Quotelarry bobo I believe in most local churches, Marilyn’s name was substituted for God’s in worship songs – while Gary was married to her. Many remember the service where leaders were asked to pledge their allegiance to and spiritually marry Marilyn - quite weird! You can’t have a higher position than to want to be worshiped as God. For Gary to try and distance himself from the hierarchy is lud
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

Here is something interesting from CULTS IN OUR MIDST by Margaret Thaler Singer, chapter 12 on Recovery: Learning to Trust Again "Regaining your sense of trust will grow partly out of the gradual awakening of your ability to tolerate thinking about and discussing the abuse and betrayal you experienced. Members' massive anger over injustices and abuses is kept hidden in the cul
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

Come to think of it, I'm amazed that nothing was said about the woman in this situation. (You know, the father's wife?) If the man was to be turned over to Satan, maybe it was just assumed that the woman actually WAS Satan. Because, you know, she didn't "turn it off".
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

changedagain Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Veering off-subject again--only because I recall > this type of ominous prophesy from the platform so > vividly: > > Re: The Living Word Fellowship, The Walk, John > Robert Stevens > Posted by: paleface () > Date: February 11, 2016 08:56AM > > I can even recall hearing pastors
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

changedagain Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Onion Wrote: > > > Wait a minute... Changedagain did you say you > > might have some leftover prudishness? You were > > prudish? I'm SHOCKED. ;-) > > I think it is just when I heard about Mom's great > sex life :) I remember seeing my parents kiss, and coverin
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

Quotepuddington ...and it sounds like Gary is trying to take credit for shutting down the LW. “Laying an axe to the root”. What a crock! The Hindenburg is burning and Shalom lit the match, not Gary. Thank you for pointing this out, puddington. Shalom publicly posted her report and letters on Facebook on 10-25-18. Gary Hargrave's apology letter was posted at on 11-1-18. This was also his
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

Quote40yearsin2016 Is it possible that the nightmare is coming to an end? Quotecloudwatcher Maybe in Brazil. There are many encouraging signs in the Brazil document. But I can't help wondering if the majority of Mount Zion survivors are really thrilled about being part of a Christian co-op with many of the same people that were part of their suffering during past years. They may be stu
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

This just in: All TLWF ordinations were revoked as of March 2019.
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

Quotepuddington And so you “give” your children to those in a kingdom facility where they learn to work hard for zero wages. They learn to devalue a college education. And they learn (as teenagers) how to drink alcohol. And hopefully, that's the worst that happens to them at those "Kingdom Facilities". BTW, whose kingdom was that? :(
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

Quotechangedagain BTW, has Gary ever engaged in manual labor while in the fellowship? I heard rumors that shortly after he joined the fellowship he worked for a day on the SD facility doing carpentry work. Or at least walked around wearing a carpenter tool belt. Manual labor? Gary? Not in my memory...well, unless you count violent intercession, "lots of sex with Mom", and hoisting g
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

More conditionings: All "free" time shall be spent doing volunteer labor; the more menial, the better. (If you happen to be a doctor or professor, expect to be placed on toilet cleaning detail.) If the volunteer labor involves a remodel of G&M's, JRS' or GH's home, do not expect remuneration, thankfulness or honorable mention when said home is later featured in
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

Quotechangedagain I think he rose quickly through the ranks, starting with his stint in San Diego. Wasn't he an assistant pastor in SD within 6 months or so of joining the fellowship? And he apparently backed John (rather than RD) during the silver mine debacle, a time period when many took a huge financial hit by investing in what turned out to be nothing but a scam. That stance alone likel
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

Quotechangedagain Yes, congregants fearing an exceedingly vindictive, imaginary God (created by John, customized by G & M), while the leaders live basically lawless lives. Nothing new under the sun. -somewhere in Ecclesiastes Changed, wasn't that in the book of Gary and Marilyn? Not sure, it might have been in the book of John and Marilyn. New corollary to above rules: Pretend
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

QuoteOnion Maybe we could start an inventory list of conditioning to go with the weird walk talk dictionary. Here is a start: Do Not Speak Up Do Not Ask Questions Keep Your Eyes Open Because You Are About to get in BIG Trouble The Walk Has the Power to Destroy Your Life Do Not Make Any Decisions Adding some corollaries to you list of rules, Onion. Do not think unless you a
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

