This is the United States and the VERY Christian Founding Fathers of this nation did include in the Bill of Rights attached to our Constitution the right of freedom of speech. The Supreme Court has included the visual media not yet invented into the protected communications under the First Amendment, so AvenPhoenix and Mville4 are legally entitled to make their parodies. I am quite sure there are those who think they are funny and laugh hysterically at them.

I am sure AvenPhoeniz and Mville4 will enjoy making them until a smart lawyer finds a judge who will say they crossed some line. However, I think I would be more afraid of our Father in Heaven than any lawyer or judge. Lawyers and Judges will just cost them money -- lots and lots of money. Our Father in Heaven, well, he can do a whole lot more than just take every penny they have and ever hope to have.

You do have a right to make and promote your parodies, but in doing so you hurt the chances that any of us might have in getting TPC leadership to take some of us seriously enough to get a forum where we can confront them in love which is what our Heavenly Father wants us to do.

Daughter of Dorcas

There is no line to cross, Daughter of Dorcas, for several reasons. Not only is there the first amendment with directly protects me, but Mike is a public figure, opening him up to even more scrutiny, and I put satire at the top of everyone of my videos. And even then, if all that magically goes away my video would just be taken down by YouTube and that would end any potential issues. I wouldn't even need a lawyer or have to spend a dime on the defense in even the worst case senerio because the issue would be laughed out of court. And if not I'd easily win and the cost would not go to me anyways. But you have the right to fantasize about us getting in legal trouble all you like.

As for Father in Heaven, well, I believe that if there is a God, and if he is worth worshipping, he he'd be a good God. And I cannot imagine a God who who severly punishing me for fighting against the progressions of a cult.

If you believe in a God who would punish me for practicing my natural rights, then your God sounds like a terrible God and I would want nothing to do with him anyways, let alone worship him. Fortunatly you cannot speak on behalf, so I have nothing to be afraid of when you try to aver that he's angry at me for doing something you don't personally like. I adise you think more carefully before you try to speak on behalf of God again. I also cannot speak for God but I can say that any just God certainly wouldn't apreciate someone throwing around his name in a method to indirectly threaten someone. I will not stop making videos or exercising my right to free speach just because Daughter of Dorcas says her God will severly punish me for it. That's shamelessly absurd, and I would hate for people to mistake that as what your Christianity is all about.

Furthermore, you stated I am taking away any chance that you might have in getting TPC leadership to take you seriously to get a forum. Do you have any reasoning behind that, or is that just another attempt at demean me? Why would Mike associate my videos with you, or any of you?

Here's the bottom line, Mike is not a man of love and he does not care about opening a forum with you and embracing you with loving arms. And he never will. He is a man of secret memos, silencing, fundraising and recruitment, authoritarian ranks, and power. You can hear it in his voice. You can see it in his eyes. He's working for toward a full blown cult. And this is knowable by looking at his past with Tony Cunningham, who I was told took 50,000 american dollars to start an orphanage and bought his son a porche. His daughter, nothing. Tony doesn't like women munch and allegedly doesn't let his wife speak in public. BUT Mike refers to Tony as his spirtual authority. Sound like he's ready for an open forum of love to you?

Finally, you said "very Christian founding fathers."
You know your historically wrong, right?

There are LETTERS between Thomas Jefferson and Benjamin Franklin making fun of Christianity. Franklin even called it unintelletual in his autobiography. WHo told you they were Christians? Because they lied.

The founding fathers were primarily deists, which is closer to atheism than it is anything else. Others, like Thomas Paine, author of "Common Sense," was directly an atheist.

Those are historical facts.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/27/2009 09:16AM by AvenPhoenix.

Moderator, I do not find it reasonable that someone like Gods Warrior gets booted from this site for asking simple and relevant questions. While at the the same time someone like AvenPhoenix is allowed to come on a board entitled, "Turning Point- Tell your story" to promote his privately made videos. Not once have I seen AvenPhoenix discuss the issues or tell his story.

From my understanding this board is not intended to be a free bulletin board for self-promotion. It is a place where sincere and hurting Christians are coming to find healing through sharing their struggles, trials and testimonies. Please do not be biased.

Painfuljourney:

I came here offering my videos in a sincere way.
I have discussed my story and stories on many occations.
My story is brought up in my videos.
How is it possible that you have not heard any of my stories?

You are bias against me for an unknown reason and are asserting things about me on this board that are not true.

How many times did I bring up the time a church member entered my place of work to threaten me for my videos?
Does that not count as a story to you, Painfuljourney? Who made you moderator?
Do I have to wait until I get stabbed before you'll consider my stories, Painfuljourney?

In one of my later videos I even refrense egging cars and hitting mail boxes, which is what happenes everynight after I upload a new video.

These are stories related to Turning Point.

I came to his forum offering them in good spirit and I have people like you with some sort of personal bias against me and mine, and Daughter, who likes to threaten me with her God.

