Gosh. If the public really knew why.

[tolucantimes.info]

P U D D

Many of us who witnessed the XMAS truck from a distance, and who had subscribed to JRS' overt disdain for the holiday, could never really figure out how the tables were turned so quickly to endorse something formerly denounced.

Double-standards were continually perfected in TLW as time went on until the disparity between the two would no longer sustain the illusion.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/30/2020 06:29AM by kBOY.

Page Views:

12/6/2019: 1,314,935
12/01/2020: 2,259,098

C H A N G E D

What was the view tally the post before Shalom's disclosure on Oct 25, 2018?

kBOY,
I didn't mention page views in 2018 prior to Shalom's post. No doubt there was significantly more interest in the forum following the public disclosure.

Early October 2018 posts:

Posted by: that little red flag
Date: October 06, 2018 06:08AM

Some people reading and posting here may have left before much of this was was discussed, exposed, happening, etc. Or, may not be aware that the actions of shepherds abusing sheep, has been going on since the days of JRS, and has somehow become acceptable in the Living Word culture.

But in case there is any confusion regarding the enabling referred to, it applies to the leaders (Gary and Marilyn Hargrave), and the leadership (also known as shepherds), knowing full-well of Rick's tendency toward, and actions of, seduction and sexual abuse, AND still condoning it enough to allow him to maintain his very large position in the leadership. All of this, while somehow turning a deaf ear to the voices, hurts, and abuses of the injured sheep.

So much for the so-called "shepherd's heart".

Posted by: kBOY
Date: October 06, 2018 05:23PM

My family just ran into a large group of current TLW members who ventured off the reservation to enjoy a Friday evening at our local farmers market, every one of them we have known for decades and still dearly love. Each of them has more integrity in their little finger than anyone in TLW leadership.

Unfortunately, not only are they naive about all the skeletons and dirty laundry hidden away in all those liquor cabinets, but our relationship with them would be adversely affected if we even attempted to broach the subject. They seem happy in their level of UNawareness and appear set to continue on as normal.

Their saving grace has probably been their isolation in a remote enough location to be out of range of the incestuous and degrading environment that L.A. has managed to develop.

So much for the 'pure atmosphere'.

Posted by: puddington
Date: October 06, 2018 08:27PM

Interesting kBoy. For some of these people, it seems like they would never leave the cult. It has become so much a part of them. If they left they would practically die. The LW culture has a complete stranglehold on them. Like an inoperable brain turmor. To remove it would kill them.

What it would take is a personal crisis happening to them or someone close to them. Like what happened when Sierra’s mother got terminally ill. A situation like this will reveal the true, cruel nature of the shepherding. Even in that local church with it’s puppet pastors.

Posted by: Cloudwatcher
Date: October 06, 2018 09:45PM

I would rather dribble in my soup in a cuckoo's nest than go back to that shit hole. I will forever be so sad for all who have not been able to escape. I got lucky I guess---it was the flick of a switch for me and I was done. The price is dear but not as dear as my freedom.

C H A N G E D

Interesting posts given that they came just two weeks prior to Shalom's disclosure.

Most of those we encountered that Friday at the farmer's market have since left TLW, and some have even relocated out of the area.

The few who remain are in their 60's, 70's, and maybe 80's, and feel they simply have no other place to go, or life to live.

Very sad indeed.

kBOY Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> Most of those we encountered that Friday at the
> farmer's market have since left TLW, and some have
> even relocated out of the area.

Good!

> The few who remain are in their 60's, 70's, and
> maybe 80's, and feel they simply have no other
> place to go, or life to live.

yeah, that's understandable.

A post by fromsouthchicago on Oct. 9, 2018:

Posted by: fromsouthchicago
Date: October 09, 2018 01:15PM

Allow me to introduce myself, I am Marilyn Hargrave's cousin. My mother and her mother were sisters. My mother's name was Mildred and her mother's name was Bessie. Bessie was part of the TLWF until Marilyn threw her out of the cult in the 90s. I have had no contact with Marilyn as an adult but several of my relatives have. I do have contact with and a good relationship with her brother, Charles and his wife.

To give you a little understanding of where I fit ... Marilyn and Charles were born almost two decades before I was. I'm actually closer in age to Marilyn's children than to Charles and Marilyn.

What I know about Marilyn, especially in later years comes from reports from my relatives. I decided early on that I would maintain a long distance from her.

When I tell people about Marilyn and this cult, I generally receive gasps and a few nervous laughs. Some people, including my wife didn't completely believe me ... that is, until she met Charles and his wife. What she learned shocked my wife to her core. My wife discovered that not only what I had said was true, but was actually worse than I had told her. Charles and his wife had more frequent contact with Marilyn and have been more tied into the information stream than I have been. Thus they were able to further educate us on the goings on.

What I have learned about Marilyn was that she had developed into an opportunist and a sociopath. She was someone who had absolutely no conscience. From all that I have heard about her, she learned that she loved power and manipulating people. And loved all the money she extracted from her followers, her believers and she continued to want more. I base this on all that I have heard over the years from my relatives and from what I know that she did to my Aunt, her mother. Bessie believed in and was devoted unquestionably to Marilyn. And in turn Marilyn took her mother for everything she had. One day, she threw her out of the cult. Bessie never understood the reasons for her expulsion. Bessie died not long after it happened. I saw her shortly before she died.

