Gary’s response “We don’t need to change anything. This is just collateral damage in the battle for the kingdom. There’s always going to be casualties.”

I wonder if his attitude would have been different if it was his life being ruined by the gross negligence of those whose job it was to look out after him?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/19/2020 02:54AM by changedagain.

changedagain Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Gary’s response “We don’t need to change
> anything. This is just collateral damage in the
> battle for the kingdom. There’s always going to be
> casualties.”
>
> I wonder if his attitude would have been different
> if it was his life being ruined by the
> gross negligence of those whose job it was to look
> out after him?

Great question, changed. Or if someone was hurting Marilyn's progeny. Would that have been considered collateral damage? Or would she have suddenly gotten a "word" to call the police? BTW, it just dawned on me that Marilyn was married to two cops. Well, if you can call Gary a cop. Lol. Wannabe?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/19/2020 03:17AM by Reepicheep.

Reep wrote:
Great question, changed. Or if someone was hurting Marilyn's progeny. Would that have been considered collateral damage?

If someone slashed the tires of the Christmas truck just prior to it taking off to spread cheer through the neighborhoods of Toluca Lake...woe to him (or her). Their body might turn up a few weeks later in Holy Jim Canyon, or thereabouts.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/19/2020 03:49AM by changedagain.

"Collateral Damage"
I can't think of anything more dismissive or callous as someone using this phrase to justify preventable, long-lasting psychological damage in a person's life. The ultimate church authorities (G & M) had a responsibility not to sanction the kind of asymmetrical relationships--where one side had all the power, and the other was expected to always be submissive--that made it easier for known predators to ruin lives. The more time goes by, the clearer it is that the 'foundational' teaching claiming if church members are obedient, God will work everything out for good in their lives, paved the way for so much unnecessary harm in people's lives.

The “collateral damage” done to these sheep was deep. Most of them will require therapy the rest of their lives.

“Collateral damage” is not necessarily a resume enhancement for one seeking to reboot a new world-wide 'misery', aka, Jerusalem Center, featuring a G-man on the r u n . . .

kBOY Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> “Collateral damage” is not necessarily a
> resume enhancement for one seeking to reboot a new
> world-wide 'misery', aka, Jerusalem Center,
> featuring a G-man on the r u n . . .

Good point, kBOY!

Possible Gary Hargrave resume: I specialize in collateral damage. In fact, I feel that I am best qualified for a worldwide ministry in collateral damage, gaslighting and sheep beating. I am also destructively ambitious and require millions of dollars as well as devoted servants to attend to my every need. Aforementioned servants will receive no compensation other than the privilege of serving me, naturally.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 05/22/2020 01:13AM by Reepicheep.

Reep wrote:
Possible Gary Hargrave resume: I specialize in collateral damage. In fact, I feel that I am best qualified for a worldwide ministry in collateral damage, gaslighting and sheep beating. I am also destructively ambitious and require millions of dollars as well as devoted servants to attend to my every need. Aforementioned servants will receive no compensation other than the privilege of serving me, naturally.

The Door Opener to Collateral Damage?

Note: I have been lax of late in fulfilling my self-appointed record keeping role in this group. Today's stats...

1128 pages
11,278 comments (all lies)
1,702,169 page views

A few posts from May of 2018:

Posted by: larry bobo
Date: May 06, 2018 11:52AM

Sexual abuse was more than just a rumor in TLWF. I was personally abused by a gay pastor as well as a woman everyone would know who was around in the 70’s. She wrote many of the worship songs sung during that era. I was 15 and both the man the woman were in their 30’s. I would never suggest their actions were directed by the leadership, however, the atmosphere was so toxic that many things existed under the radar that I do not now see in a healthier church. Hopefully, my perception is better in my 60’s than it was in my teens. In hindsight, how did I as a 15 year old, and my teen friends, know this “pastor” was gay and John, who ordained him with his great revelation, not have a clue. He was much more than a sincere gay man looking for answers – he was an evil predator.

The wounds many received in TLWF were certainly not limited to G&M, but on the other hand, they certainly directed the culture. I remember trying to figure out why my local shepherds treated people so harshly until I had my first discipline experience with Apco. It seemed every other word started with f..king this and that. No wonder they acted the way they did. Those who have been abused, abuse. I heard stories of the way Apco was treated by G&M and could only imagine how G&M were treated by “God” – especially the god who wants to kill, steal, and destroy that they seemed to serve. Anyone remember John's first encounter with "Jesus" in Holy Jim Canyon? It was not to bring life.


Posted by: GSchaeff
Date: May 06, 2018 12:32PM

If any current member is reading this and doubting whether John, Marilyn or Gary are culpable in perpetuating a culture of abuse, ask yourself this simple question:

"Here we have at least three people on this page alone who have spoken about sexual assault in the church. Why has there never been a formal investigation into any of these pastors, why were the police never notified about this?"

The answer is just as you described. "This is collateral damage, and there's always going to be casualties." It went under the rug to protect Gary's kingdom.

The number is much, much higher than 3 by the way. Larry, I'm very sorry to hear about your experience also. I hope you taking the courage to share it will wake some current members up.


Posted by: GoingRogue
Date: May 25, 2018 10:01PM

In my experience, the lying and tricking people was a common occurrence in the LW. The biggest concern of the top leaders (G&M and JRS) in such instances was for themselves and their reputation. Many casualties seem to have been considered "collateral damage", as has been mentioned before.

By the way, when people with stories to tell and points to make about this group are afraid to post, who wins? This is an anonymous forum for good reason. But it also allows people to undermine and attack other posters with impunity. And I'm pretty sure that I know who is laughing all the way to the bank when that happens.