Re: Jack Hickman
Posted by:
exfollower
()
Date: August 01, 2011 08:11AM
Quote
Sallie
That is something that the authorities would want to know. Are you asking me if I have voiced my concerns to the proper authorities?
no, i am asking you to name, names.
right here, now, on this forum.
which is what you said you wanted to do.
Re: Jack Hickman
Posted by:
Sallie
()
Date: August 01, 2011 09:01AM
EXFOLLOWER,
Let's look at what I wrote....
I (Sallie) posted this
''Can I give the name of one of the teenage boys who was CO-ERCED to spend ''alone time'' with PJ by his parents...parents who had FULL KNOWLEDGE of the sperm passing ritual...???
And yes...the authorities already have the info...
EXFOLLOWER,
Note the QUESTION MARK . Then note the OTHER QUESTION MARK. Then note the THIRD QUESTION MARK.
Now let's just say you missed them. You didn't see them? You somehow thought that wasn't a question because......cult members don't know what questions are or....whatever....
Ok so Let's review this statement.
I (Sallie) posted
''And yes...the authorities already have this info...''
Well Exfollower are you ''THE AUTHORITIES''?????
Do you somehow feel entitled to info. that is in the hands of the authorities?????
If you are so concerned about the victims of sexual exploitation then you must be very relieved to know that the PROPER AUTHORITIES have been made aware of potential problems
Correct?
Why do YOU need to know whatever it is that the ''AUTHORITIES'' have been told??
If no one did anything wrong then no one needs to look over their shoulders. If someone did something wrong then they should look over their shoulders.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/01/2011 09:04AM by Sallie.
Let's look at what I wrote....
I (Sallie) posted this
''Can I give the name of one of the teenage boys who was CO-ERCED to spend ''alone time'' with PJ by his parents...parents who had FULL KNOWLEDGE of the sperm passing ritual...???
And yes...the authorities already have the info...
EXFOLLOWER,
Note the QUESTION MARK . Then note the OTHER QUESTION MARK. Then note the THIRD QUESTION MARK.
Now let's just say you missed them. You didn't see them? You somehow thought that wasn't a question because......cult members don't know what questions are or....whatever....
Ok so Let's review this statement.
I (Sallie) posted
''And yes...the authorities already have this info...''
Well Exfollower are you ''THE AUTHORITIES''?????
Do you somehow feel entitled to info. that is in the hands of the authorities?????
If you are so concerned about the victims of sexual exploitation then you must be very relieved to know that the PROPER AUTHORITIES have been made aware of potential problems
Correct?
Why do YOU need to know whatever it is that the ''AUTHORITIES'' have been told??
If no one did anything wrong then no one needs to look over their shoulders. If someone did something wrong then they should look over their shoulders.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/01/2011 09:04AM by Sallie.
Re: Jack Hickman
Posted by:
Sallie
()
Date: August 01, 2011 09:21AM
HI Ex,
So I was fondly reading your first post. The autobiography of exfollower
You wrote
''
So I was fondly reading your first post. The autobiography of exfollower
You wrote
''
Quote
exfollower
I'm also a former family member, ex-hickmanite... geez, what do we call ourselves? oh, I know... people. normal people!
I left after 'sunday bloody sunday'. in my years in the community I was privy to a great many things. I had friends who were elders, warriors, princes, and some, were even part of the original 'inner circle'. I hung out at jack's house in massapequa, in small groups and sometimes just jack and I (and fawn). YET, I never saw! never had a hint. not till 'SBS'. oh sure, there was the gossip about jack and L.R., we all laughed it off. old news,"bs spread by old lutherans", "don't be ridiculous!" BUT, passing of the seed, beatings by elders, financial indiscretions... not a clue.
but then after leaving, we started to question everything. which IS something jack told us to do! ..................
==========================================================================
You ''hung out'' with Jack and never thought anything was amiss??
Gee.....Ex
Gee....
I never ''hung out'' cause I was too young. But I knew some ''grown ups'' who hung out with Jack.
They laughed things off a lot Ex....
Just like you...
They laughed and laughed about stuff....
You never knew anything was weird Ex....?
Really?
I would believe that about MOST OF THE 1000 members of his cult.
But you Ex...you claim that your friends were warriors and princes and part of the inner circle and you hung out at Jack's house and sometimes in small groups and sometimes just you and Jack and..... you never thought anything was slightly amiss?
Really?
Really.....
Are you honestly wondering why I didn't respond to the private messages you sent me? Are you honestly wondering why I wouldn't give you information that I would give to the authorities?