Based on what I'm reading in this forum, Marilyn became exceptionally good at giving into her desires and using her skills to exploit and manipulate people. What you have written aligns with what I have heard from my relatives about her activities.

Regarding the "transition" in leadership from John to G & M:

Posted by: kBOY
Date: October 16, 2018 12:56PM

ONION:

P l e a s e regale us ASAP with the whole JRS>>MS>>GH/MH transition details, as they seem to have been given a TOP SECRET classification, with access given only to those who have something to hide.

With all the b a g i l l i o n tapes recording every anointed fart ever released, why was there NEVER an 'official' recording of this most important transition detail, since the fellowship was expected to hang their hats on an 'official' transferring of the torch, and not on some late night coup.


Posted by: Onion
Date: October 16, 2018 03:10PM

The JRS-> Gary transition. Holy crap where to start.

Not long after the open house at Kling and the procession of people paying last respects and the subsequent temporary interment of JRS' body at Valhalla, a bunch of us went to Las Vegas. I don't know why the decision was made to go there but for people living in shock and dismay and grief, it was kind of a cool atmosphere because you could wander around in the middle of the, have a drink, smoke a cigarette, and cry and feel totally private. My two cents at that time.

The people who went included Marilyn, Gary & Donna, Me & Dan, Marti, and I think that's all for the one car but I think Rick and Tami came in another car.

Not long after we arrived, spouses were sent home including Dan, Donna and I don't know who else but it seems like more people were there and left.

Not long after that (few days max) Gary and I were walking into the hotel (Dunes) after parking the car and Gary told me he was in love with Marilyn. I remember saying yes I loved her a lot too and then realizing what he meant and I said "Wait - you mean as in love want to kiss her and make out and have sex love her?" and he said YES. Then he told me she loved him too. From then on Marti and I shared a room and Marilyn was shown on the registration as being in our room but she was in Gary's room. Rick and Tami were there for part of this but they may have gone home and come back. Rick and Tami were FURIOUS. A huge family division started between them and G&M at that point and for our sakes, it would have been nice if it had continued.

All together we were in Las Vegas I think for about 5 or 6 weeks. When we got back to L.A. I continued my routine of pretty much living at Kling only now it was with Gary & Marilyn. Gary separated from Donna and was sleeping in the middle yard shed that we had previously used as a meeting room. The dispute with Rick and Tami continued and there were lots of meetings in the backyard with various ministries like John Miller, Brent Finney, and I don't know who else. I was at the house but I was not included in any of these meetings even though JRS always had me attend his meetings because I was like the record keeper and person to follow through. So I knew these meetings were "heavy duty" and very secret. I was told that there was a general uprising among all the brothers over who would take over the church. JRS had left instructions for Marilyn to be the one who took over (I didn't see documents but I heard JRS say this long before he was terribly ill in instructions he gave Dan Statton).

We made another lengthy visit to Las Vegas a few weeks later - I don't remember the timing. We stayed in moderate priced rooms like motels with kitchenettes. They sent for Larry Cotton to join us and during that time Marilyn tried to engineer a relationship for me with Cotton that didn't work out, thank God. But I was told I should get a divorce too. Now that I am free from the nonsense of thinking everything Marilyn did was holy and anointed, I have a lot of regrets from that period of time regarding Dan. He had been JRS' friend and confidante, had cared for him in the sick room, had helped hide all of JRS' stuff after he died and then was treated like he was not even human. So awful.

If I remember correctly, Gary was one of the head guy's at ApCo and I think JRS had commissioned him over CLW and some other locations to bring the word. So he already had standing and a position in the church and probably in peoples' minds.

Slowly but surely G&M started telling people about their relationship. I was aware only of all the people who backed them and celebrated the idea. On March 17, 1984 they had a backyard party and got married informally by the pool (legally with a marriage license, etc.) so then they could live together without having a third party around to make it look kosher. I don't remember the date Gary's divorce from Donna was final but it couldn't have been very long before this March date even if it was only a status only divorce.

The party for the secret wedding was a drunken brawl as you might imagine.

Then slowly but surely Gary kept moving towards the goal of Kingship with his Queen next to him and the rest is history. There was no legal documentation that I am aware of pertaining to Gary taking this role so any legal passage of the baton was probably done through corporate documents especially after Hargrave Family Ministries was incorporated and given nonprofit status as the organization that governs all others. They hired me as their lawyer to get the nonprofit status so that had to be in 1993/94.

Posted by: Twoteetwo
Date: October 16, 2018 03:57PM

Onion, thank you for shining light into very dark corners. My husband and I began to think about leaving when Gary left Donna and baby, and married Marilyn. We thought it was so wrong, but reading the posts, things were worse than we imagined. We were such suckers. We finally left after attending a service in Honolulu where a kamikaze-committed worker from LA stood and spent many minutes pledging her undying allegiance to Marilyn, and Marilyn sat there beaming, soaking it all in. I blame no one but JRS and G&M, but have to acknowledge that if I had been closer to the center of that skewed universe, but for the grace of God, it would have been me pledging my allegiance to M and the new order. So glad you made it out and are peeling back the layers of deception.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/05/2020 03:38AM by changedagain.