Reepicheep Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> changedagain Wrote:
> -------------------------------------------------------
> > BTW, aside from weathering criticism from those
> > who lost their life savings in the mine
> > debacle...did John take a significant financial
> > hit? I recall an allegation in the divorce
> trial
> > that he was worth 30 million. Even if that
> number
> > was grossly inflated, and he was worth say 4-5
> > million, that still puts him in a much better
> > financial state than the average church member
> at
> > the time. Do you recall John stating in a
> "living
> > word" that the ministries should live a
> lifestyle
> > similar to the people they are ministering to?
> I
> > guess those were just words.
>
> I do remember JRS making that statement,
> changedagain. I also remember GH making the same
> statement. Both tended to attach themselves
> closely to the wealthiest members. In JRS' case,
> the one I was most aware of was John McKune from
> Yucaipa. With G&M, Hank Machal and the Greys come
> to mind. Were they making rules that only applied
> to others? Or were they rationalizing that a very
> small minority of members were more well-off than
> others? Or most likely, it was all B.S. to make
> people believe that they were living sacrficially.
>
> And no, I don't believe that JRS took a big hit. I
> think the members bore the loss, as per usual.

This is standard operating procedure in any confidence game. I remember RD (San Diego) doing the same thing. He continued to “milk” one girl in the congregation who had a good job and was a willing supporter. I felt bad for her after a while, he routinely went back to her.

Most of these guys were natural salesmen with a salesman’s flair and a well developed ability to read people. The question for me has always been is whether JRS and RD (the ones I knew the best) did this deliberately or whether they had drank so much of their own “Kool-Aid” that they deceived themselves into believing it was actually God.

TheJewel Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Most of these guys were natural salesmen with a
> salesman’s flair and a well developed ability to
> read people. The question for me has always been
> is whether JRS and RD (the ones I knew the best)
> did this deliberately or whether they had drank so
> much of their own “Kool-Aid” that they deceived
> themselves into believing it was actually God.

TheJewel,

I've wondered that same thing at times, too. Although, if they really believed it all, they were seriously delusional IMHO.

Reepicheep Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> TheJewel Wrote:
> -------------------------------------------------------
> > Most of these guys were natural salesmen with a
> > salesman’s flair and a well developed ability
> to
> > read people. The question for me has always
> been
> > is whether JRS and RD (the ones I knew the
> best)
> > did this deliberately or whether they had drank
> so
> > much of their own “Kool-Aid” that they deceived
> > themselves into believing it was actually God.
>
> TheJewel,
>
> I've wondered that same thing at times, too.
> Although, if they really believed it all, they
> were seriously delusional IMHO.

Eventually absolute power and control can corrupt an individual and they feel justified in using deception.

Perhaps JRS really believed he was called of God but along the way as he gained our trust and control over us, he justified using deception (absolute power corrupts) in putting forth his claims and revelations maybe convincing himself he was the Apostle to the Kingdom. Think about the confidence it takes to make that claim. If he had Narcissistic Personality Disorder and lack of management of it, maybe that led to the extremism in creating the Nazi hierarchy that he needed to control us. And as he gained power and control over us that possibly just bolstered his claims of more visitations from the Lord which served him in gaining more followers which fueled his need for more admiration and power including occult power. And all the while JRS maintained a good nature and charisma that fooled us.

lily rose Wrote:
--------------------------------------------------
> Eventually absolute power and control can corrupt
> an individual and they feel justified in using
> deception.
>
> Perhaps JRS really believed he was called of God
> but along the way as he gained our trust and
> control over us, he justified using deception
> (absolute power corrupts) in putting forth his
> claims and revelations maybe convincing himself he
> was the Apostle to the Kingdom. Think about the
> confidence it takes to make that claim. If he had
> Narcissistic Personality Disorder and lack of
> management of it, maybe that led to the extremism
> in creating the Nazi hierarchy that he needed to
> control us. And as he gained power and control
> over us that possibly just bolstered his claims of
> more visitations from the Lord which served him in
> gaining more followers which fueled his need for
> more admiration and power including occult power.
> And all the while JRS maintained a good nature and
> charisma that fooled us.

Lily rose, I think you hit the nail on the head with Narcissistic Personality Disorder. Here is a quote from an article in Psychology Today titled Dangerous Cult Leaders:

"...what stands out about these individuals is that they were or are all pathologically narcissistic. They all have or had an over-abundant belief that they were special, that they and they alone had the answers to problems, and that they had to be revered. They demanded perfect loyalty from followers, they overvalued themselves and devalued those around them, they were intolerant of criticism, and above all they did not like being questioned or challenged. And yet, in spite of these less than charming traits, they had no trouble attracting those who were willing to overlook these features."