Question: Are there any other charitable organizations besides churches in which individuals who have donated thousands of dollars for years of their lives are not valued or their opinions taken into consideration because they stop donating? Asking for a friend...
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

Shiloh/Kalona News... A few quotes on the proposed annexation from the article: “The city isn’t buying Shiloh,” Schlabaugh said. “Annexation does not mean ownership. We’re not looking to write checks.” "Current discussions between Shiloh and the city involve Shiloh requesting a voluntary annexation of its 200-acre property into the city of Kalona." "The current prop
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

Liamthomasusa, The Path has many parallels with TLWF, as you said. Good one.
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

Quotechangedagain I guess we're supposed to feel sorry for Gary and Marilyn--that they weren't able to have a very important message delivered to John (in the cloud of witnesses) in a timely manner. Poor Mom and Dad...they were always at the mercy of their unfaithful, incompetent servants. Sob. Yes, I believe that is what they thought. How did they end up with such an incompetent gro
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

Just as a TLWF member's life is not about themselves and their family, even their death is not about them. It's about guilt and shame for being ill, dying too soon or not dying quickly enough. Trying to take a message to the "other side" for the grandest egotists of all. I, for one, could no longer abide the extreme control and had to say, "Enough!". I hope that more
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

QuoteOnion I need to clarify something about Bob McClane - or as he was called in my family "Bobby McClane." Bob McClane did NOT commit suicide. He died of a heart attack in the VA hospital. The only time suicide was associated with Bob's death was in the loud and nasty rant of Gary Hargrave who said it was suicide because of Bob's poor health habits. It was cruel and un
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

Great posts on child abuse reporting, NancyB. Thank you for the links. One of my biggest problems with TLWF teaching has to do with their bizarre attitudes toward death. Death and dying are a natural part of life. It is a difficult concept for most of us, especially when it touches us personally. JRS and Gary Hargrave have made the process particularly fraught with their teaching that resurrec
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

Richard M. and Cloudwatcher, It's good to see that you're both still keeping an eye on the RR Forum. I'd love to hear from you both.
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

QuoteNancyB Was that like an 'allowance for boarding school'? How did tlw justify the room and board expense on their non-profit? Did any one ever graduate with a diploma from learning to be pure and obedient? Did your little allowances or paycheck ever pay into ssi;ssdi; soc security; income tax? Did tlw pay for health insurance? Hi NancyB, Good to see you back here. :) I'm
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

Changed, Hope the nephs at COSTCO let you get your candy. There's nothing worse than being run down by satanic channels while grocery shopping.
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

P.S. I misquoted JRS in my post above. It was "I had sought to kill you for your withdrawal." Those words terrified all of us needlessly.
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

Changedagain, Thank you for re-sharing Sierra Dawn's post. Her story about her mom is tragic. It is probably one of the stories that bothers people the most and is remembered years after first reading her account. Sierra Dawn, if you still read here, know that much good has come from you bravely sharing.
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

Onion, unfortunately the tax exempt status of religious organizations seems to be a draw for leaders with evil and greedy intentions. Hopefully, laws can be changed, or the IRS will take note of the abuses and revoke this privilege. I am so thankful that we have this forum to share information and to learn more about the type of group that controlled many of our lives for so long. One of the f
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

Onion, your post should be shocking and distressing news to anyone ever associated with TLWF. I also hope that victims will continue to come forward and bravely tell their truth. "People should not be afraid of information." Absolutely!
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

Quotechangedagain He demanded this of his congregants as they abandoned their jobs, joined communal homes, moved across the country, worked 80-hour weeks performing unskilled manual labor, and donated almost all of their earnings to the church. It's time that we stop deifying JRS and apply a little more scrutiny to what his true motivations often were: vanity and greed at the expense of tho
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families

More about the pressure on victims to forgive from The Daily Beast "One particularly troubling example of this pressure comes from the published guidelines of the Advanced Training Institute (a Christian curriculum TLC’s Duggar family used to homeschool their children) for addressing sexual abuse in the home. It explicitly requires child victims to forgive their abusers in a 10-step pro
Forum: Former Cult Members and Affected Families