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Apollo
Free discussion my arse! LOL

OK, here's a test as to whether this is free discussion. Some time ago I posted about a strange adolescent act by one of the people involved in the JC's, where he admitted and was remourseful for an abuse he did while a mixed up teenager. I maintained at the time, that this person does not have the hallmarks of a paedophile, and that many mixed up teenage boys do weird sexual things while going through adolescence. This does not make them rapists or paedophiles. It's a mixture of hormones and opportunity.

Dave has posted something about this, which I think justifies my stance on this issue. X has apparently had some contact with "Stop it Now" following the stupid accusations made here and elsewhere. Here is a part of their response:

Here are some quotes from a letter 'X' received from Stop It Now.

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Your situation sounds extremely stressful and I'm sorry that your disclosures, which appear like they were responsibly motivated on your part, have generated such difficulties for you. Understandably, harmful sexual behaviour is an emotive issue. However, this can mean that it is difficult for people to maintain responsible and reasonable perspectives about the subject, which is unhelpful for all concerned.

Our experience is that professionals' expertise in this area varies considerably, and, with this in mind, I hope that your recent interview with a counselling psychologist was constructive.

Based on the content of your e mail, I would like to make the following observations:
* Paedophilia is an enduring sexual preference for pre-pubescent children. Committing a sexual offence against a child is neither a necessary nor a sufficient condition on which to make a diagnosis of paedophilia. Given that you do not report an ongoing struggle or current concerns about sexual feelings towards children, I would not assume that this diagnosis (or pejorative label in the wrong hands) could be fairly attached to you.
* Your willingness to disclose your past behaviour to others appears to be motivated by your responsible perspectives; and your desire for transparency is likely to serve you well in the future. Sexual abuse thrives within climates of distrust and secrecy. However, as you are no doubt all too aware, people must be wise in choosing to whom they make disclosures. Being discreet is not the same as being dishonest.
* Research supports the hypothesis that most people who sexually assault children within family settings, as you describe, are able to desist from repeating their behaviour in their future, once the situation has been addressed. You have obviously reflected upon your conduct and this all bodes well for your capacity to lead a responsible and positive lifestyle in the future.

I hope you find these comments helpful. I would also like to encourage you to take confidence that you will be able to move on with your life.

Thanks again for getting in touch and best wishes to you,

Stop It Now Helpline

Some people are wondering about my lack of postings recently, and I will say that this witch-hunt aimed at branding the JC's with paedophile connotations has been the main reason for my absence.

I know the JC's made a great error in allowing a convicted paedophile to distribute comics on a train in India to unaccompanied children, and that may still require some answers, but I have been very disturbed by the witch hunt on X.

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Apollo
Who the hell suggested i'm a female called Bryanna from Manchester?

Who did you get that idea from? I didn't write that to you.

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It appears Nick has changed my password. I'm guessing i've been banned?

No you haven't been banned. I sent you an email, in response to your PM in which you asked me if we could have a word.

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Nick I'd appreciate it if you could contact me via email.

I did, 15 hours ago. I haven't seen your reply. Also, when you asked for a word, during Brian's recent meltdown, you didn't give me a phone number. I would like to talk to you.

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I'm sure we can come to some arrangement which will prove I'm not Bryanna from Manchester!

Certainly. I've already written to your given email address to suggest ways by which you could prove your identity to me. Please contact me.

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Apollo
Free discussion my arse*! LOL

Whenever a new poster appears, Brian Birnham grills them for their identity, as he "needs to know who he's working with". Even on the xjcs forum, he would override my decisions and aggressively interrogate anyone new. That was one of the reasons he is no longer posting on that forum.
It was Brian who asked me to accept you, and I did, at the same time as you applied.

When your identity came into question, I asked Brian about you, and surprisingly the supersleuth had no idea who you were, except that you live in Edin-Berg. I would like to talk to you on the phone, please let me have a number, and a good time to call you.

Then we can restore the free discussion.

No two posters have been so alike, as you Bryan, and Brian. Except perhaps for Brian and Oerlikon, and Brian has recently admitted to that he was Oerlikon. It seems very likely that Bryan is also Brian. Please do me the favour of writing me an email at the very least, and preferably, give me a phone contact number as well.
_____

*British spelling, neat.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/04/2011 06:43PM by sWord.

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rrmoderator
To whom it may concern:

Oerlikon has been banned from this message board and may of his recent posts have been deleted.

thankyou Moderator: that's been some time in the coming, and quite a relief now it has.

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zeuszor
Just another forum rodeo clown.

it all seemed deadly serious and quite scary to me.

To whom it may concern:

Personal attacks are off topic.

If personal attacks continue first you will lose pre-approved status.

Second, if it still continues you will be permanently banned from this message board.

In my opinion, I think the JCs are finished anyway. I believe what happened is that Dave finished it himself.

They didn't abandon him, they were likely very surprised, and some didn't know what to do. He basically dumped them, but in such away that they would remain on good terms, by "graduating" them.

