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Changed4me
I remember when M started designating the wife as the spiritual leader of a marriage and that husbands were to submit themselves unto their wife. I remember the date, time, place where it happened to me. Part of the"pitch" to accept this was M telling my wife and I that she chose us because we were strong and could handle it.... once again it gave us the feeling of having M's approval I remember how Bill Maybe struggled with this. It ultimately drove him away from his marriage, church and son.

Looking back, as hindsight is always 20/20, this role reversal was designed to break the male spirit and establish M's stronghold as the spiritual leader. I remember G telling me how difficult it was for him. From the early days, I think M saw herself in an exhaulted way because she was the chosen one to bring forth the man of God that was going to bring forth the kingdom on the earth. I think she used the same principle with Gary.... he was the voice from the pulpit, but in reality, she directed him as to what the will of God was going to be.... shining bright the path as the Lamp of Israel....what a bunch of mind controling bunk!...just my humble opinion.

My wife and I came to see Marilyn as a "King Maker". She would help the one she latched onto and propel him to the top.

"Kingmaker" is also used in some countries to refer to those individuals with the ability to influence the selection of political leaders. The term though always unofficial, has tended to gain more importance in places of power struggle e.g. politics, sports organizations etc. Consequently, bestowement of such a title is looked upon significantly and more often as a means of indirect gratification for individuals wanting to silently dictate the affairs of the organization."

This is what has happened to tlwf. I was at the 1984 meeting in Sepulveda when she was choosing the men who would stand with her. They have become what we always tried to avoid: becoming like "Babylon". I heard the tapes where she directed marriages to break up. It was a big mess.

Way back in the early days whenever the phrase,"the living word" was used my wife and I always thought of God's Word (the scriptures), what we didn't realize until later is those who used it the most were speaking of the word, sermons, this weeks, and tapes from jrs. He was not the Christ, John the Beloved, or our Father in the heavens. However, regarding the posts seeking info about John. Was he a drinker? A womanizer? That's like focusing on the debauchery of the prodigal son, "Can you tell me more about those prostitutes?", rather than on the forgiveness, grace, and love of the father. John was a man whom God used just like He has used anyone of us. Different calling, different gifts, but the same Spirit.

Galatians 2:6 "As for those who were held in high esteem—whatever they were makes no difference to me; God does not show favoritism—they added nothing to my message."

We have one Teacher, One Father, One Spirit, and we are all brothers. Once again those in leadership have given themselves over to exalt marilyn and gary the same way they exalted jrs. And now with gary reaching out to the catholic church it's all over, but the shouting. IMHO.

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Changed4meDate Added: 07/25/2013Posts: 6

Re: The Living Word Fellowship, The Walk, John Robert Stevens


I remember when M started designating the wife as the spiritual leader of a marriage and that husbands were to submit themselves unto their wife. I remember the date, time, place where it happened to me. Part of the"pitch" to accept this was M telling my wife and I that she chose us because we were strong and could handle it.... once again it gave us the feeling of having M's approval I remember how Bill Maybe struggled with this. It ultimately drove him away from his marriage, church and son.

CHANGED what happened to BILL MAYBE? I liked him a lot. We used to talk a lot when I saw him at Shiloh. When I was at the Valley church for that conference Marilyn called after John Stevens died I remember Bill Maybe being questioned by Marilyn, he was like called out, and I remember him telling her that he would "repent until he had a revelation of her," something to that effect. I had the feeling that he was sort of saying that in a tongue in cheek manner, I HAD THE FEELING, not sure, but I had the feeling that was being a little satirical. I never figured Bill would fall for any crap out of her. How long did he last in the walk after JRS died? I've been seeking information about him a long time. Also about FINNEY, whatever his first name was, and Vere Thomas, was he around after JRS died I can't remember, but I know Marilyn made it a point to say about Finney, "if they had been of us, they never would have left us," some crap like that. Were you at that meeting yourself?

