sorry to double post, but its not the fact that most of them haven't done college

its because many of the users (such as I was) were still in high school or younger


but either way, both extremely well educated people and un-educated people can be fooled by these kind of things

I don't think intellect and education always plays a big role in this


And I posted the message about the apricot cleanser to remind myself that there is more to life than constantly worrying, analyzing, and obsessing about problems that we cannot control. (I was worried people would think it is spam). Or maybe I worry too much...

I think the matter of education with this group is a little complicated. In no way shape or form is it true that only uneducated get stuck in cults, however the way you get into a dangerous group and the roll you may plan is largely determined by your education level.

Many members of The Gnostic Movement attempt to seem to think of themselves has having experienced academia but rejected it as an invalid or at least less valuable form of learning. This report shows that that believe is not representative of the organization. The Gnostic Movement attempts to give an image of a group of educated people, from my experience those educated people are choosing to have a much simpler worldview than they would get from honestly studying the way the world works.

In relations to this matter I have come to a better understanding of what they are trying to describe when they speak of the word awareness. I believe they are speaking of a believe you can achieve a state of logic and rational objective learning without actually doing any scientific study or research but rather by simply quieting your mind and allowing your intuition to do the work. Of course this is a very subjective experience and that is why so much effort is needed to correct students mistakes from what they have learned. This understanding came to be from studying (which I am just starting to do) the ancient Hermetica or Hermetic writings, essentially to that way of thinking is balance between intuition, faith and rational learning.

I am on to something with this but this is the best that I can explain what I have realized.

If anyone out there who is concerned about the Gnostic Movement has had their worries silenced by the statement that the Gnostic Movement and Belzebuub are independent, be aware that it is absolute bullshit. There was no mention or even implication of this supposed independence when I first became involved with them a year ago. The organization was set up to spread Mark Pritchards teaching. How can that organization be independent all over teachers are believed to be corruptions set up by supposed negative beings to trick people away from what Mark Pritchard aka Belzebuub? How can an organization be independent when they can not make choices for themselves? Would the board ever think of dropping the teachings of Pritchard or tell him to get a real job and stopping paying for his living? Would they ever consider having accountability of their finances, particularly what services have been provided by the Pritchards for the funds that have been send their way? On a related what funds have been send their way? Under these matters can be address there is no independence.

On a related much more personal matter, Where is Jordan? I took him to be a honest man so when he said he came on this website to correct my supposed lies and errors I was sure he was sincere. Apparently I was wrong he was just here to try to guilt me and intimidate me to stop insulting his master. You will notice that I have never said anything about him or even specifically about how he runs his centre on this site. But still he took it personally what I had to say about what his master has to say.

Hi All

i actually joined this forum specifically to comment on the belzebuub/samael cult thing

i stumbled across it at gnosticweb.com

i was looking for a discussion forum to talk about religious symbolism and metaphor and as it said "gnostic" in the page title i was imagining they would be like freke and gandy or harpur etc all of whom i quite enjoy

the vibe there seemed ok people helpful and such, the board was a bit quiet but i pitched tent and started posting completely oblivious to the fact i had wandered in to a samael/belzebuub thing

of course i soon heard a few "alarm bells"

1. people kept repeating over and over again in posts "you should do a course" and i've always been sceptical of things where you dont just "say it now" besides i'm busy with work (night shift) etc and well i just think courses are silly, i read a lot and much prefer to get it straight from the horses mouth so to speak, i mainly wanted to chat about esoteric symbolism and metaphor so as you can tell i wasn't a "course kind of guy" (horses for courses lol)

2. samael aun weor was mentioned a bit too, so i youtubed some vids of him, and he seemed like a raving loony to me, i couldnt make heads or tails of him so i checked out his books at the site a bit and more bells of alarm sounded

3. in the chatroom one morning i noticed some speech patterns that were worrying, there was the "we" as if "they" were some inferior race
and some evidence of what i call "carnal spirituality" where people are supposed to be oh so spiritual and yet they seem just as ego driven as anyone else

of course i also met some lovely people there

then i thought "i might go and have a look around" and do some research

i found this board and another where it all started to make sense

i had stumbled into a cult

they seemed to follow the old pattern of hiding the control stuff away and lure you in with sugar and spice and then slowly bring you under control by playing subtle mind games

also i read a bit from a book called "new era, new religions" by andrew dawson which had an excellent unbiased rundown on the "movement" starting towards the end of chapter two

anyways i could rattle on but i just wanted to say a bit about my little excursion into cult land and say how insidious i thought it was

the danger also seemed that people who are interested in things like astral travel and oobe etc might be attracted in not knowing what they are really all about because they keep it hidden away

the whole "dont spill semen" thing just puzzled the heck out of me

i never thought anyone would go for a mixture of spirituality and non ejaculatary sex, but i suppose there is no end to the whacky things people will get messed up in

i'm glad i was able to backpedal out of there pronto

but i think they could really be doing some damage preying on more vulnerable types

i wouldn't be surprised to hear about them in the news soon with some sort of sad tragedy occuring as people get drawn into the hidden control stuff

anyway i'm glad this site and this thread were here as i think it's a valuable rescource

thanks to all contributors

t

an interesting development

at gnostic web i noticed they removed the thread where i was giving my reservations about the non ejacultory sex stuff and asking directly if it was taught in the courses

they deleted the whole thread

completely removed it

thus stopping anyone from deciding for themselves if that was something they agreed or disagreed with

i think a lot of people at the site didn't even realise that was part of the deal so to speak

i smell a cult

so i noticed i hadnt yet been banned from belzebuubs forum so i posted up there

i will be interested to see if they delete it there as well

they seem not to like there non ejaculatory sex doctrine brought into view so to speak

lack of openess seems to me an indicator of something not right there

i think they might be into controlling people

sigh, wouldn't it be great if people would stop trying to exercise control over one another and just try and help and enjoy each others happiness without outlawing ejaculation

