Fortissimo,

Harsh, very harsh.

I'm not sure if any of us are in a position to judge if Ash needs counselling.

The fact he's now back at University suggests he's well and truly put the JCs behind him which is great news.

His life is clearly more productive now that he has left the JCs.

I know we have previously discussed this subject on here but the main issue I had with Roland and Sue and their activism was that they were using their own son as a pawn in their activites. I felt that was wrong. They were not being responsible parents.

Ash's situation is completely different.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/28/2011 12:32AM by Apollo.

Fortissimo,

Why are you here?

How did you find out about the Jesus Christians?

Our dear friend Miss Matteau is once again pleading for donations.

[sahsoofee.blogspot.com]



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/29/2011 11:04AM by Apollo.

Whether Fortissimo is here for "good reasons" or "bad"...is really only a judgement that God may make. Thus....

..with respect, I'd much prefer to generally, judge contributers on the nature of their observations...rather than any supposed "pedigree".

In relation to the specific nature of Fortissimo's comment....

From (what I guess would be) Ash's perspective, he would still be endeavouring to "fulfill the "Great Commission" of "going into all the world and teaching all people to observe what Christ has commanded....the Jesus Christians would see that as faithfully sharing the teachings of Christ (Lay not up treasures on Earth...Seek ye first the Kingdom of Heaven, etc)..a duty in which the traditional churches have arguably failed miserably...and "media attention" would an inevitable consequence of the witness, that Ash would see as incumbent upon him....

Ash has been able to "let go" of McKay, without yet perhaps being fully able to "let go" of some of the wider principles of the JesusChristians....say a commitment to voluntary "poverty" (I may have retained some of these principles myself, in all likelyhood, despite the passage of several decades). Where the more ethical practices of the JesusChristians, are/were matters of faith before God, (and NOT faith before McKay)....Ash and other individuals, should be granted the freedom to continue to pursue them, I believe.....

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Apollo
Fortissimo,

Why are you here?

How did you find out about the Jesus Christians?

With respect to you, Apollo: the answers to these questions are neither pertinent to our discussion, nor are they any of your concern.

With respect to Ash: good for him I guess, if that's what he want to do. But I wonder if Ash is an actual University student? How could somebody be a successful, full-time Uni student if they are changing residences once a month or so?

And note the "Freegan Forager" sign right behind him in the photo. How far has he really moved on with his life? I have no idea, honestly, but from where I sit it really looks like the same old same old.

He might be out of the group and away from McKay, but the group's not out of him and McKay's still in his head. That's obvious to me.

CIFS can help. It would be good if Ash got some counseling. That's all I said to begin with. The radical-activist-in-the-news bit is played out.

Thank you for your occasional comments and information, Fortissimo. You are a welcome contributor!

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Malcolm Wesley WREST
Whether Fortissimo is here for "good reasons" or "bad"...is really only a judgement that God may make. Thus....

No need for moderators then!

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Malcolm Wesley WREST
..with respect, I'd much prefer to generally, judge contributers on the nature of their observations...rather than any supposed "pedigree".

I understand what you're saying Mal but I do think it's a reasonable question to ask considering the history of this thread.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/30/2011 12:54AM by Apollo.

Fortissimo,

This subject has been covered before on this thread. I do understand however that you are a newcomer.

I am quite entitled to ask you why you are here and how you found out about the JCs. You are not obligated to provide an answer but i'm quite entitled to ask the question.

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rrmoderator
It is not a "personal attack" to ask you why you are here, it is a question.

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rrmoderator
It is OK to ask people the purpose of their participation, "Why are you here"?

How far has Ash moved on, with his life?

I can only comment on the observations of others who know him and the "footage" we have at hand....however, I'd still venture to say a great deal.

Ash may be making decisions that I personally would not ("Freegan Foraging" for example).....however I note that it appears HE (not McKay!) is making those decisions....that is what I look at and then judge that he is "recovering"....

I agree with you, Fortissimo that "McKay is not out of his head".....there is a process here....(I'd contend that the process has well and truly "commenced"!)....


....There would still be some "beliefs" that McKay/Berg/whoever introduced to me, that I continue to hold....as I'd consider the principles to be sound, even if those through whom I encountered these principles, were not....would that mean I too, have failed to get "McKay out of my own head"?

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Malcolm
....There would still be some "beliefs" that McKay/Berg/whoever introduced to me, that I continue to hold....as I'd consider the principles to be sound, even if those through whom I encountered these principles, were not....would that mean I too, have failed to get "McKay out of my own head"?

If, Malcolm, after all these years you felt compelled to walk across the desert wearing a sign proclaiming that The End Is Near I'd say the same of you: McKay's still in his head. Mal needs counseling.

And if, Mal, in twenty-five years Ash (he's already been out for what, for or five?) is still flying the Freegan Forager flag and smiling for the cameras I'll ruefully say the same thing.

Does that answer your question?