, etc.

And she has her husband Stephen Mitchell making blog posts, and others too, to encourage people to lock-eyes with photo's of her, and if they ever meet her, to do this prolonged Eye-Gazing.
Don't do it.

The only person one should be doing prolonged eye-gazing with, is Brad Pitt, or whoever. But if a Brad Pitt type was running LGAT seminars, run for your lives.
They are doing hypnosis, but they are also just manufacturing deep emotional intimacy with a simple technique. Then they use that power to do things, like get you to work for their for-profit companies for no pay, to try and win their approval. Its just deep manipulation.

Never ever stare for 5 minutes, or 20 minutes into the so-called "eyes" of any type of seminar leader, guru, anti-guru, or whoever. Its a technique.
Who needs it?
Its intimate emotional exploitation.

The subject, you, may even think you are the ONLY one the Guru has done this too. When in fact, they do it deeply to dozens and hundreds of people a year, if that is their style.

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Re: Byron Katie (the Work) and Eckhart Tolle Legit??
Posted by: Jay Cruise ()
Date: March 27, 2009 02:58PM

Heh just adding a few details- Byron Katie has a weekend seminar at esalen coming up in september.

The documentary, ON THE ROAD IN AMERICA, at Esalen, Big Sur features Byron Katie:

"Episode 8: Big Sur Part 1 - The cast and crew drive north on California’s winding Highway 1 to Big Sur and their next destination: the Esalen Institute, a haven for alternative ideas since the 1960s. After meeting Esalen co-founder Michael Murphy, the cast takes part in an open forum about Middle East-U.S. relations. Ali and Mohamed let down their emotional guards during a group discussion moderated by author/teacher Byron Katie. "

Esalen, founded by Richard Price and Michael Murphy, was a institute to study 'human potential' by great minds of the twentieth century. An early leader was Paul Tillich the well known theologian which I have always found intriguing. It attracted counter culture figures like Aldous Huxley and Timothy Leary and Zen masters like Suzuki Roshi and Seung Sahn. For explanatory purposes i'll add this NY Times book review quote:

"Though the first experiments with LSD were conducted at respectable universities like the University of California, Los Angeles, Esalen was famously a laboratory for the psychopharmacological inquiries of the period."

Suzuki Roshi, Michael Katz's long-time zen master, opened the San Francisco Zen Center in the early-60s which has close ties to Esalen. From the book Religon and Psychology:

"Eastern adepts like D.T Susuki (Rinzai) and Shunryu Suzuki Roshi (Soto) gathered around them notable groups of Western followers (eg Allen Ginsberg, Jack Kerouac, Gary Snider, Alan Watts, Richard Baker, Timothy Leary, Aldous Huxley). The latter, in turn, helped establish a series of centers and retreats (eg., the San Francisco Zen Center; Esalen)."

My review:
"A Cry in the Moon - The Awakening of Byron Katie offers the unique experience of inadvertently sitting at a bus stop outside a mental clinic."

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