If you look at Hitler's organization during WWII, he had a close group around him that executed his madness. While Hitler gave the orders, it was these SS officers that made sure these plans were carried out. Guys like Goebbles, Himmler, and Goring did the dirty work. Hitler insulated himself a bit from close contact with the atrocities that were being conducted in the name of the Third Reich. But it is wasn't for this SS organization, Hitler would not have been the mass murderer that he was. Someone else did the leg work. Likewise, Jim Jones didn't mix or serve the Kool-aide. That was done by his inner group. These inner zealots are what gives these madmen their power.

In a similar way, Gary and Marilyn have an inner group that does their dirty work for them. This is sometimes called "Marilyn's Army of Women", (but at times includes men as well). At one time, it was called "The Purples". This inner group are the ones that will do anything for Marilyn. Anything. Maybe its because of religious zeal, or maybe a fear of rejection that motivates their behaviour. There is a fear of being rejected by her and being "sent to your room", (a partial shunning that occurs inside the LW). This is where the cool guys end up not being the cool guys anymore, so hardly anyone will relate to them. Sometimes they become strangers in their own church. If it gets really bad, they leave. This inner group consists of people like Phyllis Haworth, Deby Grill, Chris Sayer and Gilee Larson. There are others, of course. They pride themselves on their "Killer Spirits". Their behaviour to date suggests that they are capable of doing anything for Marilyn. Even things that has deeply harmed people emotionally and mentally. Phyllis Haworth used to be married to Bill Maybe and I suspect this got very difficult for Bill after JRS died. I suspect that Marilyn had a big part in their breakup. I hope and pray that God reaches this inner group and opens their eyes to what they are doing in the name of Marilyn.

PALEFACE, how long have you been out of the WALK? I don't think you ever said, or I can't remember, much about how you blew out, or if you were set out. I don't want to dabble too much into anybody's history or identity, I mean if anybody wants to remain anonymous or whatever. You can PM me if you like.

I didn't know many that lived out in the West or North much. I met and liked both John Miller and Bill Maybe. I liked Mike Shimmerhorn too, although I was disappointed in him, you know when he was caught up in the moment I guess and said he didn't know Christ. I think he did know Christ, or certainly Christ did know him.

There was one dude here in the South, in Knoxville Tennessee, the one that "gave me the word" to divorce my first wife, rest her soul, he was all rapped up into Marilyn, but he was really from Illinois. The people from the South just weren't into all that. I guess it is the rebel in us.

This is the first I ever really heard of this Marilyn led army of women. Man Marilyn is about as Jezebel as she can get. She must have laid something good on John Stevens is all I can say. I really thought he had it together more than that.

Marilyn the "KINGMAKER." I like that. The QUEEN OF HEAVEN topples "THE KINGDOM APOSTLE." I love it. You know all the words about "commission not position". It is so funny now. Babylon the great in it's purist form. I must have been too stoned to know what was happening. But that is no excuse. I was right there soaking it up myself along with everybody else.

There is a word from God, one that didn't come out of the mouth of John though. It comes from the Bible. It speaks of a day when a man will be called a prophet and he will answer "I am no prophet, I am a tiller of the ground."

Someday, there will come a church that is not some man trying to be worshiped. With a woman coming along to control that man, so she can be worshiped.

"However, regarding the posts seeking info about John. Was he a drinker? A womanizer? That's like focusing on the debauchery of the prodigal son, "Can you tell me more about those prostitutes?", rather than on the forgiveness, grace, and love of the father. John was a man whom God used just like He has used anyone of us. Different calling, different gifts, but the same Spirit. "


Great post! I realize vomiting may be part of the healing process and perhaps identifying falsehoods is helpful in coming to a better understanding of the truth, but it's not something you want to make a lifestyle of. Much of what I posted on Factnet the first few years after leaving TLWF may have been theraputic at the time, but they are not even things I think about now, much less would post. Whatever blessings came through John, came from God - and God is still alive and well. God is the focus - not John. Where we get ourselves into trouble is allowing someone to come between us and God. Designated relationships are nothing more than an attempt to take the place of God in people lives as well as provide a thinly veiled hierarchy to control those still in the fellowship.