Victims of abuse will recognize themselves in my posts if, in fact, they read them. I hope that people read the info. about their legal rights.
I think victims need info. that will empower them. I think authorities need info. that will alert them.
Why do yo need info? You're not a victim. You're not the authorities.
Re: Jack Hickman
Posted by:
exfollower
()
Date: August 01, 2011 09:35PM
Quote
Sallie
EXFOLLOWER,
Let's look at what I wrote....
I (Sallie) posted this
''Can I give the name of one of the teenage boys who was CO-ERCED to spend ''alone time'' with PJ by his parents...parents who had FULL KNOWLEDGE of the sperm passing ritual...???
And yes...the authorities already have the info...
EXFOLLOWER,
Note the QUESTION MARK . Then note the OTHER QUESTION MARK. Then note the THIRD QUESTION MARK.
Now let's just say you missed them. You didn't see them? You somehow thought that wasn't a question because......cult members don't know what questions are or....whatever....
Ok so Let's review this statement.
I (Sallie) posted
''And yes...the authorities already have this info...''
Well Exfollower are you ''THE AUTHORITIES''?????
Do you somehow feel entitled to info. that is in the hands of the authorities?????
If you are so concerned about the victims of sexual exploitation then you must be very relieved to know that the PROPER AUTHORITIES have been made aware of potential problems
Correct?
Why do YOU need to know whatever it is that the ''AUTHORITIES'' have been told??
If no one did anything wrong then no one needs to look over their shoulders. If someone did something wrong then they should look over their shoulders.
i did see that it was a question. and my answer was no, but you can name the parents (transgressors).
next question(s) - no, i am not the authorities. - yes, i feel entitled to know about the 'abusers'. yes, i am relived to know it has been reported!
(why do i need to know?) i think everyone should know who the abusers are. that's why i said post it publicly.
- much the same as george dalaio's 'rap sheet' was posted; (and i've sent that link to many people already.)
just like the other abuses and abusers that have been posted on this site, that were 'hidden', 'secrets';
we are stripping away their anonymity, and bringing their transgressions to light, publicly. much like what was done in - 1981 SBS, - 1983 newsday article, - Rick Ross.com, etc.
keeping secrets is what this cult does, telling those things publicly is what they don't want; and what they fear.
on this forum, no one keeps jack hickman or gary coon's name a secret. why should other transgressors be different?
why would we, anyone, feel the need to protect the abusers and transgressors?
Re: Jack Hickman
Posted by:
exfollower
()
Date: August 01, 2011 10:59PM
Quote
Sallie
HI Ex,
So I was fondly reading your first post. The autobiography of exfollower
You wrote
''Quote
exfollower
I'm also a former family member, ex-hickmanite... geez, what do we call ourselves? oh, I know... people. normal people!
I left after 'sunday bloody sunday'. in my years in the community I was privy to a great many things. I had friends who were elders, warriors, princes, and some, were even part of the original 'inner circle'. I hung out at jack's house in massapequa, in small groups and sometimes just jack and I (and fawn). YET, I never saw! never had a hint. not till 'SBS'. oh sure, there was the gossip about jack and L.R., we all laughed it off. old news,"bs spread by old lutherans", "don't be ridiculous!" BUT, passing of the seed, beatings by elders, financial indiscretions... not a clue.
but then after leaving, we started to question everything. which IS something jack told us to do! ..................
==========================================================================
You ''hung out'' with Jack and never thought anything was amiss??
Gee.....Ex
Gee....
I never ''hung out'' cause I was too young. But I knew some ''grown ups'' who hung out with Jack.
They laughed things off a lot Ex....
Just like you...
They laughed and laughed about stuff....
You never knew anything was weird Ex....?
Really?
I would believe that about MOST OF THE 1000 members of his cult.
But you Ex...you claim that your friends were warriors and princes and part of the inner circle and you hung out at Jack's house and sometimes in small groups and sometimes just you and Jack and..... you never thought anything was slightly amiss?
Really?
Really.....
Are you honestly wondering why I didn't respond to the private messages you sent me? Are you honestly wondering why I wouldn't give you information that I would give to the authorities?
Victims of abuse will recognize themselves in my posts if, in fact, they read them. I hope that people read the info. about their legal rights.
I think victims need info. that will empower them. I think authorities need info. that will alert them.