Hi Thistle thanks for your kind words. Have you had a chance to look at any of the works of Carl Jung? I think his work really helps to show what is talked about by the "Gnostic Movement" Is utter and complete nonsense.

hi notanantiGnostic

i only have a slight familiarity with Jungs work but i should have a bit more of a look

i watched a few vids on youtube and enjoyed his thoughts a lot

also i believe he was into myth and symbols, metaphors etc which is very much what floats my boat

i think belzebuub and co. are "pirating" the word "gnostic" to garner a sort of credibility when in fact as you suggest they are not really gnostic at all but more into control and drawing people into their movement

"gnostic master belzebuub" certainly sounds more impressive than "mark pritchard non-ejaculator"

i think a similar thing happened when the eastern religion thing was in vogue people could add the word swami to their schtick and get away with murder

jesus seems to be another favourite to hi-jack to make it easier to suck in people with a christian background

certainly it was their use of the word gnostic that had me off guard, same with victor rodriguez, he wasn't gnostic at all as far as i can see but rather just regurgitating a bunch of undigested esoteric type stuff as a blind for his "ooooh, i'm a master and you're not" complex


some of it reminds me of people who used to whip themselves saying it was putting down the flesh when in fact it was pandering to the ego by making a big deal out of denying it, kind of thing

what annoys me is the way that they dont seem to just share with people but focus on bringing them into the movement

i think we have seen enough movements to last a millenia

what we need is people sharing directly and openly with one another and respecting each others right to think and exist without joining a movement or group

i feel really bad for unstable souls who wander in and get taken advantage of

still there did seem to a few nice folk there so maybe in time it will all come out (no pun intended)

more power to the truth seekers everywhere and a pox on those who prey on the vulnerable because they are too lazy to get a job and be just another slob on the bus trying to make his way home so to speak

ciao

t

interesting

it seems they dont like the light being shone on their "non ejaculatory" injunctions

now at belzebuubs forum the same technique of "ban the user" "delete the thread"

no warning, no discussion

they flat out do not want their "dont spill the semen" nonsense to be viewable by potential adherents

i think this whole samael/belzebuub movement is trouble

i personally once spent 20 years in a doctrinal prison

i was taught truths lies and half truths and misinterpretations which cost me the best years of my life so to speak

when i finally grew up enough to put out my abusers i was both excited to be out of that abusive mindset and sad that so much good time had been wasted and so many opportunities missed and so much damage had been done to me and through me to others

it's a serious business this preying on those who are genuinely seeking by tapping into their lower side so to speak rather than encouraging them to think for themselves and discover all the things they are

i hope those who push this pseudo gnostic clap trap get what they deserve whatever that might be

t

Hi Thistle if you feel like it and you are able you should repost your comments and questions that they deleted on this page.

I hope you get a chance to look at Carl Jung, I think a good place to start his Man and His symbols or his autobiography: Memories, Dreams, Reflections. Also it would seem to be good to read Joseph Campbell. At some point I would also like to look into the sources used by Tom Harpur in the Pagan Christ particularly Kuhn and Massey. These academics who write on spirituality are great because they talk about objective truth and you can find your own meaning an believe from it. Not the problems of traditional religion and not the new age either.

Also I have been researching scientists who have no problem with spirituality and actually enhance it such as Einstein. Along with esoteric or mystic writers there are a number of scientific writers that I think help one find the truth for themselves.

I don't know if you experienced this but when I was involved with the Gnostic Movement they had an expression of any ancient spirituality as being valuable. According to them all religions were good originally and had true spirituality but they became currupted. This is strange as they only seem to promote those writings that they are prepared to spin to give the impression that it supports their believes, such as the Bible (some more parts than others) The Nag Hammadi collection (again not encouraging certain parts), The Dharmapadda (writings of Buddha) and the Bhagavad Gita. However they mostly ignore some of the most esoteric writings out there that will strangethen the fact that you don't need an organization to be spiritual (of course if you chose it there is not wrong with it either). Among those writings I would include the Tao Te Ching and the Hermetica which for me shows that what they are teaching is adding levels of attachment not taking them away, particularly in the promoting of the astral body as being equivalent to a physical body. Another good source is the Egyptian book of the Dead which helps to show how must of their interpretations of esoteric symbols are completely off. Really strange that they would not want to pay more attention to these writings considering their antiquity, most of them would probably not understand any of it anyways.

It is strange that they attempt to find a symbolic of metaphoric meaning for the events of the new testament but still wish to believe they actually happened. Like I said before a sick mix of theosophy and fundamentalist Christianity.

I forgot to mention last time in my list of ancient writing the Upanishads, which are considered by many to be the most esoteric writings in Hinduism. The Gnostic Movement likely avoids them because they give such a holistic organic understanding of reality. It could also be said that they make esoteric ideas more accessible because they are just straight teachings, unlike the Bhagavad Gita which uses as lot of story to tell the message. Both are extremely valuable but it is strange the Upanishads would not be a priority, perhaps it is under the spread the Upanishads message.

It is quite possible that the Upanishad, the Hermetica and the Tao Te Ching are the most esoteric writings in the world .