This article by Joe Navarro, former FBI agent agent and body language expert, also gives an extensive list of typical traits of a pathological cult leader. [www.psychologytoday.com]

Meanwhile...our Narcissist in Chief will be speaking tonight--presumably to unify our country. I sure hope he speaks out against that Nephilim Robert Mueller. He's the real threat to our Democracy!
(sarcasm alert)

This is a very telling section of Woodrow's book:

No one can really blame Martha for finally deciding to bail out of a relationship that, while maybe financially rewarding, was one humiliation after another. It is amusing to note that on the declaration that John Robert filed in response to Martha's (there was a battle over all the property – Stevens hired the same attorney that made a big name for himself in the Lee Marvin case), he totally denied his spiritual authority to the magistrates:


4. Petitioner [Martha] states that I am, in essence, the church. Nothing could be further from the truth. I have been and continue to be a vital ingredient to the development of the churches referred to herein, as I have spent tireless hours writing, researching, counseling, ministering, preaching and teaching what I sincerely and firmly believe is a distinct revelation of what the scriptures really mean [this "distinct revelation" is unfortunately diametrically opposed to the Scriptures; perhaps that is why it is so "distinct"]. We have taken these ingredients and tried to bring the Old Testament and the New Testament in harmony [after all, he was both the reincarnation of the Old Testament Prophet, Samuel, and the Seer, John – what better harmony could anyone ask for?]

I do not consider myself "The Apostle" [a blatant bold-faced lie] or a direct "Messenger of God" as Petitioner asserts, but I do believe that I have been blessed as the beneficiary of certain distinct revelations.


It is truly amazing that the Apostle of the Kingdom, who was given such authority over the worldly system, would bow his knee to the courts of "Satan" in order to win a worldly court case over worldly possessions. Perhaps those in the Walk would have second doubts if they knew how reluctant Stevens was to confess his divine office before men, unless, of course, they can rationalize the whole thing away by seeing a parallel with Christ's reluctance to announce Himself as the Messiah until He had died for the sins of the whole world and risen from the grave. (However, Christ never denied that He was the Messiah; and when asked by the authorities whether He was, He confessed it openly, leading to the accusation of blasphemy).

[drive.google.com]

Tknc share:
I do not consider myself "The Apostle" [a blatant bold-faced lie] or a direct "Messenger of God" as Petitioner asserts, but I do believe that I have been blessed as the beneficiary of certain distinct revelations.


wow--downplaying his lofty role in the fellowship to appear more normal, and win the favor of the court. So much for 'apostolic' integrity. Good thing he didn't mention Shiloh being the center of the universe--that probably would not have gone over too well.

changedagain Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Meanwhile...our Narcissist in Chief will be
> speaking tonight--presumably to unify our country.
> I sure hope he speaks out against that Nephilim
> Robert Mueller. He's the real threat to our
> Democracy!
> (sarcasm alert)

It was exactly this that prompted my earlier remarks. There are many parallels here. The Narcissist and Chief’s primary skill is salesmanship — just watch him work. A very good salesman (who I worked closely with at one of my former jobs) once told me that the first thing a good salesman sells is *himself*. Understand that and you understand JRS, RDC, all the televangelist jokers, and, of course Trump (who is just another snake-oil salesman as far as I am concerned).

Jewel

lily rose Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Perhaps JRS really believed he was called of God
> but along the way as he gained our trust and
> control over us, he justified using deception
> (absolute power corrupts) in putting forth his
> claims and revelations maybe convincing himself he
> was the Apostle to the Kingdom. Think about the
> confidence it takes to make that claim. If he had
> Narcissistic Personality Disorder and lack of
> management of it, maybe that led to the extremism
> in creating the Nazi hierarchy that he needed to
> control us. And as he gained power and control
> over us that possibly just bolstered his claims of
> more visitations from the Lord which served him in
> gaining more followers which fueled his need for
> more admiration and power including occult power.
> And all the while JRS maintained a good nature and
> charisma that fooled us.

It seems that lying and deceiving were a justifiable means to an end in JRS' (a dangerous cult leader's) mind. And lest we forget that he promoted himself to be "The Apostle To The Kingdom", check out the link below to John Robert Stevens: An Apostle to the Kingdom. [www.johnrobertstevens.com]

I would argue that he was the only apostle (in his mind), not an apostle, since all of the others were decommissioned or thrown out before he died. Did he prophesy apostleship over Gary? I have not heard that claim made that I recall. The only term I recall later on was Apostolic Company.

Tknc, that really is a revealing part of Nichol's book. I was kind of shocked by that too.

Changedagain..........
"wow--downplaying his lofty role in the fellowship to appear more normal, and win the favor of the court. So much for 'apostolic' integrity. Good thing he didn't mention Shiloh being the center of the universe--that probably would not have gone over too well."

No kidding! Lol. I wonder what would have happened if he had bound Martha to the pit and loosed judgment on the corrupt judicial system right there. ;-)

Jewel...Yes, I do hope that tonight's speech isn't too embarrassing.

I might be wrong, but I think JRS mentioned at some point having read Dale Carnegie's How To Win Friends and Influece People. He really did seem to follow the ideas in the book. Here's a tidbit about how powerful that book was, from Wikipedia: "Charles Manson used what he learned from the book in prison to manipulate women into killing on his behalf." What a salesman!