It seems like Dave will do that every 5-10 years or so. Purge and reorganize, purge and reorganize, an old COG/Family maneuver.

[www.xfamily.org]

I think he is tired of fighting and the bad reputation that he has been earning, particularly in relation to pedophiles.

The key to it all IMHO was Dave reaching the aged pension age.

It was the first time in 35-odd years that he hasn't had to rely on someone else for his income.

He would automatically qualify for a pension in his own right, i.e. not as Cherry's carer. If Cherry is not already receiving an aged pension, then she definitely will be eligible this year too (they made changes, based on the dates you were born).

She doesn't have to keep up any pretense (assuming she was) by appearing to be more disabled then she was.

They simply don't need the JC anymore, they can basically live out their remaining years doing what they want, income guaranteed.

They are even allowed legally to earn certain amounts (in addition to their pension).

It is funny that Dave talks about people using me; I don't know of any that are. If only he knew the truth and that is, that it seems most people want me out of this mess and focused on my own health and family, etc. That's what I want now, too.

I've stuck around for far too long, out of my stubbornness and desire to see the public discussion of Dave and Cherry's cult not be extinguished by those who I perceive as enabling DM to do what he does.

But also, like I wrote in the first place, I believe that in the end, Dave finished the cult himself. He took everybody on a nice cruise and then "graduated" them shortly after that.

But he will always need his narcissistic supply. Dave not having a following, not having a group of some kind around him for the first time in decades, would be like a junkie suddenly having his supply of heroin cut off.

I believe that the group known as the "Jesus Christians" is no more, finito, but he'll always have the loyalists, those core persons who are loyal to and dependent on him. Remember that.

I'm just sitting here watching the wheels go round and round,
I really love to watch them roll,
No longer riding on the merry-go-round,
I just had to let it go.

In my experience "cult leaders" are most often not simply "in it for the money."

They feed on their followers adoration, obedience and submission.

They seem to require this and the control of others to feel fulfilled in their own life.

Many "cult leaders" have been described as mentally and emotionally sick, some have been categorized as psychopaths.

In my opinion until there are reports of McKay's followers moving on, i.e. returning to their families, going to school, getting meaningful full-time jobs, etc., what has happened is simply some new ploy with Dave McKay pulling the strings.

Only time will tell.

But I have not read anything thus far, which is convincing, to form the conclusion that the McKay group is really done.

I suspect McKay will continue to play and manipulate his followers.

It seems to me that there is something very fishy about the way Dave McKay is operating.
I wouldn't be putting any trust in anything he puts out there. The fact he staged his graduates as posting when it was him, makes it clear he's still the same old David McKay. Dishonest to the innards.

A thorough investigation into the paedophillia allegations is called for.
A complete looking into to see what he's doing to revive the cult is called for. Now that this picture and the names of the people who attended his cruise has been put out to publication, it might be good to contact the people that were on the cruise and find out their feelings.

What went on during that cruise?

Also it seems worth seeing is the police are aware of what's taken place in the cult with regards to paedophilles being given a place to do their acts under protection of being Christians. Have any kids been interveiwed? I mean kids that were raised in the group? There is something really bad being covered up here. I think the surface has just been scratched in exposing it. Now that there have been some people go there own way maybe they can come foreward and speak the truth. There is nothing good in David McKay.

If someone could contact this kittykat, there could be something gained from what she knows. Was there a Chinese member because alot of those family pictures have chinese themes.

I agree with BOTH Zeuszor and the Moderator here....

....it takes years to recover and hence the criteria that the Moderator nominates as "evidence" reports of McKay's followers moving on, i.e. returning to their families, going to school, getting meaningful full-time jobs, etc will not appear for some time, however it is interesting to note that on the recent "exploratory raid" into the xjc site, it appears that only the most recent and the most "dependant" personalities (Joe, Trevor?) posted in support of McKay...the "longer term" members...Christine, Rob, Alf etc DID NOT seem to need to stoop to oblige McKay with attention on demand, in his last self seeking stunt....suggesting that they (while believing in the "theology" still)....have become independant of him.

When was the last time there was small children in the group? It's disgusting that Dave McKay wrote an article in support of paedophiles and now there is this awful news that children were actually molested by some known criminal under Dave's leadership. Even now that he knows he seems to unaware and uninterested of the long term damage.

Imagining that the Jesus Christians are still functioning, are there still situations where paedophiles can have access to children by using the groups resources and then seeking refuge behind the cloaks of those who care more for their public image than they do for exposing the truth?


I think this cruise ship photograph coming out could have been something planned by family members who are less than happy with the lack of contact they are are allowed. Has anyone located the blog by the kittykat? I take it she is someone in the photograph. Maybe the Chinese connection is wrong but some of the outfits and the scenes look Chinese to me or maybe Japanese. Sure would be something to hear from the cruise guests as to how freely they were allowed to communicate with their people. I bet it was like with Scientology where the members watch each other closely.