If you don't like my story or stories say so, but do not pretend they don't exist just because you don't want them to.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/27/2009 10:56AM by AvenPhoenix.

Quote
Daughter of Dorcas
I am sure AvenPhoeniz and Mville4 will enjoy making them until a smart lawyer finds a judge who will say they crossed some line. However, I think I would be more afraid of our Father in Heaven than any lawyer or judge. Lawyers and Judges will just cost them money -- lots and lots of money. Our Father in Heaven, well, he can do a whole lot more than just take every penny they have and ever hope to have.

Daughter of Dorcas

Does the term "Fear and intimidation" ring a bell? This kind of tirade is what get's people kicked off.

I do not post my videos here, I post a link! Click it or don't. It is totally up to you. I could just as easily say that liks to sermons is self promotion too.

If I have an opinion of the church I give it. If you have an opinion about the church, Daughter of Dorcas, state it but don't come on here and attempt to judge me. It's offensive. If the church doesn't like the videos or my message let them come here and address it. Not once did you say what you disagree with in my videos, not once. Try some open communication next time.

Painfuljourney
Empty out your mail box

TPWOC get ready Pastor Mike is back from Hawaii and I am sure he enjoyed the Dr. Increase conference! Now that Pastor Cyndi has awakened the warriors we can now have are marriages awakened at the awaken love marriage conference this weekend! I am going to be so awake I won't be able to sleep!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/27/2009 12:38PM by buddy.

Mville04

In no way was I trying to make you afraid or intimidate you. I was merely reacting to what I had just viewed on your video. I watched yours just before the post and like the person who posted the scripture just ahead of my post, I was shocked, hurt, and gravely offended because your video did not attack just the Pastors of TPC it attacked my God on a forum for those who had attended or are attending TPC and been hurt to tell their stories and support each other in the healing process.

I don't know you, have never met you, and have no reason to want to after seeing your video today. You were making fun of my savior the Lord Jesus Christ and Father God in Heaven. Whether you intended to make fun of Jesus or Father God, I do not know, But by making that video you were mocking God. Just the way that the leadership of TPC mocks him:

“God is mocked when Christians work in areas of ministry and assume professions that are not sanctioned by God. They profess a "calling" on their life and give themselves a title: bishop, apostle, prophet, pastor, evangelist and the like, when the truth is they're self-appointed, glory-seekers with hidden agendas.

God is mocked when Christians set aside God's principles and make up their own standards to satisfy their own flesh and lustful desires. And if that's not enough, they use God's Word to justify their disobedience. They make excuses to continue practicing committing sin.”

This is from a Spirit of Mockery I and II by Queen E. F. Phillips at the Majestic Publication website -- [www.majesticpublications.com].

I dont know if you and Phoenix are believers or non-believers, but attacking the Lord and Savior of hurting people is not the way. It certainly isn't funny. It is hurtful and mean spirited. It is the same as rubbing salt or pouring alchohol in an open wound. If you want to make those videos, make those videos, just please do not advertise them here.

Daughter of Dorcas

Does any one have a copy of Mikes Sex talk sermon "sExperts" I was looking for an MP3 copy of it
if you have it PM me

D of D and Painfuljourney please keep your very petty disagreements out of here and pm Aven and mville if you need to. If you hadnt of come in on the late show and thouroughly checked out where aven and mville are coming from you prob wouldnt be questioning them. Aven has spoke about his story with turning point. He has told about being bullied when speaking out about the cult nature of the church. He has spoke about experiences with tp mentors at the schools. So come on and just let this forum develop. Please give people the freedom to come here and express whatever it is they need to express. This is not a lets kiss TP's butt forum. If they dont like something they can pass it over or not come here. But i can guarentee that wont happen. They will keep coming no matter what because deep down inside they know something is wrong. And also before you start talking god and politics make sure you know what you are talking about. I am with Aven on that one. Just another great heresy of the church. I believe Avens video's serve a purpose (u have been taught and programmed everything happens for a reason) in showing how utterly ridiculous, in a saturday nite live kinda way, mike villamor and turning point have become. Just like the church makes dozens of videos and worship songs, Aven has a right to use the same creative media to try to get his point across. d of D you seem to be a hysterical type person. Maybe you need to think outside the box and wonder if Aven is mocking the type of god that Mike is promoting and worshiping. I would mock that god too. Seems like your preaching has no room for openness and grace. You r the judge. Rock on Aven and mville. I may not like all your videos but I certainly see that you guys have a firm grasp on how wrong mike and the church are. I dont care if u r atheist, communist, mormon or whatever. It doesnt just take a christian to see and know what is scripturally and morally wrong. Aven and mville, you guys have nailed it in a hilarious way..........sometimes corny but funny and on point. Your posts should not have to go through the filter of D of D and painfuljourney. Please keep these discussions in pms in order to keep info on this forum going. Your videos tell your story about turning point. It doesn"t take monkey brains to see that.