If you think of the first of the Ten Commandments - "You shall have no other gods before Me" as a relationship instead of a law, He doesn't want anything to come between you and Him because He is jealous for you. The greatest commandment is like it - "Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind." Only God can give a nature change - man can only point to Him. John 1:6-9 says, "There came a man who was sent from God; his name was John. He came as a witness to testify concerning that light, so that through him all men might believe. He himself was not the light; he came only as a witness to the light. The true light that gives light to every man was coming into the world."

Whatever errors John may have made, his human nature was no different than ours. He loved God and many of us lived in the overflow of that love. He tried many times to get us to wait on the Lord ourselves and honestly, most of us were just too lazy - we preferred the spiritual welfare system. True spirituality is much closer to good character than an altered state of consciousness. John never could impart a nature change as many suggested, even though he may have helped open our spirits. (Opening our spirits the way we were taught in TLWF is closer entering the sheep pen by another way as a thief and a robber, and it came with much spiritual warfare that was totally unnecessary if we were really walking in obedience.) Many spiritual leaders in other religions can alter your consciousness as well - however, they are unable to change your heart so you will follow Jesus' commands. They can see auras but they can't keep their pants up - we had a little of that in TLWF as well.

Many have recognized there was a point where John's focus shifted from God to Marilyn and the whole direction of TLWF shifted. Instead of John serving and equipping the body, the body reversed directions and started the upward flow. God in the sky was mocked in comparison to God in John. A hierarchy of control took over that was much more destructive than anything we had known in "old order". Instead of God's spirit bringing liberty, there was the oppression of drunken shepherds who could not run their own lives, much less anybody else's. If you questioned the whip to your back you were deemed rebellous. Perhaps the best lesson we can learn is to keep our focus on the Lord and let Him complete His work in us - the other task masters are not that much fun and don't produce anything for all that work.

I was in the "Walk" from 1970 until 1985 in the SLC church in Utah. It's all gone now, but some familiar names I remember were Bowman Littleton, Bill Mabey, Howard Klein, Bill Arnold from Honolulu, R. D. Cronquist, John Miller, Harold & Mel & Leland Bailey to name a few. I loved these people. Those times were great. I remember being enchanted, enthralled and going about with a real sense of purpose and blessing. Nevertheless, at the end I was taking orders from almost strangers. I was not having much fun to say the least. I got out with my marriage and children intact but the damage was done.

This forum which somehow I found a couple of weeks ago has been very helpful. I have been coming home after work each day to get the therapy that is posted on it. Good Job!! When I get the nerve, perhaps I can say something constructive too. Thankyou.

See [www.cultnews.com]

The Rick A. Ross Institute for the Study of Destructive Cults, Controversial Groups, and Movements has officially changed its name to The Cult Education Institute for the Study of Destructive Cults, Controversial Groups and Movements.

The new domain name entry point and gateway to the Internet archives of the institute will soon be culteducation.com.

The Cult Education Institute archives is a library of information about destructive cults, controversial groups and movements, which was initially launched in 1996 and has continued to be under construction and expansion for the past 17 years.

The public message board attached to the The Cult Education Institute will soon only be accessible through the domain name culteducation.com. More than 100,000 entries from the former members of destructive cults, controversial groups and movements and others concerned has accumulated at the board over the past decade. The message board content continues to grow daily and it serves as a free speech zone for those who wish to share their insights and concerns about the topics listed.

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FCSLC
This forum which somehow I found a couple of weeks ago has been very helpful. I have been coming home after work each day to get the therapy that is posted on it. Good Job!! When I get the nerve, perhaps I can say something constructive too. Thankyou.

Welcome FCSLC. Hope to hear more from you.
Glad to hear you and your family got out intact.