Why do yo need info? You're not a victim. You're not the authorities.
in reply to sallie's questions
the 'gossip' i referred to =
back then, people who did not like JH, insinuated, that JH & Lou were homosexual lovers. (little did we know how close to the truth they were!) we were told and believed they were both celibate.
and you are correct! - i never thought anything was 'amiss'. i drank the koolaid. i believed; all of it. until that night, january 17th - SBS.
to sallie, and all others here, old and new, 'in or out', etc.
until that night, SBS, the only revelations that i had heard about, - previous to that night =
kenny U was beaten (disciplined) by the elders, as was andy G.
the 'botched' sacrifice in southold.
i was ignorant of the other 'things'. ie:
sex abuse.
JHs family thinking he was delusional.
JH grandfather had died before JH was born ( the grandfather who told him about the 'abensur' family history).
why dennis W left.
etc.
as was, my wife, my friends, elders that i was close to, etc. (really?, really?, - yes, really)
we were stunned . - then shortly after we left. for good!
we left, but we tried to 'pull out' others that were staying. we tried to make 'the secrets' as public as we could. (thus the newsday article).
after I left... i contacted a close friend, who had suddenly left a year before. she left and never told us why, and cut off contact, with all her friends and family, who were still in! - only then did she tell us that- "yes, SHE had been told out about the 'secrets' a year before."
she was too scared to even tell her best friend or her sister! she was 'hiding', and fearful for her safety! she told us about others who had found out about the 'secret sh-t', and also left and were fearful of reprisals. we asked her -"why didn't you let us know?" - her reply - "she was too scared"... her brother-in-law was an elder. (btw, her sister & brother in law did finally 'leave')
AFTER sbs - i also found out about the accountant who was doing the 'books' in East Meadow. who years before, went into hiding... cause he found out!
so, to all - I (we) were ignorant. we didn't know. did 'others' know? (ie: ramus, vandeventers, bob gross, etc.) maybe, maybe not. - they didn't talk to me about it.
but i believe, that we have an obligation to bring this crap, 'into the light'! - publicly - whenever and wherever possible. this is a 'public' forum.
i also found this site - [moderndoomsdaycult.com] - someone else not afraid to tell all.
Re: Jack Hickman
Posted by:
Sallie
()
Date: August 02, 2011 12:25AM
Exfollower,
I posted the rap sheet and arrest record of people who had already been investigated and reported by ''outsiders''
There are victims in this cult, ''insiders'' who have NOT reported events.
Victims of sexual crimes deserve to have total control. To sexually violate someone is to tear away at their own personal boundaries. I would not ''re-violate'' anyone by making a public statement about them and this board is read by all sorts of people.
''Authorities'' .... people who investigate sensitive crimes...know how to respect the rights of a victim.
People who read a message board don't necessarily know how to respect the rights of victims. I'm not going to share info. on the WWW that would leave victims more susceptible to being re-victimized.
I posted the rap sheet and arrest record of people who had already been investigated and reported by ''outsiders''
There are victims in this cult, ''insiders'' who have NOT reported events.
Victims of sexual crimes deserve to have total control. To sexually violate someone is to tear away at their own personal boundaries. I would not ''re-violate'' anyone by making a public statement about them and this board is read by all sorts of people.
''Authorities'' .... people who investigate sensitive crimes...know how to respect the rights of a victim.
People who read a message board don't necessarily know how to respect the rights of victims. I'm not going to share info. on the WWW that would leave victims more susceptible to being re-victimized.
Re: Jack Hickman
Posted by:
Sallie
()
Date: August 02, 2011 12:39AM
OH I AM SO FED UP
I JUST READ MOST OF THAT RIDICULOUS ARTICLE
THANKS FOR THE LINK EX FOLLOER
SOMEONE ''BOLDLY'' COMING FORTH WITH SECRETS
WHAT SECRETS?
THAT LINK ''RE-STATES'' WHAT EVERYONE ALREADY KNOWS EXCEPT...EXCEPT...EXCEPT ...
Poor widdle gary wary...we don't even use his whole name...poor widdle gary is such the victim...oh how we should all weep for poor widdie garie...
And since Jack is dead anyway ...hey...we can just blame every ''KNOWN'' secret...on the dead guy.
Right?
Ridiculous.
I JUST READ MOST OF THAT RIDICULOUS ARTICLE
THANKS FOR THE LINK EX FOLLOER
SOMEONE ''BOLDLY'' COMING FORTH WITH SECRETS
WHAT SECRETS?
THAT LINK ''RE-STATES'' WHAT EVERYONE ALREADY KNOWS EXCEPT...EXCEPT...EXCEPT ...
Poor widdle gary wary...we don't even use his whole name...poor widdle gary is such the victim...oh how we should all weep for poor widdie garie...
