Search for: "Mankind Project 'New Warrior Training' " - hilarious.
Some are here:
mankind project 'new warrior training' weekend - 1 [tinyurl.com
mankind project 'new warrior training' weekend - 2 [tinyurl.com
mankind project 'new warrior training' weekend - 3 [tinyurl.com
mankind project 'new warrior training' weekend - 4 [tinyurl.com
I feel an urge to apologize. These stories would be funny if they weren't real. Those stories aren't quiet what I experienced. FYI; I live in Western Australia and did my weekend in Perth. After reading the stories from the men that you posted, I realize how big the impact of staff quality is on the group. I haven't experienced any of the aggressive behavior/treatments described. We had licensed professional psychologists, psychiatrists and medics on the staff that were easy to recognize by the bands on their arm. I did however have the strange 'introduction' with men dressed in black and black stripes on their face. I'm still trying to figure out what that was about!
Does Mankind project have any form resembing this? If you signed such a form, you may feel like a free thinker, but are no longer free to use your citizen rights to sue or mediate for compensation in case you incur harm during the MP weekend.
Any group that tells you to accept responsibility for your actions, but uses these forms to disown its responsibility for the powerful effect of its techniques is failing to be consistent.
And dont try to say that Mankind project is better or is different than the organizations whose forms are mentioned here.
If (IF) mankind project requires participants to sign away their rights to sue or mediate for damages then by having such forms and requiring subjects to sign as a condition of participation, this demonstrates that MP is similiar to these groups by using this type of legal strategy to protect itself from its own subjects.
The MKP has indeed a form resembling this. I have to admit that when I first saw/read it, I was slightly surprised and disturbed by it. Death? Can I die on this weekend? Seriously? I figured that it made sense for an American organization where even a microwave manufacturer needs to warn a user not to put their cat in the microwave to dry! I didn't think to much of it and in hindsight, I don't really see the need for it (for me anyway) either. Nothing that I have seen or done was physically threatening. I'm not saying and haven't said or claimed that MKP is better than other organisations, I haven't done Landmark or other 'trainings' so I can't make that judgement call.
You don't seem to much of a "free thinker" and rather are here as an apologist for MKP.
I'm sorry if that is what it seems. I'm just trying to share a different story. FYI, I'm also a master Freemason where we practice in a very different way to achieve a similar goal; a better man in a better world. What 'better' means, is up to each man.
MKP has a history of bad press and settled a wrongful death lawsuit rather than go to trial.
There is a fair bit of bad press indeed! And don't get me started on bad press about Freemasonry. I know Freemasonry from the inside out and can tell from experience that the majority of bad press is unfounded. That also tells me that I have to be careful with what I read. Just because the press is negative doesn't mean that the opinions expressed by the press are true/valid. Bad press about MKP is understandable and in a number of cases warranted, but that's not always the case.
That link is a very interesting article! I really enjoyed reading that. A few comments on the 13 liabilities listed from personal experience.
They lack adequate participant-selection criteria. - They have extensive checklists that you need to fill out to find out whether you are suitable.
They lack reliable norms, supervision, and adequate training for leaders. - Training is extensive for the leaders and mandatory. It takes a tremendous amount of training before one can be a leader. Training takes usually place outside MKP and is not MKP founded or related.
They lack clearly defined responsibility. - Not on my weekend and in my experience, but I assume that this may occur.
They sometimes foster pseudoauthenticity and pseudoreality. - I haven't seen it, but I assume this can happen.
They sometimes foster inappropriate patterns of relationships. - No relationships, business or personal (other then simple friendship), are allowed in the 6 months following the weekend.
They sometimes ignore the necessity and utility of ego defenses. - Interesting, maybe.
They sometimes teach the covert value of total exposure instead of valuing personal differences. - Definitely not the case for MKP
They sometimes foster impulsive personality styles and behavioral strategies. - Not sure what this means.
