longtimer60:

You said that RLC is a "'democractically' run church body" with a church board of elders.

But is the board of elders elected by the general assembly of church members?

Do the board of elders serve fixed terms according to the church bylaws and then stand for election regarding each subsequent term to be served?

DeJaVu-

I hate to rain on anyones parade....but....sarcasm ALWAYS has a point...thats why its called sarcasm. Get the point? Perhaps not, so let me enlighten you. The posts serve the purpose, not to cast out subjective experience, but to illustrate the folly of the teachings that are taking place in RLC and other churches. If you want to expose a false teacher you dont do it by saying things like, "I was told by the Emporer that his new clothes would reveal the traitors in the kingdom." You expose the false teacher by pointing out the truth, "The emporer has no clothes."

The rather long posts (appologies to all those who have the attention span of a third grader) go to the crutch of the matter: They show the errors of the emporer's teaching. These posts are not meant to benefit you, DeJaVu, they are meant to give correct information to those who are doubtful of this forums purpose and focus. I do hope this helps to clear up the reason behind my posts and my sarcasm. By the way, is your apostle super?

TurningPointReject

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Guess Who
Elder Watch: Rohn Ritzema resigned, Ken Bollinger resigned as pastor.

This is interesting, I wish I knew more. If anyone has more details, I would be interested to hear.

Turningpointreject,

If you would have checked your PM before you repsonded the way you responded, you would have discovered an apology written from me sharing what I shared publicly. I should have done it privately. Maybe it is easier for you to speak harshly without exposing who you are. Anyhow, speak what you may or how you feel, but I will move on as to be of a more productive help for this thread.

-Ryan-

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TurningPointReject
DeJaVu-

I hate to rain on anyones parade....but....sarcasm ALWAYS has a point...thats why its called sarcasm. Get the point? Perhaps not, so let me enlighten you. The posts serve the purpose, not to cast out subjective experience, but to illustrate the folly of the teachings that are taking place in RLC and other churches. If you want to expose a false teacher you dont do it by saying things like, "I was told by the Emporer that his new clothes would reveal the traitors in the kingdom." You expose the false teacher by pointing out the truth, "The emporer has no clothes."

The rather long posts (appologies to all those who have the attention span of a third grader) go to the crutch of the matter: They show the errors of the emporer's teaching. These posts are not meant to benefit you, DeJaVu, they are meant to give correct information to those who are doubtful of this forums purpose and focus. I do hope this helps to clear up the reason behind my posts and my sarcasm. By the way, is your apostle super?

TurningPointReject

First off I want to say that Ryan did not ask you to stop providing people the oportunity to read the information you have been providing. He asked that instead that please simply provide a link to the articles along with a short explanation of what you are providing a link to. That is not a unreasonable request and I second it.

Secondly I am one who does believe that apostles, prophets, pastors, teachers are all current gifts in the church that are active. However I do not believe the are titles, offices, or positions and I beleieve they never have been. Without going into a lot of detail I will simply say that I believe they are functions within the body and I beleive they are to operate within the Ecclesia different then most of us have been taught or have seen.

On the subject of leadership I submit a link an article that I original found on Martin Scotts website
Click Here

Secondly on the topic of Apostles I submit a links to a blog entries from robbymac.org:

Click Here First

Click Here Second

Click Here Third



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/30/2008 12:04AM by TomWilson.

Hey Nicole,
I will try and find out. I am curious as well. I will keep you posted.

-Ryan-

Tom,
That article by Martin Scott is amazing! Thank you so much for providing that information. It was very encouraging as well as enlightening. It also solidified much of why I think the way I do and feel the way I do about todays modern "Christianity".

Thanks bro,
Ryan

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Deja Vu
Tom,
That article by Martin Scott is amazing! Thank you so much for providing that information. It was very encouraging as well as enlightening. It also solidified much of why I think the way I do and feel the way I do about todays modern "Christianity".

Thanks bro,
Ryan

You are welcome Bro. What did you think about the other three? Also I orginally found the ariticle on Martin Scotts site however it is written by Len Hjalmarson. Len is a very prolific writer and has many relivant things to say on many topics. His blog address is [www.nextreformation.com]

I have also got my blog up and I have posted a long series about my 30 years of experience in Institutional Religion and the road I am on now and why. Including I beleive more details about my experience at RLC. However I have to warn anyone who choses to read it it is quite long however I have written it as 5 seperate blog entries to hopefully, help easier to read. I am also in the process of revising parts to help it a better read.

If anyone is interested the web address is www.religionfreejesus.com



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 10/30/2008 12:35AM by TomWilson.

Hey DeJaVu:

I did check my PM (AFTER responding to your post-my bad) and tried responding back but your box is full. I appologize for the harshness of my response. My bad. After all I do not want to detract from the value and purpose of this forum. I will in future posts provide links rather than the long cut and pastes.

And I did want you to know that I didnt aim my remark about third grade attention spans at you. It is a sincere apology to those, like myself, who have a difficult time focusing. After all, those were some LONGGGGGG posts.

I will send my PM response to your PM via gmail.

Tom Wilson- I agree with you regarding the FUNCTION of apostles, etc. These functions have been elevated at RLC and in other churches to that of OFFICE and ROLE not for the sake of the Gospel but for the purpose of control and manipulation. It is important to point out the false teachings of those who have ELEVATED themselves or allow others to ELEVATE them to the POSITION of Super Apostle. There is a need to show those observers of this forum the errors of RLC's teachings on Covering, Spiritual Parenting, Covenant Relationships etc not only through our stories of experience (they are important) but also in the light of Truth.

Many observers of this forum can easily come to the conclusion that we are just a bunch of goofballs running around grinding axes when we fail to balance our stories of experience with the Truth of scripture and sound apologetics that point out the flaws in the teaching they are hearing during "inner circle" settings with their Super Apostle. Why is this? Because Jesus modeled it for us when he was in the desert and confronted by the devil. When the devil sought to deceive Jesus with "half truth" Jesus defeated the devil with the full Truth of scripture (see Matthew 4:1-11; Mark 1:12-13; Luke 4:1-13). Our experience is subjective. Scripture is truth and in the light of Truth false teaching has a way of shriveling up and losing its hold on the weak minded.

Hey Tom,

Have you checked out any of the writings by Frank Viola? I think he might resonate with you. I find him to be articulate, thoughtful and compassionate in his writings.