And since Jack is dead anyway ...hey...we can just blame every ''KNOWN'' secret...on the dead guy.
Right?
Ridiculous.
Re: Jack Hickman
Posted by:
exfollower
()
Date: August 02, 2011 03:55AM
Quote
Sallie
OH I AM SO FED UP
I JUST READ MOST OF THAT RIDICULOUS ARTICLE
THANKS FOR THE LINK EX FOLLOER
SOMEONE ''BOLDLY'' COMING FORTH WITH SECRETS
WHAT SECRETS?
THAT LINK ''RE-STATES'' WHAT EVERYONE ALREADY KNOWS EXCEPT...EXCEPT...EXCEPT ...
Poor widdle gary wary...we don't even use his whole name...poor widdle gary is such the victim...oh how we should all weep for poor widdie garie...
And since Jack is dead anyway ...hey...we can just blame every ''KNOWN'' secret...on the dead guy.
Right?
Ridiculous.
well... i gotta say, - there was stuff there, that I didn't know about.
and why do you weep for gary? he took over the lead and is perpetrating the BS!!! i think he should be vilified!
Re: Jack Hickman
Posted by:
Sallie
()
Date: August 02, 2011 06:20AM
Exfollower,
You understand my sarcasm.
You know I am fed up by the Gary Coons apologists.
You realize that this recently written, book report- type- article, paints a picture of Gary Coons as a ''victim''.
How do you feel when you read things which depict Gary Coons as a victim?
1) TwoWorlds apologized for Gary in this way. They posted ''
You understand my sarcasm.
You know I am fed up by the Gary Coons apologists.
You realize that this recently written, book report- type- article, paints a picture of Gary Coons as a ''victim''.
How do you feel when you read things which depict Gary Coons as a victim?
1) TwoWorlds apologized for Gary in this way. They posted ''
Quote
Two WorldsQuote
daddylonglegs
Two Worlds- I've been thinking about what you wrote, and you're right- without announcing it, gary has taken over the position. I guess I see him a little differently in that I always wondered if JH was full of it, or believed what he was saying. Gary has a different air about him- I believe he is sincere,........etc....
2)Daddylonglegs apologized for Gary when he posted...''I agree with you. Gary is not a manipulator but he does have an extreme reverence for JH. All his teachings reflect this, and he constantly states Abba said this or taught that. I believe he is trying to hold things together for a variety of reasons,
3)Confused apologized for Gary by posting....''Gary may not have been an actual child, but he did begin serious involvement in the home of JH at a very young age. ...............in my opinion his "relationship" with JH began, to a serious level, as a minor.
4)This new article makes similar apologies for Gary by claiming Gary's innocence/victim status/sincerity etc. etc.
How does that make you feel Ex????
Edited 5 time(s). Last edit at 08/02/2011 06:36AM by Sallie.
Re: Jack Hickman
Posted by:
mainecooncat
()
Date: August 02, 2011 06:54AM
i also found this site - [moderndoomsdaycult.com] - someone else not afraid to tell all.[/quote]
I found this article very helpful. I am surprised to see that the article "Perfect" brings things right up to the present day prophecies recently brought forth by GC and the Vans. Prophesy was given that the cult residents of CO had "failed to slay the beast of the mountain". The prophecy went on to state that due to CO residents failure to slay the beast of the mountain they must move to ME. GC and MV went to CO and spent a day searching for the "beast". They "found" some sort of evil spirit at Denver International Airport" (DIA). While at DIA they attempted to defeat the beast. Apparently there behavior was suspicious enough that airport security confronted them. After this the story gets shaky regarding whether they actually were successful in slaying the beast. Shortly after this trip, about three weeks ago CG resigned his position handing it over to AV. MO and family have already moved from CO to ME with others departure imminent.
I found this article very helpful. I am surprised to see that the article "Perfect" brings things right up to the present day prophecies recently brought forth by GC and the Vans. Prophesy was given that the cult residents of CO had "failed to slay the beast of the mountain". The prophecy went on to state that due to CO residents failure to slay the beast of the mountain they must move to ME. GC and MV went to CO and spent a day searching for the "beast". They "found" some sort of evil spirit at Denver International Airport" (DIA). While at DIA they attempted to defeat the beast. Apparently there behavior was suspicious enough that airport security confronted them. After this the story gets shaky regarding whether they actually were successful in slaying the beast. Shortly after this trip, about three weeks ago CG resigned his position handing it over to AV. MO and family have already moved from CO to ME with others departure imminent.
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