They sometimes devalue critical thinking in favor of "experiencing" without self-analysis or reflection. - Definitely not the case for MKP
They sometimes ignore stated goals, misrepresent their actual techniques, and obfuscate their real agenda. - That's a big one! As far as I can see it doesn't apply. Then again, I don't fully know the MKP.
They sometimes focus too much on structural self-awareness techniques and misplace the goal of democratic education; as a result participants may learn more about themselves and less about group process. - I guess that's true.
They pay inadequate attention to decisions regarding time limitations. This may lead to increased pressure on some participants to unconsciously "fabricate" a cure. - The contrary was true on my weekend. Up to a point where I felt a string urge to 'please move on'.
They fail to adequately consider the "psychonoxious" or deleterious effects of group participation (or] adverse countertransference reactions. - That can be the case, but in my experience is very unlikely.
The bottom bit hits me as most important;
The groups were determined to be dangerous when:
Leaders had rigid, unbending beliefs about what participants should experience and believe, how they should behave in the group. and when they should change.
Leaders had no sense of differential diagnosis and assessment skills, valued cathartic emotional breakthroughs as the ultimate therapeutic experience, and sadistically pressed to create or force a breakthrough in every participant.
Leaders had an evangelical system of belief that was the one single pathway to salvation.
Leaders were true believers and sealed their doctrine off from discomforting data or disquieting results and tended to discount a poor result by, "blaming the victim."
None of the above applied to MY weekend, but I suppose some of it may apply to other weekends organized elsewhere. So I assume there is reason to be cautious. That said, these dangers fits the Church pretty good as well. I can see how at least 3 out of 4 apply to the church. So I guess this is a risk we always have regardless of what group one follows. It just goes to show how important it is to be critical and questioning in life. I'm glad to have come across this forum as the comments here challenge my convictions.
Moreover, as noted specifically in the commentary regarding the MKP manual notes -- in my opinion MKP uses coercive persuasion techniques.
When you say 'in my opinion MKP uses coercive persuasion techniques' I'm a bit confused. Do you mean they try to recruit people using that technique? Because recruitment doesn't happen. Not here anyway. Well, I suppose I talk pretty enthusiastically to people around me about it, but it doesn't go any further than that. For the trainings/processes themselves, we gather in small groups and we are just talking in an open/honest way. We have several processes that we can use to address certain things that happen to us in life. One process is called 'What's at risk' and the term in itself explains the process. It is used when men feel they're stuck in a situation and struggle to get out. With this process men get to see how we often create a false image of a certain outcome that is unrealistic but at the same time stops them from progressing. I really don't see any harm in these processes. Would you mind to elaborate?
Frankly, there are much better, more credible and safer alternatives readily available such as continuing education at an accredited local college, counseling by a licensed professional, or a support groups suggested by a local social services agency that is staffed and/or coordinated by licensed professionals. If you have a particular problem you might consult trusted family members, your doctor, clergy or locally funded referral service. There is typically no "quick fix" through a weekend and such programs most often lack meaningful accountability, scienftifically measurable results and properly licensed and trained professional staff.
I totally agree here. However, education at a college is not aimed at dealing with yourself, recognizing emotions or understanding how conflicts in your life often have an origin in yourself. If one needs counseling or has problems in life, PLEASE do see a professional and DON'T attend the weekend. There is indeed NO quick fix for any issue one may have. The weekend is NOT therapy, it is NOT counselling and it is not aimed at solving problems. It is aimed at men that want to know themselves better, understand why they behave the way they do or men that want to have a more meaningful life.
I'd like to finish this posting with a note of appreciation. I definitely learned a lot more about MKP thanks to all your postings and links. I discussed this forum at a local meeting in Perth with about 12 staff members that have been in MKP for a long time (I'm still new). They also told me that MKP hasn't always been what it is today. Apparently, some comments and bad experiences on this forum hold real merit. They warned me to be careful in my postings and respect what some men had to go through. It keeps evolving and improving itself. I don't want to sound like an apologist, but I can understand if that is how it comes across. I merely want to share my personal experiences. I really appreciate that I get the space for that on this forum!